3 ms·

I think one of the points in the article is that the walls and moat are the main lines of defence. The castle is protected by the walls. If they breach the wal

by qw 5y ago

I think one of the points in the article is that the walls and moat are the main lines of defence. The castle is protected by the walls. If they breach the walls and actually enter the interior of the castle, they have already lost and no staircase design can save them.

rtkwe 5y ago
There were interior defenses though. In some of the more impressive castles there were concentric rings of walls so breeching on wouldn't surrender the whole castle. There were often also keeps. Even in early proto castles you had motte and bailey designs where the main walls defended the low ground (bailey) for an interior fort built on a hill or prominence (the motte). Castles weren't single layer defenses that stopped at the walls, they were definitely designed to continue the fight and protect the nobles even if the enemy did get through the walls. Given that it's not so out of line to think the interior architecture might have been designed to increase defender's advantages.
- timcederman 5y ago
  Do you have any examples of when this actually happened (a fight "continued, to protect the nobles, once the enemy got through the walls")? What I find most interesting is applying Occam's razor, it's almost certainly not a defense mechanism, yet we have dozens of HN folks defending it, and I'm not sure why? If there was at least one documented account of where this was an effective defense, then maybe there's something there.
  - radford-neal 5y ago
    In 1201, Eleanor of Aquitaine survived in the keep of the castle Mirebeau after attackers were within the walls, until her son King John arrived and captured the attackers, rescuing her.
    - Bobylonian 5y ago
      That's a miracle story, where Superman is arriving in the last second, but still - what it has to do with fights on stairs? If there were no help from outside, next would be keep wall, or most probably lack of food and water for defenders.
  - burnished 5y ago
    Because it is a truth most of us have accepted without question. Further, it is so agreeable to other facts. Left handed people are evil? But of course, they can attack up in castle staircases! Medeival life was one of constant sword-fighting and war time! Also I'll admit the first couple arguments in TFA felt weak. I wouldn't be surprised if that colored peoples readings of the rest, or if they jumped to come comment before finishing the rest.
chimprich 5y ago
> If they breach the walls and actually enter the interior of the castle, they have already lost and no staircase design can save them. That's assuming that the castle has fallen by assault. If the attacker was an assassin who had gained access to the castle through subterfuge or a disgruntled worker then interior defences may have conceivably been useful.

by qw 5y ago

rtkwe 5y ago

There were interior defenses though. In some of the more impressive castles there were concentric rings of walls so breeching on wouldn't surrender the whole castle. There were often also keeps. Even in early proto castles you had motte and bailey designs where the main walls defended the low ground (bailey) for an interior fort built on a hill or prominence (the motte). Castles weren't single layer defenses that stopped at the walls, they were definitely designed to continue the fight and protect the nobles even if the enemy did get through the walls. Given that it's not so out of line to think the interior architecture might have been designed to increase defender's advantages.

timcederman 5y ago
Do you have any examples of when this actually happened (a fight "continued, to protect the nobles, once the enemy got through the walls")? What I find most interesting is applying Occam's razor, it's almost certainly not a defense mechanism, yet we have dozens of HN folks defending it, and I'm not sure why? If there was at least one documented account of where this was an effective defense, then maybe there's something there.
- radford-neal 5y ago
  In 1201, Eleanor of Aquitaine survived in the keep of the castle Mirebeau after attackers were within the walls, until her son King John arrived and captured the attackers, rescuing her.
  - Bobylonian 5y ago
    That's a miracle story, where Superman is arriving in the last second, but still - what it has to do with fights on stairs? If there were no help from outside, next would be keep wall, or most probably lack of food and water for defenders.
- burnished 5y ago
  Because it is a truth most of us have accepted without question. Further, it is so agreeable to other facts. Left handed people are evil? But of course, they can attack up in castle staircases! Medeival life was one of constant sword-fighting and war time! Also I'll admit the first couple arguments in TFA felt weak. I wouldn't be surprised if that colored peoples readings of the rest, or if they jumped to come comment before finishing the rest.

chimprich 5y ago

> If they breach the walls and actually enter the interior of the castle, they have already lost and no staircase design can save them. That's assuming that the castle has fallen by assault. If the attacker was an assassin who had gained access to the castle through subterfuge or a disgruntled worker then interior defences may have conceivably been useful.