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> Being able to use Arch Linux or Debian, and the latest mainline kernel and have replaceable storage is just so much more flexible in what you can do. To be

> Being able to use Arch Linux or Debian, and the latest mainline kernel and have replaceable storage is just so much more flexible in what you can do. To be fair, my current OpenWRT devices are running more up to date kernels (5.4) than my Debian-based (4.x) devices at home. And for a router I really don't need/want more code than strictly necessary. What use is 8GBs for the system, if it all it can do is load extra services, which will starve the RAM of the device and make runtime performance less predictable? What can you do with your 8GB+ router compared to mine 32MB?

opan 5y ago
OpenWrt is a nightmare to update due to the space constraints. A more traditional distro can just be updated via the usual package manager commands. I believe OpenWrt expects you to back up configs and reimage the whole thing.
- josteink 5y ago
  What are you talking about? There’s literally a sysupgrade-image you can use to update in place without losing your config. Has it been a while since you used OpenWRT last time?
  - opan 5y ago
    Since I used it? No. Running it on many things. Upgraded it? Yeah. I've done a lot of fresh installs but don't usually upgrade the system because it doesn't seem trivial compared to running one command occasionally on the rolling release distros I'm used to. What you're describing is unknown to me. It sounds a bit OpenBSD-like, maybe. I also consider OpenBSD to be unreasonably annoying to upgrade (although it's been a while since I tried with that either, I heard it got better).
    - josteink 5y ago
      You can always just “opkg upgrade” if that’s your cup of tea. That won’t necessarily update the kernel-image though which is often stored directly on some MTD-partitions, so flashing the sysupgrade image is the recommended approach if you want to make sure everything is up to date. And it’s literally just uploading one firmware file to one web-ui. It’s not like it’s hard to do it particularly involved or time-consuming. If you’ve been using OpenWRT at all I’m kinda surprised you’ve actually been able to miss them. They’re pretty much front and center in the firmware download pages and referenced in every single release note, more or less.
megous 5y ago
My router runs Linux 5.15. I can cache more stuff in RAM, instead of wearing out the flash storage, or having to throw useful data away (http cache, larger DNS cache). I can use all the new stuff that's added to the Linux kernel's networking stack. I can use any scripting labguages, to automate things like updating my DNS servers easily. I compile my own kernel for the router, so I can disable anything I don't like, all the barely used and less tested protocols I don't need, etc. Minimal Arch Linux is quite small. But I have option to to install anything, and the board will support it, without me having to figure out workarounds. The board has 4 cores, you can dedicate 1 to the routing, and use the rest for whatever without starving the core functions of the router of the resources. I mean, it's just a lot more flexible, while being cheaper and easier to replace than dedicated routers, when the HW breaks. Just copy the root filesystem to other uSD card, and swap the kernel, and it will run the same on a different ARM SBC, which I have quite a lot laying around in my home.

opan 5y ago

OpenWrt is a nightmare to update due to the space constraints. A more traditional distro can just be updated via the usual package manager commands. I believe OpenWrt expects you to back up configs and reimage the whole thing.

josteink 5y ago
What are you talking about? There’s literally a sysupgrade-image you can use to update in place without losing your config. Has it been a while since you used OpenWRT last time?
- opan 5y ago
  Since I used it? No. Running it on many things. Upgraded it? Yeah. I've done a lot of fresh installs but don't usually upgrade the system because it doesn't seem trivial compared to running one command occasionally on the rolling release distros I'm used to. What you're describing is unknown to me. It sounds a bit OpenBSD-like, maybe. I also consider OpenBSD to be unreasonably annoying to upgrade (although it's been a while since I tried with that either, I heard it got better).
  - josteink 5y ago
    You can always just “opkg upgrade” if that’s your cup of tea. That won’t necessarily update the kernel-image though which is often stored directly on some MTD-partitions, so flashing the sysupgrade image is the recommended approach if you want to make sure everything is up to date. And it’s literally just uploading one firmware file to one web-ui. It’s not like it’s hard to do it particularly involved or time-consuming. If you’ve been using OpenWRT at all I’m kinda surprised you’ve actually been able to miss them. They’re pretty much front and center in the firmware download pages and referenced in every single release note, more or less.

megous 5y ago

My router runs Linux 5.15. I can cache more stuff in RAM, instead of wearing out the flash storage, or having to throw useful data away (http cache, larger DNS cache). I can use all the new stuff that's added to the Linux kernel's networking stack. I can use any scripting labguages, to automate things like updating my DNS servers easily. I compile my own kernel for the router, so I can disable anything I don't like, all the barely used and less tested protocols I don't need, etc. Minimal Arch Linux is quite small. But I have option to to install anything, and the board will support it, without me having to figure out workarounds. The board has 4 cores, you can dedicate 1 to the routing, and use the rest for whatever without starving the core functions of the router of the resources. I mean, it's just a lot more flexible, while being cheaper and easier to replace than dedicated routers, when the HW breaks. Just copy the root filesystem to other uSD card, and swap the kernel, and it will run the same on a different ARM SBC, which I have quite a lot laying around in my home.