5 ms·

I didn't dig into the FOIA submitters here, but I can say there are intentional, organized efforts by some people opposed to the vaccine to delay the rollout vi

by ethbr0 5y ago

I didn't dig into the FOIA submitters here, but I can say there are intentional, organized efforts by some people opposed to the vaccine to delay the rollout via paperwork requests. We had some anti-vaccine literature emailed around at work that purported to be a legal form to submit to anyone pressuring you to take a vaccine. Instead of, you know, politely opting out, it went straight down the rabbit hole of requesting every document that was legally required (e.g. full list of vaccine ingredients, verified chain of custody from point of manufacture, full study results including any reactions, etc). I'm all for skepticism, but at some point, there's just being a dick and wasting the time of others trying to do their best in government bureaucracies.

newsbinator 5y ago
Devil’s advocate / steel manning: “If you get to force me to put a possibly harmful thing in my body then I get to force you to do a ton of unreasonable paperwork about it” I imagine if I had a problem with vaccines or with this particular vaccine (for which I was gladly first in line in my cohort), then I’d likely use every loophole at my disposal to delay or prevent being forced, pressured, cajoled, shamed, etc into getting one.
iratewizard 5y ago
> I'm all for skepticism, but I don't appreciate it when people are skeptical of beliefs I hold strongly
- ethbr0 5y ago
  Skepticism pursued in a manner that overly impacts others is morally wrong. If someone doesn't want to be vaccinated -- refuse vaccination and deal with the consequences. Don't request (to use my example, not the OP) 100s of pages that you have no intention of reading, the production of which consumes valuable resources during a public health crisis.
  - iratewizard 5y ago
    I'm skeptical that you know their intentions with the foia results. Why is the only possibility log jamming in your mind?
    - ethbr0 5y ago
      I wasn't opining on the motive of the submitters of this FOIA request. I was saying "This is an unexpected thing I have seen first-hand from other parties. I think it's disingenuous. And it makes me suspicious of large document requests related to vaccine minutiae." The reasonable outcome, if the purported goals are true, would probably be to scope the FOIA request down to a summary of materials available, and then work with the relevant departments to filter out extraneous records that the requestors don't see as valuable.
ineptech 5y ago
> The plaintiffs, a group of more than 30 professors and scientists from universities including Yale, Harvard, UCLA and Brown, filed suit in September in U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Texas, seeking expedited access to the records. They say that releasing the information could help reassure vaccine skeptics that the shot is indeed “safe and effective and, thus, increase confidence in the Pfizer vaccine.” -- TFA
- ethbr0 5y ago
  Yes, I read that. But it doesn't really answer the question. Everyone claims to be doing something for a good reason.

by ethbr0 5y ago

newsbinator 5y ago

Devil’s advocate / steel manning: “If you get to force me to put a possibly harmful thing in my body then I get to force you to do a ton of unreasonable paperwork about it” I imagine if I had a problem with vaccines or with this particular vaccine (for which I was gladly first in line in my cohort), then I’d likely use every loophole at my disposal to delay or prevent being forced, pressured, cajoled, shamed, etc into getting one.

iratewizard 5y ago

> I'm all for skepticism, but I don't appreciate it when people are skeptical of beliefs I hold strongly

ethbr0 5y ago
Skepticism pursued in a manner that overly impacts others is morally wrong. If someone doesn't want to be vaccinated -- refuse vaccination and deal with the consequences. Don't request (to use my example, not the OP) 100s of pages that you have no intention of reading, the production of which consumes valuable resources during a public health crisis.
- iratewizard 5y ago
  I'm skeptical that you know their intentions with the foia results. Why is the only possibility log jamming in your mind?
  - ethbr0 5y ago
    I wasn't opining on the motive of the submitters of this FOIA request. I was saying "This is an unexpected thing I have seen first-hand from other parties. I think it's disingenuous. And it makes me suspicious of large document requests related to vaccine minutiae." The reasonable outcome, if the purported goals are true, would probably be to scope the FOIA request down to a summary of materials available, and then work with the relevant departments to filter out extraneous records that the requestors don't see as valuable.

ineptech 5y ago

> The plaintiffs, a group of more than 30 professors and scientists from universities including Yale, Harvard, UCLA and Brown, filed suit in September in U.S. District Court for the Northern District of Texas, seeking expedited access to the records. They say that releasing the information could help reassure vaccine skeptics that the shot is indeed “safe and effective and, thus, increase confidence in the Pfizer vaccine.” -- TFA

ethbr0 5y ago
Yes, I read that. But it doesn't really answer the question. Everyone claims to be doing something for a good reason.