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I used to work for a startup founded by a few Brits. We had engineers in London, but no sales people, because of the culture. I was much easier to sell to Walma

I used to work for a startup founded by a few Brits. We had engineers in London, but no sales people, because of the culture. I was much easier to sell to Walmart than Tesco.

busterarm 5y ago
That's funny. I work at a public B2B tech company whose primary customers are in the retail space. Our main sales office for EMEA is in London and they're absolutely crushing it and always have been. They habitually convert more of their (albeit smaller) pipeline than North America does. Literally some of our best sales people are there in London. Sure there's some satellites in France and Germany because locals prefer locals, but Brexit hasn't changed a damn thing for us.
Quarrelsome 5y ago
like the author we're light on details beyond "the culture", "bad at sales". What does this _mean_ exactly?
- ed_balls 5y ago
  slower sales cycles, more risk-averse.
- hogFeast 5y ago
  It is everything. Customers too risk-averse, class boundaries still endemic (it is amazing the US tech companies went into this, Google/Facebook/etc. seem to have hired the Notting Hill set as soon as they came to London), companies too conservative about investing margin in sales, very relationship-driven sales culture (as opposed to product-driven) that is closed to "outsiders", reluctance to cold-call, etc. It is cultural because it can be anything else, do people from the UK have a different biology? No. I think if you look at politics in the UK, it is self-evident that the culture of the UK is not exactly entrepreneurial...unless you believe that a group of probably 30-50 people who went to the same school, went to the same university and largely studied the same course should rule the country...it is very weird.
  - JProthero 5y ago
    'I think if you look at politics in the UK, it is self-evident that the culture of the UK is not exactly entrepreneurial...unless you believe that a group of probably 30-50 people who went to the same school, went to the same university and largely studied the same course should rule the country...it is very weird.' My impression is that the UK and US are fairly similar in this respect. The leadership of the political and administrative class in both countries is dominated by graduates of a small number of institutions who took similar courses. In the UK it's primarily Oxford and Cambridge, and in the US it's Harvard, Yale and some other Ivy League colleges. There is a analogous pattern in many other countries. Below is a list of all the national elections contested in the US and UK in the postwar period, noting the subject or subjects studied by the two leading candidates for head of government, along with the higher education institutions they attended: USA 2020 Biden (Delaware/Syracuse, Law) v. Trump (Wharton, Economics) 2016 Trump (Wharton, Economics) v. H. Clinton (Wellesley/Yale, Politics/Law) 2012 Obama (Columbia/Harvard, Politics/Law) v. Romney (Brigham Young/Harvard, English/Law) 2008 Obama (Columbia/Harvard, Politics/Law) v. McCain (US Naval Academy) 2004 G. W. Bush (Yale/Harvard, History/Business) v. Kerry (Yale/Boston, Politics/Law) 2000 G. W. Bush (Yale/Harvard, History/Business) v. Gore (Harvard, Government) 1996 B. Clinton (Georgetown/Oxford/Yale, Foreign Service/PPE/Law) v. Dole (Washburn, Law) 1992 B. Clinton (Georgetown/Oxford/Yale, Foreign Service/PPE/Law) v. G. H. W. Bush (Yale, Economics) 1988 G. H. W. Bush (Yale, Economics) v. Dukakis (Swarthmore/Harvard, Politics/Law) 1984 Reagan (Eureka, Economics) v. Mondale (Minnesota, Politics) 1980 Reagan (Eureka, Economics) v. Carter (US Naval Academy) 1976 Carter (US Naval Academy) v. Ford (Michigan/Yale, Economics/Law) 1972 Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) v. McGovern (Dakota Wesleyan/Northwestern, History) 1968 Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) v. Humphrey (Minnesota/Louisiana State, Politics) 1964 Johnson (Texas State/Georgetown, Politics/Law) v. Goldwater (None) 1960 Kennedy (Harvard, Government) v. Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) 1956 Eisenhower (West Point) v. Stevenson (Princeton/Harvard/Northwestern, History/Law) 1952 Eisenhower (West Point) v. Stevenson (Princeton/Harvard/Northwestern, History/Law) 1948 Truman (None) v. Dewey (Michigan/Columbia, Law) UK 2019 Johnson (Oxford, Classics) v. Corbyn (None) 2017 May (Oxford, Geography) v. Corbyn (None) 2015 Cameron (Oxford, PPE) v. Miliband (Oxford/LSE, PPE/Economics) 2010 Cameron (Oxford, PPE) v. Brown (Edinburgh, History) 2005 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Howard (Cambridge, Law) 2001 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Hague (Oxford, PPE) 1997 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Major (None) 1992 Major (None) v. Kinnock (Cardiff, Industrial Relations) 1987 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Kinnock (Cardiff, Industrial Relations) 1983 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Foot (Oxford, PPE) 1979 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Callaghan (None) 1974 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Heath (Oxford, PPE) 1974 Heath (Oxford, PPE) v. Wilson (Oxford, PPE) 1970 Heath (Oxford, PPE) v. Wilson (Oxford, PPE) 1966 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Heath (Oxford, PPE) 1964 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Douglas Home (Oxford, History) 1959 Macmillan (Oxford, Classics) v. Gaitskell (Oxford, PPE) 1955 Eden (Oxford, Oriental Languages) v. Attlee (Oxford, History) 1951 Churchill (Sandhurst) v. Attlee (Oxford, History) 1950 Attlee (Oxford, History) v. Churchill (Sandhurst) 1945 Attlee (Oxford, History) v. Churchill (Sandhurst) Sandhurst is essentially equivalent to West Point. What is particularly notable about the UK is the number of Prime Ministers who were educated at Oxford: in the postwar period, all but two graduated from one of Oxford's various colleges. This probably has more to do with Oxford than the UK as a whole: in terms of prestige, academic success and establishment influence, Oxford and Cambridge are more or less identical, yet Cambridge clearly has a problem with producing Prime Ministers. The US has a little more diversity in the academic institutions that educate its presidents, but that perhaps isn't surprising given it has about five times the population and about forty times the geographic area. A small number of institutions still dominate. There is a little less diversity in the US in terms of the courses taken: all but three postwar US presidents have been law, politics, economics or history graduates. Of those who weren't, two were graduates of national armed forces academies, and one (Truman) had no degree. On the UK side there are graduates in chemistry, geography and languages, but law, politics, economics and history still dominate just as they do in the US (classics — which Johnson and Macmillan studied — is a combination of ancient history, languages (Greek and Latin), literature and philosophy).

I used to work for a startup founded by a few Brits. We had engineers in London, but no sales people, because of the culture. I was much easier to sell to Walmart than Tesco.

busterarm 5y ago

That's funny. I work at a public B2B tech company whose primary customers are in the retail space. Our main sales office for EMEA is in London and they're absolutely crushing it and always have been. They habitually convert more of their (albeit smaller) pipeline than North America does. Literally some of our best sales people are there in London. Sure there's some satellites in France and Germany because locals prefer locals, but Brexit hasn't changed a damn thing for us.

Quarrelsome 5y ago

like the author we're light on details beyond "the culture", "bad at sales". What does this _mean_ exactly?

ed_balls 5y ago
slower sales cycles, more risk-averse.
hogFeast 5y ago
It is everything. Customers too risk-averse, class boundaries still endemic (it is amazing the US tech companies went into this, Google/Facebook/etc. seem to have hired the Notting Hill set as soon as they came to London), companies too conservative about investing margin in sales, very relationship-driven sales culture (as opposed to product-driven) that is closed to "outsiders", reluctance to cold-call, etc. It is cultural because it can be anything else, do people from the UK have a different biology? No. I think if you look at politics in the UK, it is self-evident that the culture of the UK is not exactly entrepreneurial...unless you believe that a group of probably 30-50 people who went to the same school, went to the same university and largely studied the same course should rule the country...it is very weird.
- JProthero 5y ago
  'I think if you look at politics in the UK, it is self-evident that the culture of the UK is not exactly entrepreneurial...unless you believe that a group of probably 30-50 people who went to the same school, went to the same university and largely studied the same course should rule the country...it is very weird.' My impression is that the UK and US are fairly similar in this respect. The leadership of the political and administrative class in both countries is dominated by graduates of a small number of institutions who took similar courses. In the UK it's primarily Oxford and Cambridge, and in the US it's Harvard, Yale and some other Ivy League colleges. There is a analogous pattern in many other countries. Below is a list of all the national elections contested in the US and UK in the postwar period, noting the subject or subjects studied by the two leading candidates for head of government, along with the higher education institutions they attended: USA 2020 Biden (Delaware/Syracuse, Law) v. Trump (Wharton, Economics) 2016 Trump (Wharton, Economics) v. H. Clinton (Wellesley/Yale, Politics/Law) 2012 Obama (Columbia/Harvard, Politics/Law) v. Romney (Brigham Young/Harvard, English/Law) 2008 Obama (Columbia/Harvard, Politics/Law) v. McCain (US Naval Academy) 2004 G. W. Bush (Yale/Harvard, History/Business) v. Kerry (Yale/Boston, Politics/Law) 2000 G. W. Bush (Yale/Harvard, History/Business) v. Gore (Harvard, Government) 1996 B. Clinton (Georgetown/Oxford/Yale, Foreign Service/PPE/Law) v. Dole (Washburn, Law) 1992 B. Clinton (Georgetown/Oxford/Yale, Foreign Service/PPE/Law) v. G. H. W. Bush (Yale, Economics) 1988 G. H. W. Bush (Yale, Economics) v. Dukakis (Swarthmore/Harvard, Politics/Law) 1984 Reagan (Eureka, Economics) v. Mondale (Minnesota, Politics) 1980 Reagan (Eureka, Economics) v. Carter (US Naval Academy) 1976 Carter (US Naval Academy) v. Ford (Michigan/Yale, Economics/Law) 1972 Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) v. McGovern (Dakota Wesleyan/Northwestern, History) 1968 Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) v. Humphrey (Minnesota/Louisiana State, Politics) 1964 Johnson (Texas State/Georgetown, Politics/Law) v. Goldwater (None) 1960 Kennedy (Harvard, Government) v. Nixon (Whittier/Duke, History/Law) 1956 Eisenhower (West Point) v. Stevenson (Princeton/Harvard/Northwestern, History/Law) 1952 Eisenhower (West Point) v. Stevenson (Princeton/Harvard/Northwestern, History/Law) 1948 Truman (None) v. Dewey (Michigan/Columbia, Law) UK 2019 Johnson (Oxford, Classics) v. Corbyn (None) 2017 May (Oxford, Geography) v. Corbyn (None) 2015 Cameron (Oxford, PPE) v. Miliband (Oxford/LSE, PPE/Economics) 2010 Cameron (Oxford, PPE) v. Brown (Edinburgh, History) 2005 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Howard (Cambridge, Law) 2001 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Hague (Oxford, PPE) 1997 Blair (Oxford, Law) v. Major (None) 1992 Major (None) v. Kinnock (Cardiff, Industrial Relations) 1987 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Kinnock (Cardiff, Industrial Relations) 1983 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Foot (Oxford, PPE) 1979 Thatcher (Oxford, Chemistry) v. Callaghan (None) 1974 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Heath (Oxford, PPE) 1974 Heath (Oxford, PPE) v. Wilson (Oxford, PPE) 1970 Heath (Oxford, PPE) v. Wilson (Oxford, PPE) 1966 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Heath (Oxford, PPE) 1964 Wilson (Oxford, PPE) v. Douglas Home (Oxford, History) 1959 Macmillan (Oxford, Classics) v. Gaitskell (Oxford, PPE) 1955 Eden (Oxford, Oriental Languages) v. Attlee (Oxford, History) 1951 Churchill (Sandhurst) v. Attlee (Oxford, History) 1950 Attlee (Oxford, History) v. Churchill (Sandhurst) 1945 Attlee (Oxford, History) v. Churchill (Sandhurst) Sandhurst is essentially equivalent to West Point. What is particularly notable about the UK is the number of Prime Ministers who were educated at Oxford: in the postwar period, all but two graduated from one of Oxford's various colleges. This probably has more to do with Oxford than the UK as a whole: in terms of prestige, academic success and establishment influence, Oxford and Cambridge are more or less identical, yet Cambridge clearly has a problem with producing Prime Ministers. The US has a little more diversity in the academic institutions that educate its presidents, but that perhaps isn't surprising given it has about five times the population and about forty times the geographic area. A small number of institutions still dominate. There is a little less diversity in the US in terms of the courses taken: all but three postwar US presidents have been law, politics, economics or history graduates. Of those who weren't, two were graduates of national armed forces academies, and one (Truman) had no degree. On the UK side there are graduates in chemistry, geography and languages, but law, politics, economics and history still dominate just as they do in the US (classics — which Johnson and Macmillan studied — is a combination of ancient history, languages (Greek and Latin), literature and philosophy).