19 ms·

Waterford has Ireland's 2nd highest Covid incidence with 99.7% fully vaccinated

45 points by vadfa 5y ago

disgu 5y ago
I'm starting to hate these articles because they never, ever contain the information needed to deduct anything. - Who got Covid (vaccinated or not?)? - How sick are they (did they just test positive, are they in they hospital, ICU)? Starting to feel like these essential questions are completely ignored on purpose. Well, just like the last dozen times an article like this has popped up, this "statistic" doesn't contain enough information to be relevant at all. It's just click bait crap.
- degenerate 5y ago
  clicks, clicks, clicks. Nothing else matters to them.
- disambiguation 5y ago
  Agreed we need more data and less fear mongering headlines. I don't know much about Ireland's data w.r.t this article, but UK is similar in a lot of ways and provides an abundance of interesting reports. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1025358/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-41.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... > Based on antibody testing of blood donors, 98.1% of the adult population now have antibodies to COVID-19 from either infection or vaccination compared to 19.7% that have antibodies from infection alone. Over 97% of adults aged 17 or older have antibodies from either infection or vaccination. pages 13 and onward have nice tabular data on hospitalization, emergency care, and death which have comparisons in terms of Rates among persons vaccinated with 2 doses (per 100,000) and Rates among persons not vaccinated (per 100,000).
  - Macha 5y ago
    From the Irish covid tracker app: It doesn't have a county level breakdown for hospitalisations and ICU (since counties are too small for every one to have their own hospitals and definitely most don't have their own ICU). Waterford does have both, but I've been unable to find the figures for either the public or private hospital in the city. Nationwide covid hospital cases: 634 Nationwide ICU cases: 119 Also this site has a more granular breakdown on case numbers: https://opendata-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/datasets/27d401c9ae084097bb1f3a69b69462a1_0/explore?location=53.193454%2C-8.329624%2C7.00&showTable=true https://opendata-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/datasets/27d401c9ae0...
  - sime2009 5y ago
    Figures based on blood donors were also circulating in the Netherlands earlier this year. But you have to be very careful what you conclude from blood donors because they are not a good representation of the general population. They tended to be healthier in general, have higher rates of vaccination, and also medical personnel are over-represented.
sigmar 5y ago
Headline says "99.7% of residents" Then in the article is says "99.7% of all adults," doesn't mention the percentage of eligible people (over 12 y/o), or the percentage of the total population of the county that is vaccinated. Surely 100% of the cases aren't among 18+, but the article just throws out "5% of adults" when 400/100,000 = .4%
tiahura 5y ago
Covid 19 is more like the cold than measles. Immunity starts to wane after months. This shouldn’t be shocking to anyone who has had a cold. The fact that virologists weren’t upfront from the beginning about this, and that the epidemiologists weren’t upfront from the beginning that it was clearly endemic by March 2019, has led to much of the dysfunctional response from the public and governments.
- charbonneau2 5y ago
  By March 2019?
  - tiahura 5y ago
    Whoops. 2020.
    - dudeofea 5y ago
      Haha, for a sec I thought you were going to link this: https://theethicalskeptic.com/2021/11/15/chinas-ccp-concealed-sars-cov-2-presence-in-china-as-far-back-as-march-2018/ https://theethicalskeptic.com/2021/11/15/chinas-ccp-conceale...
TheGigaChad 5y ago
Back to the Cuckdowns I guess.
negamax 5y ago
Most older people who must have pre existing complications.
toisanji 5y ago
does that mean the vaccine is not really effective?
- silvester23 5y ago
  I think a critical piece of information is missing here, namely how many of the 470 cases last week actually were vaccinated. It says 99,7% of the adult population is vaccinated, maybe there was a huge outbreak at a school or something.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- giarc 5y ago
  It would be more important to look at the counties hospitalization rate and death rate. We know the vaccine doesn't stop breakthrough infections, but it does reduce morbidity and mortality.
  - jboggan 5y ago
    The UK is releasing good stats on vaccinated/non-vaccinated outcomes that are thankfully broken down by age groups [0], since comparing an un-vaccinated 20 year old to a vaccinated 90 year old is extremely different. Overall it seems that the vaccinated cohort are contracting COVID at a higher rate per capita, while having lower hospitalization and morbidity rates than the unvaccinated once they are sick. The higher illness rate is surprising though and one reason the stats have raised some eyebrows in the UK government. [1] Some people will have issues with the commentary on this blog. I'm posting it in reference to these UK statistics because it's the only place I've seen the tabular data visualized, if you want to examine the raw UK government data yourself it's linked through from the blog. 0 - https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-watch-2ba https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-... 1 - https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-watch https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-...
    - 5y ago
lngnmn2 5y ago
Vaccine does not prevent virus particles from entering and exiting one's body, so it is still about concentration of an aerosol in the air and the number of infected people around you. What a vaccine does - it primes one's immune system, so it fight the virus way more efficient. And that's it. No miracles or invincibility.
- vixen99 5y ago
  The definition of vaccine by some authorities changes according to evidently non-medical requirements. I'm not making a point. This is an observation. https://www.citizensjournal.us/the-cdc-suddenly-changes-the-definition-of-vaccine-and-vaccination/ https://www.citizensjournal.us/the-cdc-suddenly-changes-the-... It's generally recognized that the mRNA vaccine prevents neither infection nor tranmission of Covid-19. It does confer a certain benefit in terms of the severity of the disease if contracted. It's not an undiluted benefit as is indicated by the UK data (for instance) which documents significant numbers of deaths for fully vaccinated people. See Table 2 in https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1027511/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-42.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... Viral loads can be the same for the vaccinated and unvaccinated. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.29.21262798v1.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.29.21262798v... If this is a reproducible result, would it not render any vaccine passport pretty much meaningless in terms of public health?
  - tsimionescu 5y ago
    > It's not an undiluted benefit as is indicated by the UK data (for instance) which documents significant numbers of deaths for fully vaccinated people. It is an undiluted benefit (your chances of survival are much much higher if you are vaccinated), but not a miracle cure, unfortunately. The UK data you linked still says 85% protection from symptomatic illness for Delta variant with Pfizer, 95% protection from hospitalization.
- erdewit 5y ago
  > What a vaccine does - it primes one's immune system, so it fight the virus way more efficient. My understanding is that it does not really fight the virus (viral load stays the same), but that it does prime the immune system so as not react too violently. In other words it prevents a cytokine storm: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_storm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_storm
endisneigh 5y ago
Without knowing the vaccination status of those who got COVID it's hard to say anything. It's possible that 99.999% of individuals are vaccinated, and a huge wave still occurred. The small percentage unvaccinated could be the surge.
- shadowgovt 5y ago
  Yes. Especially if there's some reason that the unvaccinated are interacting with each other disproportionately more often than the vaccinated. Is there a religious commune in Waterford that has a moral objecion to taking the vaccine?
  - Macha 5y ago
    I wouldn't say there's a religious group, but we have our local group of conspiracy theorists that seem more prominent than elsewhere in the country that hop on all the bandwagons like 5g (and 4g before that), covid anti-vax, flouride conspiracies, etc.
samwillis 5y ago
There is something wrong with the stats in this article: "Co. Waterford has recorded 470 new cases of Covid-19 in the last week, accounting for nearly 5% of the adult population." That would suggest there adult population of Co. Waterford is only 9,400!? According to wikipedia its actually 116,176, so actually only 0.4% were infected last week. If they meant 470 per 100k population that would still only be 0.47%... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Waterford https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Waterford
- Denvercoder9 5y ago
  There's more wonky math in the article. It gives a 14-day incidence rate per 100,000 of 404.6 for Co. Waterford, which even if we're generous and use a population of 120,000 comes out to 486 infections in a two-week period. I don't believe that this week they had 470 infections, up from 16 last week.
- smcl 5y ago
  Yeah this was extremely careless
benjaminjackman 5y ago
It could be possible that [some, (0,100]%, portion of the benefit provided by] the vaccines wear off after a certain amount of time. This makes statistics like 99.7% of Waterford have been vaccinated perhaps less insightful than something like 34% (or whatever the actual number is) have been vaccinated in the last 6 months. edit: added [some portion, (0,100]%, of the benefit provided by]
- tiahura 5y ago
  The vaccine wears off in a few days. The vaccine tells the body to make copies of the “spike protein”. After a few days, the body breaks down the vaccine. In the meantime, the body makes copies of the spike protein. The immune system sees the spike protein and starts making antibodies to fight it off. Those antibodies do not last forever. It is my understanding that the lifespan of antibodies is largely determined by the type of virus they are for. For example, luckily the antibodies for measles and polio last decades. On the other hand, antibodies for rhinovirus and coronavirus last months not years, which is part of the reason why you can have more than one cold in your life.
xphilter 5y ago
Who cares? I think these are non controversial statements: (1) if you’re vaccinated, common sense suggests you’d be more likely to go back to normal as compared to pre-vax (increasing chances of getting covid), (2) the vaccine never prevented people from getting covid, (3) the vaccine may have lowered transmission of the early virus but has little effect on transmission of delta, (4) this article only matters if it shows an ineffectiveness in outcomes as compared to non-vaccinated folks.
- ghaff 5y ago
  >(1) if you’re vaccinated, common sense suggests you’d be more likely to go back to normal as compared to pre-vax (increasing chances of getting covid) This statement may be true. But it's not obvious to me. You could also argue that many people who got fully vaxed and even boosters where available are also more cautious in general, other things being equal. Again, not arguing this statement is untrue but a lot of people are still being cautious in various ways and I'm pretty sure there's a lot of overlap between that group and those who got vaccines early on.
  - xphilter 5y ago
    Oh, I didn’t mean as compared to general population. I meant for themselves. Presumably the vaccine would give folks some confidence in getting out more (if not, then why even bother getting it?)
Macha 5y ago
This is my home town. I think the 99.7% figure has been overstated. My understanding is that it has been calculated as: (vaccinations carried out in waterford) / (population of waterford) Waterford is a regional hub for the south east of Ireland. There are many vaccinations for people who reside outside of Waterford carried out in Waterford, including from counties kilkenny, tipperary and carlow.
- tiahura 5y ago
  How would you characterize the current “surge” in Waterford?
  - Macha 5y ago
    Things have opened up, cases have gone up. I've heard of one friend of a friend who got covid after vaccination, but no one I personally know in Waterford has got covid post vaccination.
- michaelhoffman 5y ago
  British Columbia Public Health had to walk back some stats calculated the same way when the proportion of vaccinated started to go over 100%.
twofornone 5y ago
It's amazing. This is a COMMON PATTERN. This has been the case for months as I've repeatedly been accused of misinformation for posting - I guess if the news doesn't report on it, it doesn't exist, right? Check UK official stats, they are 65%+ vaccinated (my number is out of date, should be higher now) and still experiencing record cases. Cases have been surging in Israel despite high vaccination rate. Gibraltar is another tiny country with a nearly 100% vaccination rate where the virus has not been contained. I don't know how else to put it. This should be huge news, but it isn't. Your media is lying to you. These vaccines are clearly not nearly as effective as we have been mislead to believe. This is hugely important, because the risk/benefit calculations that were used to justify mandates were clearly based on overly optimistic efficacy values. Something is not adding up. 0. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/08/20/1029628471/highly-vaccinated-israel-is-seeing-a-dramatic-surge-in-new-covid-cases-heres-why https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/08/20/1029628.... - note, this was apparent long before NPR quietly finally reported on it 1. https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ - 88% vaccination rate among adults 12+, nearing record cases 2. https://covid19.who.int/region/euro/country/gi https://covid19.who.int/region/euro/country/gi - in fact, check that map, despite high vaccination rates most EU countries are seeing surges.
- Reason077 5y ago
  It’s true that the vaccines don’t seem to be super effective against getting infected. I have several friends who got sick and tested positive despite being double-vaccinated. They recovered quickly though, more quickly than I did from getting infected before vaccines were widely available. I also have a physiotherapist friend who’s been working Covid wards at an NHS hospital in London. Lots of bad Covid cases right now, but the vast majority are unvaccinated.
  - disambiguation 5y ago
    > Lots of bad Covid cases right now, but the vast majority are unvaccinated that's a very interesting anecdote relative to the UK report GP linked If you look at the hospitalization data (table of page 13) the vaccinated actually out number the unvaccinated in terms of hospitalizations.
xbmcuser 5y ago
Singapore because of small it is and the control it has on its borders. Has great stats to show infection rate and death for the vaccinated/unvaccinated etc https://www.moh.gov.sg/covid-19/statistics/ https://www.moh.gov.sg/covid-19/statistics/
beardyw 5y ago
As soon as I saw 99.7% in the headline I knew this had to be fiction.
- Arnt 5y ago
  It's not fiction, exactly. Most places don't know how large their population is, that's why censuses are carried out. The city I live in knows a minimum number of vaccinations that have been carried out within city limits, and a maximum, but it doesn't really know how many of the people vaccinated live within city limits and how many live in the suburbs, and also doesn't really know how many people live within city limits. Calculating the percentage is a matter of dividing one approximate number by another, or if you will, dividing one number that doesn't mean exaxtly what readers assume with another that also doesn't mean exactly what readers assume. I know that these problems are common. People move in with their SOs without filing paperwork everywhere, not just here. However, if you want to keep track of how many people are vaccinated, you are going to have a counter. And if you want to tax people, you are going to have a number of inhabitants. Dividing one by the other is tempting, and it's accurate when you start doing it, because when 2% or 12% of the taxpayers have been vaccinated the count is fairly accurate. It only becomes really inaccurate as you approach 100%, and by that time changing the way you count breaks your time series, if you're using this data yourself.
roomey 5y ago
I read today that over half of hospital cases are unvaccinated. In Ireland. Also, the Irish Post is not a well known news outlet, I never heard of it before, so take with a pinch of salt.
- Macha 5y ago
  It's an UK news outlet focused at according to them, Irish in the UK. But I've mostly seen it from Irish Americans. This isn't the first time I've heard of it, so it is a real outlet, but it is a out of country tabloid.
efficax 5y ago
99.7% of all ADULTS. Covid cases are surging in 12 and unders and of course there are still breakthrough cases.

45 points by vadfa 5y ago

I'm starting to hate these articles because they never, ever contain the information needed to deduct anything. - Who got Covid (vaccinated or not?)? - How sick are they (did they just test positive, are they in they hospital, ICU)? Starting to feel like these essential questions are completely ignored on purpose. Well, just like the last dozen times an article like this has popped up, this "statistic" doesn't contain enough information to be relevant at all. It's just click bait crap.

degenerate 5y ago
clicks, clicks, clicks. Nothing else matters to them.
disambiguation 5y ago
Agreed we need more data and less fear mongering headlines. I don't know much about Ireland's data w.r.t this article, but UK is similar in a lot of ways and provides an abundance of interesting reports. https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1025358/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-41.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... > Based on antibody testing of blood donors, 98.1% of the adult population now have antibodies to COVID-19 from either infection or vaccination compared to 19.7% that have antibodies from infection alone. Over 97% of adults aged 17 or older have antibodies from either infection or vaccination. pages 13 and onward have nice tabular data on hospitalization, emergency care, and death which have comparisons in terms of Rates among persons vaccinated with 2 doses (per 100,000) and Rates among persons not vaccinated (per 100,000).
- Macha 5y ago
  From the Irish covid tracker app: It doesn't have a county level breakdown for hospitalisations and ICU (since counties are too small for every one to have their own hospitals and definitely most don't have their own ICU). Waterford does have both, but I've been unable to find the figures for either the public or private hospital in the city. Nationwide covid hospital cases: 634 Nationwide ICU cases: 119 Also this site has a more granular breakdown on case numbers: https://opendata-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/datasets/27d401c9ae084097bb1f3a69b69462a1_0/explore?location=53.193454%2C-8.329624%2C7.00&showTable=true https://opendata-geohive.hub.arcgis.com/datasets/27d401c9ae0...
- sime2009 5y ago
  Figures based on blood donors were also circulating in the Netherlands earlier this year. But you have to be very careful what you conclude from blood donors because they are not a good representation of the general population. They tended to be healthier in general, have higher rates of vaccination, and also medical personnel are over-represented.

sigmar 5y ago

Headline says "99.7% of residents" Then in the article is says "99.7% of all adults," doesn't mention the percentage of eligible people (over 12 y/o), or the percentage of the total population of the county that is vaccinated. Surely 100% of the cases aren't among 18+, but the article just throws out "5% of adults" when 400/100,000 = .4%

tiahura 5y ago

Covid 19 is more like the cold than measles. Immunity starts to wane after months. This shouldn’t be shocking to anyone who has had a cold. The fact that virologists weren’t upfront from the beginning about this, and that the epidemiologists weren’t upfront from the beginning that it was clearly endemic by March 2019, has led to much of the dysfunctional response from the public and governments.

charbonneau2 5y ago
By March 2019?
- tiahura 5y ago
  Whoops. 2020.
  - dudeofea 5y ago
    Haha, for a sec I thought you were going to link this: https://theethicalskeptic.com/2021/11/15/chinas-ccp-concealed-sars-cov-2-presence-in-china-as-far-back-as-march-2018/ https://theethicalskeptic.com/2021/11/15/chinas-ccp-conceale...

TheGigaChad 5y ago

Back to the Cuckdowns I guess.

negamax 5y ago

Most older people who must have pre existing complications.

toisanji 5y ago

does that mean the vaccine is not really effective?

silvester23 5y ago
I think a critical piece of information is missing here, namely how many of the 470 cases last week actually were vaccinated. It says 99,7% of the adult population is vaccinated, maybe there was a huge outbreak at a school or something.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
giarc 5y ago
It would be more important to look at the counties hospitalization rate and death rate. We know the vaccine doesn't stop breakthrough infections, but it does reduce morbidity and mortality.
- jboggan 5y ago
  The UK is releasing good stats on vaccinated/non-vaccinated outcomes that are thankfully broken down by age groups [0], since comparing an un-vaccinated 20 year old to a vaccinated 90 year old is extremely different. Overall it seems that the vaccinated cohort are contracting COVID at a higher rate per capita, while having lower hospitalization and morbidity rates than the unvaccinated once they are sick. The higher illness rate is surprising though and one reason the stats have raised some eyebrows in the UK government. [1] Some people will have issues with the commentary on this blog. I'm posting it in reference to these UK statistics because it's the only place I've seen the tabular data visualized, if you want to examine the raw UK government data yourself it's linked through from the blog. 0 - https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-watch-2ba https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-... 1 - https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-watch https://eugyppius.substack.com/p/ukhsa-efficacy-stats-death-...
  - 5y ago

lngnmn2 5y ago

Vaccine does not prevent virus particles from entering and exiting one's body, so it is still about concentration of an aerosol in the air and the number of infected people around you. What a vaccine does - it primes one's immune system, so it fight the virus way more efficient. And that's it. No miracles or invincibility.

vixen99 5y ago
The definition of vaccine by some authorities changes according to evidently non-medical requirements. I'm not making a point. This is an observation. https://www.citizensjournal.us/the-cdc-suddenly-changes-the-definition-of-vaccine-and-vaccination/ https://www.citizensjournal.us/the-cdc-suddenly-changes-the-... It's generally recognized that the mRNA vaccine prevents neither infection nor tranmission of Covid-19. It does confer a certain benefit in terms of the severity of the disease if contracted. It's not an undiluted benefit as is indicated by the UK data (for instance) which documents significant numbers of deaths for fully vaccinated people. See Table 2 in https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1027511/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-42.pdf https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/... Viral loads can be the same for the vaccinated and unvaccinated. https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.29.21262798v1.full.pdf https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.08.29.21262798v... If this is a reproducible result, would it not render any vaccine passport pretty much meaningless in terms of public health?
- tsimionescu 5y ago
  > It's not an undiluted benefit as is indicated by the UK data (for instance) which documents significant numbers of deaths for fully vaccinated people. It is an undiluted benefit (your chances of survival are much much higher if you are vaccinated), but not a miracle cure, unfortunately. The UK data you linked still says 85% protection from symptomatic illness for Delta variant with Pfizer, 95% protection from hospitalization.
erdewit 5y ago
> What a vaccine does - it primes one's immune system, so it fight the virus way more efficient. My understanding is that it does not really fight the virus (viral load stays the same), but that it does prime the immune system so as not react too violently. In other words it prevents a cytokine storm: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_storm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cytokine_storm

endisneigh 5y ago

Without knowing the vaccination status of those who got COVID it's hard to say anything. It's possible that 99.999% of individuals are vaccinated, and a huge wave still occurred. The small percentage unvaccinated could be the surge.

shadowgovt 5y ago
Yes. Especially if there's some reason that the unvaccinated are interacting with each other disproportionately more often than the vaccinated. Is there a religious commune in Waterford that has a moral objecion to taking the vaccine?
- Macha 5y ago
  I wouldn't say there's a religious group, but we have our local group of conspiracy theorists that seem more prominent than elsewhere in the country that hop on all the bandwagons like 5g (and 4g before that), covid anti-vax, flouride conspiracies, etc.

samwillis 5y ago

There is something wrong with the stats in this article: "Co. Waterford has recorded 470 new cases of Covid-19 in the last week, accounting for nearly 5% of the adult population." That would suggest there adult population of Co. Waterford is only 9,400!? According to wikipedia its actually 116,176, so actually only 0.4% were infected last week. If they meant 470 per 100k population that would still only be 0.47%... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Waterford https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_Waterford

Denvercoder9 5y ago
There's more wonky math in the article. It gives a 14-day incidence rate per 100,000 of 404.6 for Co. Waterford, which even if we're generous and use a population of 120,000 comes out to 486 infections in a two-week period. I don't believe that this week they had 470 infections, up from 16 last week.
smcl 5y ago
Yeah this was extremely careless

benjaminjackman 5y ago

It could be possible that [some, (0,100]%, portion of the benefit provided by] the vaccines wear off after a certain amount of time. This makes statistics like 99.7% of Waterford have been vaccinated perhaps less insightful than something like 34% (or whatever the actual number is) have been vaccinated in the last 6 months. edit: added [some portion, (0,100]%, of the benefit provided by]

tiahura 5y ago
The vaccine wears off in a few days. The vaccine tells the body to make copies of the “spike protein”. After a few days, the body breaks down the vaccine. In the meantime, the body makes copies of the spike protein. The immune system sees the spike protein and starts making antibodies to fight it off. Those antibodies do not last forever. It is my understanding that the lifespan of antibodies is largely determined by the type of virus they are for. For example, luckily the antibodies for measles and polio last decades. On the other hand, antibodies for rhinovirus and coronavirus last months not years, which is part of the reason why you can have more than one cold in your life.

xphilter 5y ago

Who cares? I think these are non controversial statements: (1) if you’re vaccinated, common sense suggests you’d be more likely to go back to normal as compared to pre-vax (increasing chances of getting covid), (2) the vaccine never prevented people from getting covid, (3) the vaccine may have lowered transmission of the early virus but has little effect on transmission of delta, (4) this article only matters if it shows an ineffectiveness in outcomes as compared to non-vaccinated folks.

ghaff 5y ago
>(1) if you’re vaccinated, common sense suggests you’d be more likely to go back to normal as compared to pre-vax (increasing chances of getting covid) This statement may be true. But it's not obvious to me. You could also argue that many people who got fully vaxed and even boosters where available are also more cautious in general, other things being equal. Again, not arguing this statement is untrue but a lot of people are still being cautious in various ways and I'm pretty sure there's a lot of overlap between that group and those who got vaccines early on.
- xphilter 5y ago
  Oh, I didn’t mean as compared to general population. I meant for themselves. Presumably the vaccine would give folks some confidence in getting out more (if not, then why even bother getting it?)

Macha 5y ago

This is my home town. I think the 99.7% figure has been overstated. My understanding is that it has been calculated as: (vaccinations carried out in waterford) / (population of waterford) Waterford is a regional hub for the south east of Ireland. There are many vaccinations for people who reside outside of Waterford carried out in Waterford, including from counties kilkenny, tipperary and carlow.

tiahura 5y ago
How would you characterize the current “surge” in Waterford?
- Macha 5y ago
  Things have opened up, cases have gone up. I've heard of one friend of a friend who got covid after vaccination, but no one I personally know in Waterford has got covid post vaccination.
michaelhoffman 5y ago
British Columbia Public Health had to walk back some stats calculated the same way when the proportion of vaccinated started to go over 100%.

twofornone 5y ago

It's amazing. This is a COMMON PATTERN. This has been the case for months as I've repeatedly been accused of misinformation for posting - I guess if the news doesn't report on it, it doesn't exist, right? Check UK official stats, they are 65%+ vaccinated (my number is out of date, should be higher now) and still experiencing record cases. Cases have been surging in Israel despite high vaccination rate. Gibraltar is another tiny country with a nearly 100% vaccination rate where the virus has not been contained. I don't know how else to put it. This should be huge news, but it isn't. Your media is lying to you. These vaccines are clearly not nearly as effective as we have been mislead to believe. This is hugely important, because the risk/benefit calculations that were used to justify mandates were clearly based on overly optimistic efficacy values. Something is not adding up. 0. https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/08/20/1029628471/highly-vaccinated-israel-is-seeing-a-dramatic-surge-in-new-covid-cases-heres-why https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsandsoda/2021/08/20/1029628.... - note, this was apparent long before NPR quietly finally reported on it 1. https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk/ - 88% vaccination rate among adults 12+, nearing record cases 2. https://covid19.who.int/region/euro/country/gi https://covid19.who.int/region/euro/country/gi - in fact, check that map, despite high vaccination rates most EU countries are seeing surges.

Reason077 5y ago
It’s true that the vaccines don’t seem to be super effective against getting infected. I have several friends who got sick and tested positive despite being double-vaccinated. They recovered quickly though, more quickly than I did from getting infected before vaccines were widely available. I also have a physiotherapist friend who’s been working Covid wards at an NHS hospital in London. Lots of bad Covid cases right now, but the vast majority are unvaccinated.
- disambiguation 5y ago
  > Lots of bad Covid cases right now, but the vast majority are unvaccinated that's a very interesting anecdote relative to the UK report GP linked If you look at the hospitalization data (table of page 13) the vaccinated actually out number the unvaccinated in terms of hospitalizations.

xbmcuser 5y ago

Singapore because of small it is and the control it has on its borders. Has great stats to show infection rate and death for the vaccinated/unvaccinated etc https://www.moh.gov.sg/covid-19/statistics/ https://www.moh.gov.sg/covid-19/statistics/

beardyw 5y ago

As soon as I saw 99.7% in the headline I knew this had to be fiction.

Arnt 5y ago
It's not fiction, exactly. Most places don't know how large their population is, that's why censuses are carried out. The city I live in knows a minimum number of vaccinations that have been carried out within city limits, and a maximum, but it doesn't really know how many of the people vaccinated live within city limits and how many live in the suburbs, and also doesn't really know how many people live within city limits. Calculating the percentage is a matter of dividing one approximate number by another, or if you will, dividing one number that doesn't mean exaxtly what readers assume with another that also doesn't mean exactly what readers assume. I know that these problems are common. People move in with their SOs without filing paperwork everywhere, not just here. However, if you want to keep track of how many people are vaccinated, you are going to have a counter. And if you want to tax people, you are going to have a number of inhabitants. Dividing one by the other is tempting, and it's accurate when you start doing it, because when 2% or 12% of the taxpayers have been vaccinated the count is fairly accurate. It only becomes really inaccurate as you approach 100%, and by that time changing the way you count breaks your time series, if you're using this data yourself.

roomey 5y ago

I read today that over half of hospital cases are unvaccinated. In Ireland. Also, the Irish Post is not a well known news outlet, I never heard of it before, so take with a pinch of salt.

Macha 5y ago
It's an UK news outlet focused at according to them, Irish in the UK. But I've mostly seen it from Irish Americans. This isn't the first time I've heard of it, so it is a real outlet, but it is a out of country tabloid.

efficax 5y ago

99.7% of all ADULTS. Covid cases are surging in 12 and unders and of course there are still breakthrough cases.