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> "Plans" can never be set in stone Setting plans in stone was the entire Waterfall Methodology where contracts had requirements and milestones locked in and a

> "Plans" can never be set in stone Setting plans in stone was the entire Waterfall Methodology where contracts had requirements and milestones locked in and any deviation meant heavy penalties.

flawedbydesign 5y ago
The first formal detailed diagram of the process later known as the "waterfall model" is often cited as a 1970 article by Winston W. Royce. However he also felt it had major flaws stemming from the fact that testing only happened at the end of the process, which he described as being "risky and invites failure". The rest of his paper introduced five steps which he felt were necessary to "eliminate most of the development risks" associated with the unaltered waterfall approach. Royce's five additional steps (which included writing complete documentation at various stages of development) never took mainstream hold, but his diagram of what he considered a flawed process became the starting point when describing a "waterfall" approach. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model#History
DnDGrognard 5y ago
Not when I have done waterfall - each waterfall phase can iterate
- alfiedotwtf 5y ago
  Show me a Software Engineering book that calls Waterfall that can iterate "Waterfall" rather than "Spiral" or "Iterative".
  - rramadass 5y ago
    There is a big difference between the stages involved in "Waterfall Model" and the various techniques of combining, using and transitioning from one stage to another. "Waterfall" specifies the What while "Spiral and Iterative" specify the How.
rramadass 5y ago
Absolutely Categorically Wrong! This has been so endlessly repeated without thought that people assume it is a fact when the Truth is far from it. Excerpts from wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model ; * In 1983 the paper was republished with a foreword by Benington explaining that the phases were on purpose organised according to the specialisation of tasks, and pointing out that the process was not in fact performed in a strict top-down fashion, but depended on a prototype. * Royce's five additional steps (which included writing complete documentation at various stages of development) never took mainstream hold, but his diagram of what he considered a flawed process became the starting point when describing a "waterfall" approach. * In 1985, the United States Department of Defense captured this approach in DOD-STD-2167A[citation needed], their standards for working with software development contractors, which stated that "the contractor shall implement a software development cycle that includes the following six phases: Software Requirement Analysis, Preliminary Design, Detailed Design, Coding and Unit Testing, Integration, and Testing. The "Waterfall" is what is imagined as a "Ideal and Rational" process (see D.L.Parnas' paper A Rational Design Process: How and Why to Fake it for motivation - https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6312940 https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6312940). The stages in the model and the issues to be considered in each stage are what is important NOT their order. In practice it was always a iterative spiral model described by Barry Boehm - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiral_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiral_model
- alfiedotwtf 5y ago
  Maybe you've never done big government contracts.
  - rramadass 5y ago
    Totally irrelevant and no Ad Hominem please. FYI, D.L.Parnas and Barry Boehm defined the field of Software Engineering. Almost all Govt./DoD standards are based on their research and writings.
    - alfiedotwtf 5y ago

> "Plans" can never be set in stone Setting plans in stone was the entire Waterfall Methodology where contracts had requirements and milestones locked in and any deviation meant heavy penalties.

flawedbydesign 5y ago

The first formal detailed diagram of the process later known as the "waterfall model" is often cited as a 1970 article by Winston W. Royce. However he also felt it had major flaws stemming from the fact that testing only happened at the end of the process, which he described as being "risky and invites failure". The rest of his paper introduced five steps which he felt were necessary to "eliminate most of the development risks" associated with the unaltered waterfall approach. Royce's five additional steps (which included writing complete documentation at various stages of development) never took mainstream hold, but his diagram of what he considered a flawed process became the starting point when describing a "waterfall" approach. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model#History https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model#History

DnDGrognard 5y ago

Not when I have done waterfall - each waterfall phase can iterate

alfiedotwtf 5y ago
Show me a Software Engineering book that calls Waterfall that can iterate "Waterfall" rather than "Spiral" or "Iterative".
- rramadass 5y ago
  There is a big difference between the stages involved in "Waterfall Model" and the various techniques of combining, using and transitioning from one stage to another. "Waterfall" specifies the What while "Spiral and Iterative" specify the How.

rramadass 5y ago

Absolutely Categorically Wrong! This has been so endlessly repeated without thought that people assume it is a fact when the Truth is far from it. Excerpts from wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Waterfall_model ; * In 1983 the paper was republished with a foreword by Benington explaining that the phases were on purpose organised according to the specialisation of tasks, and pointing out that the process was not in fact performed in a strict top-down fashion, but depended on a prototype. * Royce's five additional steps (which included writing complete documentation at various stages of development) never took mainstream hold, but his diagram of what he considered a flawed process became the starting point when describing a "waterfall" approach. * In 1985, the United States Department of Defense captured this approach in DOD-STD-2167A[citation needed], their standards for working with software development contractors, which stated that "the contractor shall implement a software development cycle that includes the following six phases: Software Requirement Analysis, Preliminary Design, Detailed Design, Coding and Unit Testing, Integration, and Testing. The "Waterfall" is what is imagined as a "Ideal and Rational" process (see D.L.Parnas' paper A Rational Design Process: How and Why to Fake it for motivation - https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6312940 https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/6312940). The stages in the model and the issues to be considered in each stage are what is important NOT their order. In practice it was always a iterative spiral model described by Barry Boehm - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiral_model https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spiral_model

alfiedotwtf 5y ago
Maybe you've never done big government contracts.
- rramadass 5y ago
  Totally irrelevant and no Ad Hominem please. FYI, D.L.Parnas and Barry Boehm defined the field of Software Engineering. Almost all Govt./DoD standards are based on their research and writings.
  - alfiedotwtf 5y ago