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I am hoping they explained why. Most people who complain about the encryption regulation just completely disregard the reason for encryption in the first place

I am hoping they explained why. Most people who complain about the encryption regulation just completely disregard the reason for encryption in the first place (ie, all other regulations become unenforceable if encryption is allowed).

jjoonathan 5y ago
Do they? Maybe we need to figure out the essential subset of regulations that preserves the most essential aspects of the system while still permitting encryption. I have no doubt it will be a huge mess and take a few tries to get right. We should get started already -- if we don't, HAM will die, and it will deserve to die.
- sseagull 5y ago
  Mostly. Ham is meant for play, not as a primary means of communication or for commercial purposes. If everything is encrypted, how could you tell? How could you even tell that the users were licensed?
  - jjoonathan 5y ago
    By not encrypting the call signs because unencrypted call signs aren't the problematic restriction. It's the content restrictions that are stifling in the modern world. Also: progress has changed the landscape. HFDF used to be difficult for the military but now it's easy for hobbyists, and not just in last-mile form, but in coordinated always-on infrastructure form. The regulations were not written with this in mind. With an active community this fact alone might obviate the need for many a regulation.
  - nyanpasu64 5y ago
    And I'm not broadcasting my legal name and mailing address so i can "play" with radio transmissions.
edrxty 5y ago
The unenforceable argument isn't really a thing. If we look at some common encryption standards, the call sign is in the clear as it has to be for routing. In the case where someone is swearing with their friends over an encrypted channel, it's just not a problem, no child will hear the swears without a quantum supercomputer. In the case where a business is illegally using ham bands to avoid paying license fees, they can already do this, nobody is actually checking. You can encrypt P25 on the bands all day long because nobody has radios that work with that digital mode and nobody will spend the time running signal analysis to figure out that A) it's P25, B) it's encrypted and C) where it's coming from. If it became rampant the FCC has the tools to very quickly figure out all of these things and if the broadcasts don't have a call sign and are coming from a business premises then it's obviously breaking the law anyway. If it could be a problem, it already would be. All the Chinese digital business radios support encryption now. We're just not allowed to use it because people are scared of bogeymen
- BenjiWiebe 5y ago
  Yes, people are checking. Repeated abuse of ham radio (in the US anyways) will eventually get enough hams mad that they will report to the FCC, which does investigate and crack down from time to time. No, it isn't an instant 100% chance of retribution.
  - edrxty 5y ago
    People are checking FM because it's trivial. I have yet to hear of someone getting caught using digital encryption entirely through band monitoring (ie not doing something obviously stupid elsewhere like bragging about it on social media)
    - ajsnigrutin 5y ago
      It's 2021... ham operators hear someone using the band for something digital, and then use the one of the many cheap SDR sticks to check what is using the channel. One call to a regulator, and it's done.
- 5y ago

jjoonathan 5y ago

Do they? Maybe we need to figure out the essential subset of regulations that preserves the most essential aspects of the system while still permitting encryption. I have no doubt it will be a huge mess and take a few tries to get right. We should get started already -- if we don't, HAM will die, and it will deserve to die.

sseagull 5y ago
Mostly. Ham is meant for play, not as a primary means of communication or for commercial purposes. If everything is encrypted, how could you tell? How could you even tell that the users were licensed?
- jjoonathan 5y ago
  By not encrypting the call signs because unencrypted call signs aren't the problematic restriction. It's the content restrictions that are stifling in the modern world. Also: progress has changed the landscape. HFDF used to be difficult for the military but now it's easy for hobbyists, and not just in last-mile form, but in coordinated always-on infrastructure form. The regulations were not written with this in mind. With an active community this fact alone might obviate the need for many a regulation.
- nyanpasu64 5y ago
  And I'm not broadcasting my legal name and mailing address so i can "play" with radio transmissions.

edrxty 5y ago

The unenforceable argument isn't really a thing. If we look at some common encryption standards, the call sign is in the clear as it has to be for routing. In the case where someone is swearing with their friends over an encrypted channel, it's just not a problem, no child will hear the swears without a quantum supercomputer. In the case where a business is illegally using ham bands to avoid paying license fees, they can already do this, nobody is actually checking. You can encrypt P25 on the bands all day long because nobody has radios that work with that digital mode and nobody will spend the time running signal analysis to figure out that A) it's P25, B) it's encrypted and C) where it's coming from. If it became rampant the FCC has the tools to very quickly figure out all of these things and if the broadcasts don't have a call sign and are coming from a business premises then it's obviously breaking the law anyway. If it could be a problem, it already would be. All the Chinese digital business radios support encryption now. We're just not allowed to use it because people are scared of bogeymen

BenjiWiebe 5y ago
Yes, people are checking. Repeated abuse of ham radio (in the US anyways) will eventually get enough hams mad that they will report to the FCC, which does investigate and crack down from time to time. No, it isn't an instant 100% chance of retribution.
- edrxty 5y ago
  People are checking FM because it's trivial. I have yet to hear of someone getting caught using digital encryption entirely through band monitoring (ie not doing something obviously stupid elsewhere like bragging about it on social media)
  - ajsnigrutin 5y ago
    It's 2021... ham operators hear someone using the band for something digital, and then use the one of the many cheap SDR sticks to check what is using the channel. One call to a regulator, and it's done.
5y ago