4 ms·

Here I'll give you a "real world hyperlink": print the damn URL in English so that I can remember it if I don't have my phone handy. If you're running a print

by pak 15y ago

Here I'll give you a "real world hyperlink": print the damn URL in English so that I can remember it if I don't have my phone handy. If you're running a print ad you can afford a short snappy URL. Bonus, I can even use it on my laptop that doesn't have a QR code app! Or any other browser for that matter! The main problem I have with QR codes is that humans can't read them. Therefore, they will be relegated forever to the sphere of computerish heiroglyphics that normal people will always ignore, because they have no obvious real world relevance. By way of contrast, most of the old EAN barcodes have the number printed under them, so a human can see what they encode when the barcode scanner breaks. QR codes, not so easy. As suggested by another commenter, decide on some way of making the URL easy to OCR, perhaps by surrounding it with targeting sentinels and using a standard font. I mean, if Google Goggles can OCR text on a menu or poster in real time... a QR code is just making things complicated. Also, let me tell you this really great joke: CueCat.

franze 15y ago
>Bonus, I can even use it on my laptop that doesn't have a QR code app! Or any other browser for that matter! hmmm, hmmm, well .. you actually can use QR codes from your laptop - and - any other browser (that supports flash, as the HTML5 webcam API is not yet ready) - i know this, as i created it myself - it's called http://miniqr.com/reader.php http://miniqr.com/reader.php (with some paid help from http://www.peterelst.com/ http://www.peterelst.com/) does it make sense? well, that's another topic.
- goorpy 15y ago
  Am I missing something? I don't see how that helps a user to parse a QR they come across in meatspace. Say, on a movie poster or fast food cup. If I'm on a website with a QR code... should that publisher not just use a plain old URL?
  - LeafStorm 15y ago
    One useful way to use QR codes on Web sites is for downloading mobile apps. Instead of copying the URL to your device, or searching through the Market/App Store, you can just scan the QR code from off the screen, and you're right at the app you need to download.
- keeperofdakeys 15y ago
  I personally would find it much easier to type in a url on my laptop. Using a laptops camera for a QR code is very awkward, you have to orientate it correctly when you can't see the screen, possibly have to hit a key at the same time.
masklinn 15y ago
> Here I'll give you a "real world hyperlink": print the damn URL in English so that I can remember it if I don't have my phone handy. Provide both then, because typing a URL is a pain on most mobiles, especially urls more than 5 characters. > If you're running a print ad you can afford a short snappy URL. What sense would it make? You have an existing brand and an existing site, why have to create a new brand and a new site just to link to that? > Therefore, they will be relegated forever to the sphere of computerish heiroglyphics that normal people will always ignore, because they have no obvious real world relevance. Japan and Korea demonstrate how absolutely incorrect you are. > By way of contrast, most of the old EAN barcodes have the number printed under them, so a human can see what they encode when the barcode scanner breaks. QR codes, not so easy. Wait that has no relevance whatsoever to the previous half of the paragraph, you said "normal people" would always ignore QRCodes, but anyone can recognize a barcode and knows (at least roughly) what it's about. QRCode will reach that ubiquity (as I mentioned, they already have in Japan and Korea for instance), and by that time children will only have to learn about them once. > I mean, if Google Goggles can OCR text on a menu or poster in real time... a QR code is just making things complicated. Google Goggles can attempt to do that with all the power of Google behind it. Just about any low-power device with a camera can recognize, read, fix (qrcode embeds significant amount of redundancy for error recovery) and decode a qrcode.
- donohoe 15y ago
  I can't speak for Korea, but QR code usage in Japan seems to be on the decline since 2009. I disagree with many of your rebuttal points but sadly am on my phone so canny properly argue why.
- pak 15y ago
  > Provide both then, because typing a URL is a pain on most mobiles, especially urls more than 5 characters. If people are already running up against 5000 SMS/month limits on their phones, I'd wager that they can spend 20 keypresses typing in a URL for something interesting. Frankly, it's probably the same cognitive load as finding the QR decoder app, lining up a good shot, waiting for the white balance and focus to settle, hitting the shutter button, ... > What sense would it make? You have an existing brand and an existing site, why have to create a new brand and a new site just to link to that? Don't understand your point. I'm talking about making a short URL redirecting to whatever the QR code points at, maybe even off the company's existing domain. E.g., http://acme.com/foo http://acme.com/foo I can't speak to QR code usage in Japan or Korea, I just remember seeing them used in CS course material at my college and none of my fellow students ever used them. Those were real geeks, and they weren't even interested enough to try. > Wait that has no relevance whatsoever to the previous half of the paragraph, you said "normal people" would always ignore QRCodes, but anyone can recognize a barcode and knows (at least roughly) what it's about. There's a distinction between recognition, and being able to use them. As far as recognition goes very few non-techy people know what a QR code even does, because there is no obvious indication that it contains a URL. My point was that barcodes usually have the numbers below them and that (IMO) facilitated both consumers and cashiers understanding that it just contains a product number, as opposed to being the Evil Mark of Satan that the red beam reads. It is a more transparent system. I know it seems weird, but for non-geeks, being able to see what is going on is an important step in not demonizing new technology. > Google Goggles can attempt to do that with all the power of Google behind it. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure all the OCR is done client-side. And what's your point? A QR code containing a URL requires a device with a network connection to provide anything of immediate value.
alinajaf 15y ago
While I agree that having a URL that you can read is better, I think 'relegated forever to the sphere of computerish heiroglyphics that normal people will always ignore' is a little strong. In Japan they've been using them for nigh on a decade and general 'non-technical' population are perfectly comfortable with them.
- code_duck 15y ago
  Domain names and paths are shocking heiroglyphics, but some weird square with static in it that means nothing at all to a human at first glance is comfy and familiar? I disagree.. I see a lot more URLs out there than QR codes, and just about anyone is okay with typing them in (albeit to google).
Natsu 15y ago
> As suggested by another commenter, decide on some way of making the URL easy to OCR, perhaps by surrounding it with targeting sentinels and using a standard font. It'd be a lot easier just to print the URL under the QR code, exactly the way people do for EAN barcodes.
ristretto 15y ago
You are actually right, this ancient technology is doomed to be superceded soon by OCR, but it's a fun thing for the moment. It's a fad, it's gonna make its circle. If there's advantage to their use it's the ability to be included, accidentally or not in photos and videos of people passing by.
code_duck 15y ago
CueCat certainly comes to mind. The difference, of course is that this hardware is akready wdespread, and portable. The idea of having that thing by your desktop computer to read codes vs. Urls you could type in was pretty lame. On the other hand, same deal with this - agreed I'd rather simply type in an address. Security wise, this is the ultimate URL obfuscation. I could go around sticking stickers over everyone elses QR codes to send you all to my virus/spam/phishing kingdom, right?

by pak 15y ago

franze 15y ago

>Bonus, I can even use it on my laptop that doesn't have a QR code app! Or any other browser for that matter! hmmm, hmmm, well .. you actually can use QR codes from your laptop - and - any other browser (that supports flash, as the HTML5 webcam API is not yet ready) - i know this, as i created it myself - it's called http://miniqr.com/reader.php http://miniqr.com/reader.php (with some paid help from http://www.peterelst.com/ http://www.peterelst.com/) does it make sense? well, that's another topic.

goorpy 15y ago
Am I missing something? I don't see how that helps a user to parse a QR they come across in meatspace. Say, on a movie poster or fast food cup. If I'm on a website with a QR code... should that publisher not just use a plain old URL?
- LeafStorm 15y ago
  One useful way to use QR codes on Web sites is for downloading mobile apps. Instead of copying the URL to your device, or searching through the Market/App Store, you can just scan the QR code from off the screen, and you're right at the app you need to download.
keeperofdakeys 15y ago
I personally would find it much easier to type in a url on my laptop. Using a laptops camera for a QR code is very awkward, you have to orientate it correctly when you can't see the screen, possibly have to hit a key at the same time.

masklinn 15y ago

> Here I'll give you a "real world hyperlink": print the damn URL in English so that I can remember it if I don't have my phone handy. Provide both then, because typing a URL is a pain on most mobiles, especially urls more than 5 characters. > If you're running a print ad you can afford a short snappy URL. What sense would it make? You have an existing brand and an existing site, why have to create a new brand and a new site just to link to that? > Therefore, they will be relegated forever to the sphere of computerish heiroglyphics that normal people will always ignore, because they have no obvious real world relevance. Japan and Korea demonstrate how absolutely incorrect you are. > By way of contrast, most of the old EAN barcodes have the number printed under them, so a human can see what they encode when the barcode scanner breaks. QR codes, not so easy. Wait that has no relevance whatsoever to the previous half of the paragraph, you said "normal people" would always ignore QRCodes, but anyone can recognize a barcode and knows (at least roughly) what it's about. QRCode will reach that ubiquity (as I mentioned, they already have in Japan and Korea for instance), and by that time children will only have to learn about them once. > I mean, if Google Goggles can OCR text on a menu or poster in real time... a QR code is just making things complicated. Google Goggles can attempt to do that with all the power of Google behind it. Just about any low-power device with a camera can recognize, read, fix (qrcode embeds significant amount of redundancy for error recovery) and decode a qrcode.

donohoe 15y ago
I can't speak for Korea, but QR code usage in Japan seems to be on the decline since 2009. I disagree with many of your rebuttal points but sadly am on my phone so canny properly argue why.
pak 15y ago
> Provide both then, because typing a URL is a pain on most mobiles, especially urls more than 5 characters. If people are already running up against 5000 SMS/month limits on their phones, I'd wager that they can spend 20 keypresses typing in a URL for something interesting. Frankly, it's probably the same cognitive load as finding the QR decoder app, lining up a good shot, waiting for the white balance and focus to settle, hitting the shutter button, ... > What sense would it make? You have an existing brand and an existing site, why have to create a new brand and a new site just to link to that? Don't understand your point. I'm talking about making a short URL redirecting to whatever the QR code points at, maybe even off the company's existing domain. E.g., http://acme.com/foo http://acme.com/foo I can't speak to QR code usage in Japan or Korea, I just remember seeing them used in CS course material at my college and none of my fellow students ever used them. Those were real geeks, and they weren't even interested enough to try. > Wait that has no relevance whatsoever to the previous half of the paragraph, you said "normal people" would always ignore QRCodes, but anyone can recognize a barcode and knows (at least roughly) what it's about. There's a distinction between recognition, and being able to use them. As far as recognition goes very few non-techy people know what a QR code even does, because there is no obvious indication that it contains a URL. My point was that barcodes usually have the numbers below them and that (IMO) facilitated both consumers and cashiers understanding that it just contains a product number, as opposed to being the Evil Mark of Satan that the red beam reads. It is a more transparent system. I know it seems weird, but for non-geeks, being able to see what is going on is an important step in not demonizing new technology. > Google Goggles can attempt to do that with all the power of Google behind it. I could be wrong, but I'm pretty sure all the OCR is done client-side. And what's your point? A QR code containing a URL requires a device with a network connection to provide anything of immediate value.

alinajaf 15y ago

While I agree that having a URL that you can read is better, I think 'relegated forever to the sphere of computerish heiroglyphics that normal people will always ignore' is a little strong. In Japan they've been using them for nigh on a decade and general 'non-technical' population are perfectly comfortable with them.

code_duck 15y ago
Domain names and paths are shocking heiroglyphics, but some weird square with static in it that means nothing at all to a human at first glance is comfy and familiar? I disagree.. I see a lot more URLs out there than QR codes, and just about anyone is okay with typing them in (albeit to google).

Natsu 15y ago

> As suggested by another commenter, decide on some way of making the URL easy to OCR, perhaps by surrounding it with targeting sentinels and using a standard font. It'd be a lot easier just to print the URL under the QR code, exactly the way people do for EAN barcodes.

ristretto 15y ago

You are actually right, this ancient technology is doomed to be superceded soon by OCR, but it's a fun thing for the moment. It's a fad, it's gonna make its circle. If there's advantage to their use it's the ability to be included, accidentally or not in photos and videos of people passing by.

code_duck 15y ago

CueCat certainly comes to mind. The difference, of course is that this hardware is akready wdespread, and portable. The idea of having that thing by your desktop computer to read codes vs. Urls you could type in was pretty lame. On the other hand, same deal with this - agreed I'd rather simply type in an address. Security wise, this is the ultimate URL obfuscation. I could go around sticking stickers over everyone elses QR codes to send you all to my virus/spam/phishing kingdom, right?