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Video game play is positively correlated with well-being

198 points by wallflower 5y ago

Fire-Dragon-DoL 5y ago
I play videogames because I love them (primary reason). I do have to specify I play mostly indie games, single player only (or couch/lan coop). That being said, they are great for slowly reducing my brain load. If I do something too "simple", my brain goes back to work: way more engaging and challenging. Videogames are (based on choice) somewhat of an hybrid in intensity, giving me the possibility to slowly reduce the brain load, so that a simple activity afterwards is possible, without thinking about work.
afavour 5y ago
I imagine this headline will be used by pro-gaming folks in just as disingenuous ways as anti-gaming folks use their studies. IMO, everything in moderation. Video games are fine unless they dominate your life, in which case you’re probably overdoing it.
FriendWithMoon 5y ago
They must have never played LoL.
grammarnazzzi 5y ago
This paper's lack of meaningful content and writing style makes me suspect it was generated by a bot
ArtDev 5y ago
All games are not the same. Plants vs. Zombies and Animal Crossing are fairly chill experiences.
cblconfederate 5y ago
This sounds reasonable. When people are depressed they re not much in the mood to play, right ?
WalterBright 5y ago
Or perhaps feeling poorly means one doesn't feel like playing video games.
- AnthonyMouse 5y ago
  Or having free time and money to spend playing video games comes from success and stability. I'm starting to wonder if correlational studies even produce better results than a random number generator.
jp_sc 5y ago
If you have time to play video games, you probably have time to sleep well and exercise... which is proved to be positively correlated with well-being
- rsiwerz 5y ago
  One need not exclude the other. You can do both;)
  - Footkerchief 5y ago
    The point is that the correlation probably points to an underlying variable (e.g. leisure time) instead of direct causation.
- falcolas 5y ago
  You could say this about any leisure time activity, from interacting with friends to watching TV to reading books. Leisure time is not a bad thing, as the title says.
- kube-system 5y ago
  I'm curious as to whether these are actually correlated. I anecdotally doubt that video game players exercise at a higher rate than non players. Alternatively, I would guess that just generally having free time to spend in any way is a healthy thing. We already know that stress is correlated with worse outcomes. The study does mention that income could be a third causal variable, I think stress is probably a similarly correlated factor.
  - dragontamer 5y ago
    You might be surprised. Take a look at Fly (DOTA professional gamer) for example: https://www.gosugamers.net/dota2/news/47182-fly-and-s4-out-of-og-join-eg https://www.gosugamers.net/dota2/news/47182-fly-and-s4-out-o... Turns out that a healthy body is correlated with reflexes. You need a level of workout activity if you want to be a professional-level video game player. The "fat and lazy" trope kinda-sorta works for maybe casual games. But a fit body means a fit mind, and a fit mind plays games at a higher level.
SeanFerree 5y ago
I agree. Of course, as with any thing, in moderation
spywaregorilla 5y ago
A few things: * only looking at animal crossing and a plants vs. zombies game. I can only speak to animal crossing but I wouldn't be surprised if that game sparks a lot more joy and well being than most. * They do some... weird visualization choices with bars going both up and down but both implying a positive impact. I've never seen this. Super weird. You can't even compare the two options. * R^2 of play time and well begin is 0.01. Technically significant.
- r-zip 5y ago
  > * R^2 of play time and well begin is 0.01. Technically significant. Wow, that's complete garbage!
  - CobrastanJorji 5y ago
    Certainly sounds like garbage. I'd sort of expect random noise to produce an R^2 of around that value. But maybe for studies of human value that's normal? It's a peer reviewed study, so I'd hope it meets some basic standard for significance, but who knows? Is anyone familiar enough with psychology research to say how good or bad this is?
    - nwiswell 5y ago
      What that actually means is that if the observations are representative of the underlying reality, then 1% of happiness is explained by playing video games. We use p-values to determine whether a relationship is likely to actually exist based on observations. R^2 is a measure of the "strength" of the relationship, i.e. how much of the dependent variable is explained by the independent variable -- it is silent on the matter of whether the relationship is likely to actually exist.
dragontamer 5y ago
Correlation =/= causation. In particular, correlation goes both ways. Not only is "video game play positively correlated with well being", but so is "well being positively correlated with video game play". If we go back to the 1800s and look at masters at Chess, Shogi or Go / Baduk, we'll see that they're all well-off individuals.
- kube-system 5y ago
  The study mentions this on page 14, I'd paste a quote but the highlighting is wonky.
- babygoat 5y ago
  That's probably why they used the word correlated, and suggested how a causal relationship could be established.
Mikeb85 5y ago
I find video games definitely get the brain working, much in the same way as playing chess or other board games, thinking about problems, etc... Definitely more 'active' than consuming (most) media. I'd even theorize that video games have become so popular because our brains need some sort of conflict and stimulation; now that we're sedentary and no longer concerned with daily survival and conflict with the natural world/other tribes.
provobro 5y ago
Everything is fine in moderation. Everyone needs time to decompress from a long day in some way or another. If video games are your way to do that, that’s great
- hiking-duude 5y ago
  Testing to see if burner account is shadow banned
blackbrokkoli 5y ago
So they collaborated with EA, a company so infamous for anti-consumer practices like real-money gambling for minors that they are basically synonymous with "evil" within the gaming subculture and found out...that EA games make you happy! If you are actually interested in this topic, there are a lot of reviews including way longer periods, variables and genres. Of course, you still have to apply the same filter to sift through moral panic and game ads, but this study is even if not biased still unnecessarily limited in scope. Not a good base for a discussion IMO...
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > and found out...that EA games make you happy! correlation does not indicate direction of causation; it is just as valid to conclude that happy people had more time to play games.
  - bostonpete 5y ago
    And it may just be that happiness and video game playing are both correlated with something else, like having a lot of leisure time and/or a lot of discretionary spending money.
  - AlphaSite 5y ago
    That’s generally how it’s been for me, the happier I am the more energy I have for habits like this, which take a non zero amount of effort to play. Conversely when I’m feeling down this is the first thing to go, I can desire to play and just sit there for hours not doing so.
    - tuatoru 5y ago
      Thank you for writing this.
- robrenaud 5y ago
  Do you have a summary of the research, given your interest in the topic?
curiousgal 5y ago
I think paper titles should be as thoroughly reviewed as their content. This goes for almost all psychology papers. Researchers should not generalize their results haphazardly. In this particular case, they have only looked at two particular video games. And yet they claim that video game play is correlated with well-being. I know that the title is technically correct but if you always have to resort to such cheap tactics to make your research seem relevant then the entire field should be put into question. There is no way you'd find a paper in CS titled "An optimal solution to the Traveling Salesman Problem" when the paper has only solved a constrained, limited version of the problem.
Ancalagon 5y ago
Definitely anecdotal but I think a lot faster because of the mental workout that comes from fast-paced fighter games and shooters. Additionally, some fighter pilots noted over the years that new generations of pilots had faster reflexes than their older peers specifically because the younger generations had gotten into the habit of playing lots of video games growing up.
- GhettoComputers 5y ago
  What games were they playing? PvZ and Animal Crossing? ;) Stimulations are different, and you can see gaming influences like F1 wheels. https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/en/news/2019/03/how-does-an-f1-steering-wheel-work/ https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/en/news/2019/03/how-does-an-f1... Gran Turismo also helps drivers. https://www.industrytap.com/worlds-best-gran-turismo-video-game-player-now-professional-race-car-driver/24297 https://www.industrytap.com/worlds-best-gran-turismo-video-g... https://drivemag.com/news/uk-policemen-use-gran-turismo-sport-as-driving-skills-enhancer https://drivemag.com/news/uk-policemen-use-gran-turismo-spor...
  - Ancalagon 5y ago
    Surprisingly, one fighter pilot mentioned mario kart. A helicopter pilot I personally know in the Marines also said mario kart!
- matheusmoreira 5y ago
  I remember reading a study claiming that realistic tridimensional simulations are correlated with visuospatial intelligence.
TimTheTinker 5y ago
What a surprise. A study involving a gaming company shows that games are good for you. Studies funded by tobacco companies in the 1950s found that smoking cigarettes is good for you as well.
- cle 5y ago
  And also, studies funded by education companies show that reading is good for you.
  - TimTheTinker 5y ago
    I'm not saying games are necessarily bad, just that this study's conflict of interest makes its conclusions worthless.
    - Ensorceled 5y ago
      > this study's conflict of interest makes its conclusions worthless. "suspect" ... surely you meant "suspect" and not "worthless" ...
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
onemoresoop 5y ago
If one is depressed they are likely not keen on gaming either. Conversely, when in good mood activities such as gaming or whatever hobbies people have are on the rise so this one is pretty obvious how it generally relates to well being. In my opinion too much gaming can't be good for you but some moderate amount could be a decent stimulant. For good wellbeing we need to satisfy a few more needs and a surplus of one does not compensate for the others.
- flavius29663 5y ago
  > If one is depressed they are likely not keen on gaming either Do you have a source for that? In my anecdotal opinion, video games offer a refuge from the real life that can be helpful in depressions. It's addictive and causes addiction style issues, but that is another story.
  - allemagne 5y ago
    My guess would be that it would vary a lot by game and by person. Sometimes even getting started on video games that I know I would enjoy seems like "too much work".
  - jabroni_salad 5y ago
    For me it becomes more difficult to get started on anything. Once I get some momentum it isn't as bad but eventually there will be a moment of 'this is doing nothing' and crash out. That isn't so bad for solo play but most of my playtime is co-op games like Deep Rock or Vermintide and I am lucky to have an IRL friend group to play them with.
  - onemoresoop 5y ago
    It is my personal opinion, sorry, I should have mentioned that. When depressed I don't feel like doing anything at all, I lack stamina and feel weak. The refuge/escapism part is when I'm less depressed but still am ruminating on how pointless everything is and that's when escapism does its trick. While it helps at the moment I don't think escaping reality does us any good in the long run though.
  - 5y ago
Borrible 5y ago
A little hint for contract researchers of the video game industry: Its regime would be more impressed with the finding, video games provide to strengthen the People's Republic of China's defense forces. It doesn't care for the well-being of individuals. It cares for the well-being of the Chinese Nation.
GhettoComputers 5y ago
Collaboration with EA? Let’s see how much well being they have after playing this war of mine. Correlation with self reported well being could be applied to opiate use. Let’s try > People have never used more prescription opiate medication and no stakeholders are worried that this activity might be bad. So far, research has not had adequate data to test whether these worries are justified and if policymakers should act to more heavily regulate opiates. We attempt to provide much-needed evidence with adequate data. Whereas previous research had to rely on self-reported opiate use, we collaborated with two drug companies, Purdue Pharma and Johnson and Johnson, to obtain user’s actual drug usage behavior. We surveyed users of Oxycodone and Dilaudid for their well-being, motivations, and need satisfaction during drugs and merged their responses with prescription data. Contrary to many fears that excessive drug prescribing will lead to addiction and poor mental health, we found a positive relation between drug use and affective well-being. Need satisfaction and motivations during use did not interact with high time but were instead independently related to well-being. Our results advance the field in two important ways. First, we show that collaborations with industry partners can be done to high academic standards in an ethical and transparent fashion. Second, we deliver much-needed evidence to policymakers on the link between drugs and mental health. (Self reported surveys are not ever scientific I don’t know how they can say high standards and post this after) > Another limiting factor on the confidence in our results is the low response rate observed in both of our surveys. It is possible that various selection effects might have led to unrepresentative estimates of well-being, drug usage, or their relationship. Increasing response rates, while at the same time ensuring samples’ representativeness, remains a challenge for future studies in this field.
glennonymous 5y ago
The many skeptical comments on this thread are well founded, however the idea that video games positively correlate with well-being seems to resonate with my own experience. When I have downtime nowadays, I often tune out by listening to podcasts while playing video games on my phone. I jokingly refer to this with my wife as “dial tone mode”. This doesn’t take the place of reading; I read a lot of articles and books, both fiction and non-fiction. I reckon I read much more since I acquired a smart phone and basically carry a library in my pocket FWIW. But I don’t think reading serves the same function as dial tone mode. I suffer from depression and anxiety. When I’m not reading, I don’t usually sit around and have wonderful ideas. Instead, I listen to the often nasty voices in my head telling me there’s something terribly wrong with me and my life. This is especially true if I’m stressed out. Dial tone mode feels therapeutic to me, and iPhone video games are a part of that. I’m quite aware I could be wrong, even about my interpretation of my own experience. But so it seems to me.
- ammanley 5y ago
  fellow depression+anxiety+spectrum compatriot; I echo your experience, and do not think you're wrong that (video) games can and are a valuable coping tool against the nasty voices that like to try to run our minds.
- grammarnazzzi 5y ago
  That's fine as long as you have balance in your life. Probably healthy as long as most of your time is spent doing something meaningful to you. But if most of your discretionary time is spent doing unimportant things, that can contribute to depression and anxiety. "Dial tone mode" sounds a lot like the checking out alcoholics, drug users and other people suffering from compulsive disorders waste their lives doing.
  - CobrastanJorji 5y ago
    I'm no expert, but there's probably a balance. There are certainly some benefits to zoning out for a bit, but there's also an opportunity cost. Spending N hours a week in dial tone mode is likely a good idea, but spending A LOT of time idling is probably not ideal (for whatever your definition of an ideal life is).
throwaway_cG7pW 5y ago
I read only title but I'm interested in video games. If you are interested in this subject I recommend watching this video from Game Developer's Conference: "How the Industry Can Change the "Games Are Bad" Narrative" (27 minutes) [1]. It is commentary about current situation - how public opinion sees games and how change opinion to be it more based on actual data and facts. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH7FfRwgJwc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH7FfRwgJwc
tablespoon 5y ago
> In this study, we investigate the relations between video games and positive mental health, namely affective well- being of players (from here on called well-being).... > We designed a survey measuring players’ well-being, self-reported play, and motivations for play and discussed the survey structure with Electronic Arts. > We assessed well-being with the validated Scale of Positive and Negative Experiences [59], which measures the affective dimension of well-being [38]. We asked respondents to think about how they had been feeling in the past two weeks and report how often they experienced each of six positive and six negative feelings. If you gave heroin addicts and unrestricted supply of heroin and performed a similar study, would you find that heroin use is "positively correlated with will being"? I have a young toddler. When I was reading about letting them watch TV, an article I read made a good point: babies and toddlers enjoy watching TV, but it doesn't do them any good (they're too young to make sense of the pictures) and tends to deprive them of experiences (e.g. language exposure) actually that does do them good. My intuition is video games are similar for adults.
- meursault 5y ago
  My mind immediately went to surveying the participants in a Skinner box on their perceived well being. It would be incredible if people DIDN'T self-report feeling great after pulling the dopamine levers
- matheusmoreira 5y ago
  No idea why you're being downvoted. The vast majority of today's games are literally designed from the ground up to be habit forming. They use timed random rewards in order to impose schedules on players. EA is of course a major offender, it's one of the reasons why they are universally hated. The article essentially concludes that being rewarded feels good in the short term. What I'd like to see is long-term happiness and socioeconomic impact.
- _carbyau_ 5y ago
  I don't have a research article, but yeah, I see problem gaming as being a similar problem as alcoholism. To "wind down" is ok, IE in small amounts. But when it overwhelms and becomes a "drive to escape reality" it is an issue. But often(not always), both are being used to escape some OTHER issue. And maybe if that issue was worked on life would truly be better.
gosukiwi 5y ago
laughs in League of Legends
- abledon 5y ago
  https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/qv5jtg/tyler_spectates_a_guy_whose_1_win_away_from/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/qv5jtg/tyle... from last nights challenger cut off series... definitely correlated with wellbeing
golemiprague 5y ago
It depends what game and what is the context. During corona times online collaborative games helped my kids staying in touch with their friends but when no in lockdown it is better to actually see people. Oculus Quest games promote a lot of activity for many people who would be couch potatoes without it but maybe is not so good for someone who is already training or working in physical job and need some rest time. Bottom line, it depends
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
rexreed 5y ago
Don't we all know the story of causation vs correlation? Here's some more interesting correlations: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kjh2110/the-10-most-bizarre-correlations https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kjh2110/the-10-most-biz...
- vlunkr 5y ago
  The title says "correlated" so they're not necessarily claiming causation.
  - rexreed 5y ago
    That's exactly my point. Without any causation, any correlation can be and often is spurious, so as to make the correlation meaningless.
gabrielsroka 5y ago
Has anyone read Jane McGonigal's books on the subject? I read "Reality Is Broken" a while ago but I don't remember the conclusion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_McGonigal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_McGonigal
GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago
I've noticed something improving after using FPSs - my hand-eye is better. Noticeably better. IRL if something starts to accidentally drop off a shelf, 10 out of 10 times, I will catch it. ok maybe 19 out of 20, but there is this 'peripheral vision enhancement' coupled with 'gotta get this noob before s/he gets me!' that -- for me at least -- results in real-world gain. Now, is it worth 45 mins/day to do this? I dunno, different discussion I suppose.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  You are getting downvoted, but this dovetails nicely with my experience. I used to have not-so-good reflexes. Then I started to play FPS games a little more seriously without the usual "bullet time modes", and my reflexes improved markedly - including the ability to catch falling items most of the time, which I didn't have before.
- skeaker 5y ago
  There are plenty of anecdotes of games having real world skill benefits that I think people overlook. One of my favorites is a friend who ended up majoring in business because of the in-game trade economy of Team Fortress 2 of all things, and also ended up marrying a woman he met through the game. TF2 basically shaped his entire adult life, and lately with the pandemic we've been going back to the game together online which has been wonderfully social. A personal anecdote for me would be Smash Bros Melee which completely reshaped my teenage life by giving me a huge friend group that played the game, taking me out to local tournaments where I met plenty of new people and broke out of my asocial shell, giving me an appreciation for traveling when I went long distance to major tournaments, and helping me understand how rewarding it feels to tangibly improve at a skill that you've been working hard on which has helped me immensely when it came time to learn new skills in college. Discussions of games being "good" or "bad" miss so many of these. Video games are another facet of life that you can do plenty with. Sure, there are awful, predatory games that exist to suck money and time out of the lonely, but there are games that exist to just have fun, games that teach actual valuable life lessons, and plenty of chances to use games to further your own life. Football is a good comparison because it is similarly meaningless on paper and easy to look down on (and I'll admit I used to do this myself), but it has absolutely changed the lives of uncountable people for the better in all sorts of ways. It really is more about how you use the tools that are given to you than the tools themselves.
danschumann 5y ago
Can you assert no conflict of interest if you play, or associate with people who play? Also, socially functioning people may play games because a majority plays games, and social function would be the cause. Is there a way to isolate game playing? Like a version of Tarzan where he's raised by a game? What about game playing vs reading novels?
FredPret 5y ago
My life took a dramatic turn for the better since I deleted Steam. Factorio was just too perfectly matched to my personality. Now I build things in real life. Slower, harder, more complex, but genuinely satisfying.
AtlasBarfed 5y ago
Aren't almost all mainstream video games precisely designed sequences of events to elicit feelings of accomplishment to induce emotional investment? I mean, except for Dark Souls.
vmception 5y ago
I like this article because it says what I want it to say
baud147258 5y ago
Well, correlation doesn't imply causation, no? As it doesn't mean that playing video increase your well-being. Because being able to play video game imply being not too destitute, having enough free time to play and being mentally healthy enough to play (just today I was reading a post on a video game forum, with a poster complaining he was too depressed to do anything, including play video games).
- NoPicklez 5y ago
  Everytime an article like this comes up, there's always someone who says "correlation doesn't imply causation". Which anyone who has done statistics 101 knows this and the article says in its title, that there is a positive correlation (not causation). It also acknowledges in its limitations that it cannot claim that play time has a causal affect on well-being. They also say in the abstract that they found only a small positive relation between gameplay and well-being.
otabdeveloper4 5y ago
So is smoking, I'm sure. (Especially if you ask a tobacco company.)

198 points by wallflower 5y ago

I play videogames because I love them (primary reason). I do have to specify I play mostly indie games, single player only (or couch/lan coop). That being said, they are great for slowly reducing my brain load. If I do something too "simple", my brain goes back to work: way more engaging and challenging. Videogames are (based on choice) somewhat of an hybrid in intensity, giving me the possibility to slowly reduce the brain load, so that a simple activity afterwards is possible, without thinking about work.

afavour 5y ago

I imagine this headline will be used by pro-gaming folks in just as disingenuous ways as anti-gaming folks use their studies. IMO, everything in moderation. Video games are fine unless they dominate your life, in which case you’re probably overdoing it.

FriendWithMoon 5y ago

They must have never played LoL.

grammarnazzzi 5y ago

This paper's lack of meaningful content and writing style makes me suspect it was generated by a bot

ArtDev 5y ago

All games are not the same. Plants vs. Zombies and Animal Crossing are fairly chill experiences.

cblconfederate 5y ago

This sounds reasonable. When people are depressed they re not much in the mood to play, right ?

WalterBright 5y ago

Or perhaps feeling poorly means one doesn't feel like playing video games.

AnthonyMouse 5y ago
Or having free time and money to spend playing video games comes from success and stability. I'm starting to wonder if correlational studies even produce better results than a random number generator.

jp_sc 5y ago

If you have time to play video games, you probably have time to sleep well and exercise... which is proved to be positively correlated with well-being

rsiwerz 5y ago
One need not exclude the other. You can do both;)
- Footkerchief 5y ago
  The point is that the correlation probably points to an underlying variable (e.g. leisure time) instead of direct causation.
falcolas 5y ago
You could say this about any leisure time activity, from interacting with friends to watching TV to reading books. Leisure time is not a bad thing, as the title says.
kube-system 5y ago
I'm curious as to whether these are actually correlated. I anecdotally doubt that video game players exercise at a higher rate than non players. Alternatively, I would guess that just generally having free time to spend in any way is a healthy thing. We already know that stress is correlated with worse outcomes. The study does mention that income could be a third causal variable, I think stress is probably a similarly correlated factor.
- dragontamer 5y ago
  You might be surprised. Take a look at Fly (DOTA professional gamer) for example: https://www.gosugamers.net/dota2/news/47182-fly-and-s4-out-of-og-join-eg https://www.gosugamers.net/dota2/news/47182-fly-and-s4-out-o... Turns out that a healthy body is correlated with reflexes. You need a level of workout activity if you want to be a professional-level video game player. The "fat and lazy" trope kinda-sorta works for maybe casual games. But a fit body means a fit mind, and a fit mind plays games at a higher level.

SeanFerree 5y ago

I agree. Of course, as with any thing, in moderation

spywaregorilla 5y ago

A few things: * only looking at animal crossing and a plants vs. zombies game. I can only speak to animal crossing but I wouldn't be surprised if that game sparks a lot more joy and well being than most. * They do some... weird visualization choices with bars going both up and down but both implying a positive impact. I've never seen this. Super weird. You can't even compare the two options. * R^2 of play time and well begin is 0.01. Technically significant.

r-zip 5y ago
> * R^2 of play time and well begin is 0.01. Technically significant. Wow, that's complete garbage!
- CobrastanJorji 5y ago
  Certainly sounds like garbage. I'd sort of expect random noise to produce an R^2 of around that value. But maybe for studies of human value that's normal? It's a peer reviewed study, so I'd hope it meets some basic standard for significance, but who knows? Is anyone familiar enough with psychology research to say how good or bad this is?
  - nwiswell 5y ago
    What that actually means is that if the observations are representative of the underlying reality, then 1% of happiness is explained by playing video games. We use p-values to determine whether a relationship is likely to actually exist based on observations. R^2 is a measure of the "strength" of the relationship, i.e. how much of the dependent variable is explained by the independent variable -- it is silent on the matter of whether the relationship is likely to actually exist.

dragontamer 5y ago

Correlation =/= causation. In particular, correlation goes both ways. Not only is "video game play positively correlated with well being", but so is "well being positively correlated with video game play". If we go back to the 1800s and look at masters at Chess, Shogi or Go / Baduk, we'll see that they're all well-off individuals.

kube-system 5y ago
The study mentions this on page 14, I'd paste a quote but the highlighting is wonky.
babygoat 5y ago
That's probably why they used the word correlated, and suggested how a causal relationship could be established.

Mikeb85 5y ago

I find video games definitely get the brain working, much in the same way as playing chess or other board games, thinking about problems, etc... Definitely more 'active' than consuming (most) media. I'd even theorize that video games have become so popular because our brains need some sort of conflict and stimulation; now that we're sedentary and no longer concerned with daily survival and conflict with the natural world/other tribes.

provobro 5y ago

Everything is fine in moderation. Everyone needs time to decompress from a long day in some way or another. If video games are your way to do that, that’s great

hiking-duude 5y ago
Testing to see if burner account is shadow banned

blackbrokkoli 5y ago

So they collaborated with EA, a company so infamous for anti-consumer practices like real-money gambling for minors that they are basically synonymous with "evil" within the gaming subculture and found out...that EA games make you happy! If you are actually interested in this topic, there are a lot of reviews including way longer periods, variables and genres. Of course, you still have to apply the same filter to sift through moral panic and game ads, but this study is even if not biased still unnecessarily limited in scope. Not a good base for a discussion IMO...

dragonwriter 5y ago
> and found out...that EA games make you happy! correlation does not indicate direction of causation; it is just as valid to conclude that happy people had more time to play games.
- bostonpete 5y ago
  And it may just be that happiness and video game playing are both correlated with something else, like having a lot of leisure time and/or a lot of discretionary spending money.
- AlphaSite 5y ago
  That’s generally how it’s been for me, the happier I am the more energy I have for habits like this, which take a non zero amount of effort to play. Conversely when I’m feeling down this is the first thing to go, I can desire to play and just sit there for hours not doing so.
  - tuatoru 5y ago
    Thank you for writing this.
robrenaud 5y ago
Do you have a summary of the research, given your interest in the topic?

curiousgal 5y ago

I think paper titles should be as thoroughly reviewed as their content. This goes for almost all psychology papers. Researchers should not generalize their results haphazardly. In this particular case, they have only looked at two particular video games. And yet they claim that video game play is correlated with well-being. I know that the title is technically correct but if you always have to resort to such cheap tactics to make your research seem relevant then the entire field should be put into question. There is no way you'd find a paper in CS titled "An optimal solution to the Traveling Salesman Problem" when the paper has only solved a constrained, limited version of the problem.

Ancalagon 5y ago

Definitely anecdotal but I think a lot faster because of the mental workout that comes from fast-paced fighter games and shooters. Additionally, some fighter pilots noted over the years that new generations of pilots had faster reflexes than their older peers specifically because the younger generations had gotten into the habit of playing lots of video games growing up.

GhettoComputers 5y ago
What games were they playing? PvZ and Animal Crossing? ;) Stimulations are different, and you can see gaming influences like F1 wheels. https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/en/news/2019/03/how-does-an-f1-steering-wheel-work/ https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/en/news/2019/03/how-does-an-f1... Gran Turismo also helps drivers. https://www.industrytap.com/worlds-best-gran-turismo-video-game-player-now-professional-race-car-driver/24297 https://www.industrytap.com/worlds-best-gran-turismo-video-g... https://drivemag.com/news/uk-policemen-use-gran-turismo-sport-as-driving-skills-enhancer https://drivemag.com/news/uk-policemen-use-gran-turismo-spor...
- Ancalagon 5y ago
  Surprisingly, one fighter pilot mentioned mario kart. A helicopter pilot I personally know in the Marines also said mario kart!
matheusmoreira 5y ago
I remember reading a study claiming that realistic tridimensional simulations are correlated with visuospatial intelligence.

TimTheTinker 5y ago

What a surprise. A study involving a gaming company shows that games are good for you. Studies funded by tobacco companies in the 1950s found that smoking cigarettes is good for you as well.

cle 5y ago
And also, studies funded by education companies show that reading is good for you.
- TimTheTinker 5y ago
  I'm not saying games are necessarily bad, just that this study's conflict of interest makes its conclusions worthless.
  - Ensorceled 5y ago
    > this study's conflict of interest makes its conclusions worthless. "suspect" ... surely you meant "suspect" and not "worthless" ...
deleted 5y ago
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onemoresoop 5y ago

If one is depressed they are likely not keen on gaming either. Conversely, when in good mood activities such as gaming or whatever hobbies people have are on the rise so this one is pretty obvious how it generally relates to well being. In my opinion too much gaming can't be good for you but some moderate amount could be a decent stimulant. For good wellbeing we need to satisfy a few more needs and a surplus of one does not compensate for the others.

flavius29663 5y ago
> If one is depressed they are likely not keen on gaming either Do you have a source for that? In my anecdotal opinion, video games offer a refuge from the real life that can be helpful in depressions. It's addictive and causes addiction style issues, but that is another story.
- allemagne 5y ago
  My guess would be that it would vary a lot by game and by person. Sometimes even getting started on video games that I know I would enjoy seems like "too much work".
- jabroni_salad 5y ago
  For me it becomes more difficult to get started on anything. Once I get some momentum it isn't as bad but eventually there will be a moment of 'this is doing nothing' and crash out. That isn't so bad for solo play but most of my playtime is co-op games like Deep Rock or Vermintide and I am lucky to have an IRL friend group to play them with.
- onemoresoop 5y ago
  It is my personal opinion, sorry, I should have mentioned that. When depressed I don't feel like doing anything at all, I lack stamina and feel weak. The refuge/escapism part is when I'm less depressed but still am ruminating on how pointless everything is and that's when escapism does its trick. While it helps at the moment I don't think escaping reality does us any good in the long run though.
- 5y ago

Borrible 5y ago

A little hint for contract researchers of the video game industry: Its regime would be more impressed with the finding, video games provide to strengthen the People's Republic of China's defense forces. It doesn't care for the well-being of individuals. It cares for the well-being of the Chinese Nation.

GhettoComputers 5y ago

Collaboration with EA? Let’s see how much well being they have after playing this war of mine. Correlation with self reported well being could be applied to opiate use. Let’s try > People have never used more prescription opiate medication and no stakeholders are worried that this activity might be bad. So far, research has not had adequate data to test whether these worries are justified and if policymakers should act to more heavily regulate opiates. We attempt to provide much-needed evidence with adequate data. Whereas previous research had to rely on self-reported opiate use, we collaborated with two drug companies, Purdue Pharma and Johnson and Johnson, to obtain user’s actual drug usage behavior. We surveyed users of Oxycodone and Dilaudid for their well-being, motivations, and need satisfaction during drugs and merged their responses with prescription data. Contrary to many fears that excessive drug prescribing will lead to addiction and poor mental health, we found a positive relation between drug use and affective well-being. Need satisfaction and motivations during use did not interact with high time but were instead independently related to well-being. Our results advance the field in two important ways. First, we show that collaborations with industry partners can be done to high academic standards in an ethical and transparent fashion. Second, we deliver much-needed evidence to policymakers on the link between drugs and mental health. (Self reported surveys are not ever scientific I don’t know how they can say high standards and post this after) > Another limiting factor on the confidence in our results is the low response rate observed in both of our surveys. It is possible that various selection effects might have led to unrepresentative estimates of well-being, drug usage, or their relationship. Increasing response rates, while at the same time ensuring samples’ representativeness, remains a challenge for future studies in this field.

glennonymous 5y ago

The many skeptical comments on this thread are well founded, however the idea that video games positively correlate with well-being seems to resonate with my own experience. When I have downtime nowadays, I often tune out by listening to podcasts while playing video games on my phone. I jokingly refer to this with my wife as “dial tone mode”. This doesn’t take the place of reading; I read a lot of articles and books, both fiction and non-fiction. I reckon I read much more since I acquired a smart phone and basically carry a library in my pocket FWIW. But I don’t think reading serves the same function as dial tone mode. I suffer from depression and anxiety. When I’m not reading, I don’t usually sit around and have wonderful ideas. Instead, I listen to the often nasty voices in my head telling me there’s something terribly wrong with me and my life. This is especially true if I’m stressed out. Dial tone mode feels therapeutic to me, and iPhone video games are a part of that. I’m quite aware I could be wrong, even about my interpretation of my own experience. But so it seems to me.

ammanley 5y ago
fellow depression+anxiety+spectrum compatriot; I echo your experience, and do not think you're wrong that (video) games can and are a valuable coping tool against the nasty voices that like to try to run our minds.
grammarnazzzi 5y ago
That's fine as long as you have balance in your life. Probably healthy as long as most of your time is spent doing something meaningful to you. But if most of your discretionary time is spent doing unimportant things, that can contribute to depression and anxiety. "Dial tone mode" sounds a lot like the checking out alcoholics, drug users and other people suffering from compulsive disorders waste their lives doing.
- CobrastanJorji 5y ago
  I'm no expert, but there's probably a balance. There are certainly some benefits to zoning out for a bit, but there's also an opportunity cost. Spending N hours a week in dial tone mode is likely a good idea, but spending A LOT of time idling is probably not ideal (for whatever your definition of an ideal life is).

throwaway_cG7pW 5y ago

I read only title but I'm interested in video games. If you are interested in this subject I recommend watching this video from Game Developer's Conference: "How the Industry Can Change the "Games Are Bad" Narrative" (27 minutes) [1]. It is commentary about current situation - how public opinion sees games and how change opinion to be it more based on actual data and facts. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH7FfRwgJwc https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iH7FfRwgJwc

tablespoon 5y ago

> In this study, we investigate the relations between video games and positive mental health, namely affective well- being of players (from here on called well-being).... > We designed a survey measuring players’ well-being, self-reported play, and motivations for play and discussed the survey structure with Electronic Arts. > We assessed well-being with the validated Scale of Positive and Negative Experiences [59], which measures the affective dimension of well-being [38]. We asked respondents to think about how they had been feeling in the past two weeks and report how often they experienced each of six positive and six negative feelings. If you gave heroin addicts and unrestricted supply of heroin and performed a similar study, would you find that heroin use is "positively correlated with will being"? I have a young toddler. When I was reading about letting them watch TV, an article I read made a good point: babies and toddlers enjoy watching TV, but it doesn't do them any good (they're too young to make sense of the pictures) and tends to deprive them of experiences (e.g. language exposure) actually that does do them good. My intuition is video games are similar for adults.

meursault 5y ago
My mind immediately went to surveying the participants in a Skinner box on their perceived well being. It would be incredible if people DIDN'T self-report feeling great after pulling the dopamine levers
matheusmoreira 5y ago
No idea why you're being downvoted. The vast majority of today's games are literally designed from the ground up to be habit forming. They use timed random rewards in order to impose schedules on players. EA is of course a major offender, it's one of the reasons why they are universally hated. The article essentially concludes that being rewarded feels good in the short term. What I'd like to see is long-term happiness and socioeconomic impact.
_carbyau_ 5y ago
I don't have a research article, but yeah, I see problem gaming as being a similar problem as alcoholism. To "wind down" is ok, IE in small amounts. But when it overwhelms and becomes a "drive to escape reality" it is an issue. But often(not always), both are being used to escape some OTHER issue. And maybe if that issue was worked on life would truly be better.

gosukiwi 5y ago

laughs in League of Legends

abledon 5y ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/qv5jtg/tyler_spectates_a_guy_whose_1_win_away_from/ https://www.reddit.com/r/LivestreamFail/comments/qv5jtg/tyle... from last nights challenger cut off series... definitely correlated with wellbeing

golemiprague 5y ago

It depends what game and what is the context. During corona times online collaborative games helped my kids staying in touch with their friends but when no in lockdown it is better to actually see people. Oculus Quest games promote a lot of activity for many people who would be couch potatoes without it but maybe is not so good for someone who is already training or working in physical job and need some rest time. Bottom line, it depends

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rexreed 5y ago

Don't we all know the story of causation vs correlation? Here's some more interesting correlations: https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kjh2110/the-10-most-bizarre-correlations https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/kjh2110/the-10-most-biz...

vlunkr 5y ago
The title says "correlated" so they're not necessarily claiming causation.
- rexreed 5y ago
  That's exactly my point. Without any causation, any correlation can be and often is spurious, so as to make the correlation meaningless.

gabrielsroka 5y ago

Has anyone read Jane McGonigal's books on the subject? I read "Reality Is Broken" a while ago but I don't remember the conclusion. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_McGonigal https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jane_McGonigal

GeorgeTirebiter 5y ago

I've noticed something improving after using FPSs - my hand-eye is better. Noticeably better. IRL if something starts to accidentally drop off a shelf, 10 out of 10 times, I will catch it. ok maybe 19 out of 20, but there is this 'peripheral vision enhancement' coupled with 'gotta get this noob before s/he gets me!' that -- for me at least -- results in real-world gain. Now, is it worth 45 mins/day to do this? I dunno, different discussion I suppose.

selfhoster11 5y ago
You are getting downvoted, but this dovetails nicely with my experience. I used to have not-so-good reflexes. Then I started to play FPS games a little more seriously without the usual "bullet time modes", and my reflexes improved markedly - including the ability to catch falling items most of the time, which I didn't have before.
skeaker 5y ago
There are plenty of anecdotes of games having real world skill benefits that I think people overlook. One of my favorites is a friend who ended up majoring in business because of the in-game trade economy of Team Fortress 2 of all things, and also ended up marrying a woman he met through the game. TF2 basically shaped his entire adult life, and lately with the pandemic we've been going back to the game together online which has been wonderfully social. A personal anecdote for me would be Smash Bros Melee which completely reshaped my teenage life by giving me a huge friend group that played the game, taking me out to local tournaments where I met plenty of new people and broke out of my asocial shell, giving me an appreciation for traveling when I went long distance to major tournaments, and helping me understand how rewarding it feels to tangibly improve at a skill that you've been working hard on which has helped me immensely when it came time to learn new skills in college. Discussions of games being "good" or "bad" miss so many of these. Video games are another facet of life that you can do plenty with. Sure, there are awful, predatory games that exist to suck money and time out of the lonely, but there are games that exist to just have fun, games that teach actual valuable life lessons, and plenty of chances to use games to further your own life. Football is a good comparison because it is similarly meaningless on paper and easy to look down on (and I'll admit I used to do this myself), but it has absolutely changed the lives of uncountable people for the better in all sorts of ways. It really is more about how you use the tools that are given to you than the tools themselves.

danschumann 5y ago

Can you assert no conflict of interest if you play, or associate with people who play? Also, socially functioning people may play games because a majority plays games, and social function would be the cause. Is there a way to isolate game playing? Like a version of Tarzan where he's raised by a game? What about game playing vs reading novels?

FredPret 5y ago

My life took a dramatic turn for the better since I deleted Steam. Factorio was just too perfectly matched to my personality. Now I build things in real life. Slower, harder, more complex, but genuinely satisfying.

AtlasBarfed 5y ago

Aren't almost all mainstream video games precisely designed sequences of events to elicit feelings of accomplishment to induce emotional investment? I mean, except for Dark Souls.

vmception 5y ago

I like this article because it says what I want it to say

baud147258 5y ago

Well, correlation doesn't imply causation, no? As it doesn't mean that playing video increase your well-being. Because being able to play video game imply being not too destitute, having enough free time to play and being mentally healthy enough to play (just today I was reading a post on a video game forum, with a poster complaining he was too depressed to do anything, including play video games).

NoPicklez 5y ago
Everytime an article like this comes up, there's always someone who says "correlation doesn't imply causation". Which anyone who has done statistics 101 knows this and the article says in its title, that there is a positive correlation (not causation). It also acknowledges in its limitations that it cannot claim that play time has a causal affect on well-being. They also say in the abstract that they found only a small positive relation between gameplay and well-being.

otabdeveloper4 5y ago

So is smoking, I'm sure. (Especially if you ask a tobacco company.)