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This was likely due to the anti satellite test performed by Russia. There really needs to be international law completely forbidding tests like this. Kessler Sy

This was likely due to the anti satellite test performed by Russia. There really needs to be international law completely forbidding tests like this. Kessler Syndrome would do much more damage than just keep us from getting to space. Life as we know it today does not exist without satellites.

PeterisP 5y ago
> There really needs to be international law completely forbidding Just to note, there's literally nothing of this form currently existing or possible - international law consists of treaties to which the countries have agreed, so such a treaty forbidding something would be binding to Russia if and only if Russia agrees to sign the treaty. In international law, sovereignty is the ultimate power, authority and/or jurisdiction over a people and a territory. Like, there is treaty forbidding landmines, but it don't forbid landmines to those who haven't signed it e.g. Russia, USA and China; there's a treaty prohibiting proliferation of nuclear weapons, which does not prohibit it to those who haven't signed e.g. India, Pakistan and Israel, and so on. Countries are sovereign and have full rights of self-determination, there isn't any world government that would be somehow superior to the countries and there are no ways to pass some "international law" to forbid them something unless they choose to. Well, unless you can "motivate" that choice which credible threats of excessive violence, but that doesn't apply to countries who have the nuclear veto power.
LogonType10 5y ago
Hopefully the space force gets abolished just as other commenters want so that no one is left to enforce this international law.
- anadem 5y ago
  You can't seriously imagine that "the space force" could enforce something? Space farce.
jazzyjackson 5y ago
> Life as we know it today does not exist without satellites. Pilots and ship captains will have to navigate the old fashioned way, and I could be wrong but I believe radio is still the default for communications, weather reports etc. so i’m curious what i’m missing besides Google Maps not holding my hand to the grocery store. an economic impact surely, but life as we know it?
- barbegal 5y ago
  Satellites give better performance but there is no reason why a ground based system can't work just as well. LORAN gave accuracy to a hundred metres or so across a good portion of the globe https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/navigating-air/navigation-at-war/new-era-in-time-and-navigation/loran https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/navigating-air/navigation-a... Most location services on a phone are performed using WiFi and cellular data rather than GPS except in remote areas. With modern technology an array of autonomous radio transmitter buoys could give the same accuracy as GPS.
- _moof 5y ago
  Indeed. I'm perfectly fine with VOR/DME/ILS in the air and a sextant at sea. It's an irresponsible captain that can't navigate without GPS.
  - yread 5y ago
    We don't need to go all the way back to sextant. We have radar, sonar and radio beacons. It would lead to more shipwrecks though as not all the places in the world have enough buoys or good charts
  - williamtrask 5y ago
    Or a captain in cloudy weather
- MisterBiggs 5y ago
  Agriculture is heavily reliant tons of satellite data that couldn't be gathered otherwise. Logistics would suffer at least on the short term but I'm sure ground based technology would be sufficient in the long run. As long as your in a populated area your phone would know where you are. Hundreds of millions of people rely on satellite internet for income, education, entertainment, social life. The world wouldn't end but it would definitely be worse.
DocTomoe 5y ago
And if someone breaks that law, then what? Are you willing to risk a nuclear exchange over this? International law is a cute little thing, much like club rules at the country club. With the absence of a Leviathan, often broken and worse: unenforceable against most influential participants.

PeterisP 5y ago

> There really needs to be international law completely forbidding Just to note, there's literally nothing of this form currently existing or possible - international law consists of treaties to which the countries have agreed, so such a treaty forbidding something would be binding to Russia if and only if Russia agrees to sign the treaty. In international law, sovereignty is the ultimate power, authority and/or jurisdiction over a people and a territory. Like, there is treaty forbidding landmines, but it don't forbid landmines to those who haven't signed it e.g. Russia, USA and China; there's a treaty prohibiting proliferation of nuclear weapons, which does not prohibit it to those who haven't signed e.g. India, Pakistan and Israel, and so on. Countries are sovereign and have full rights of self-determination, there isn't any world government that would be somehow superior to the countries and there are no ways to pass some "international law" to forbid them something unless they choose to. Well, unless you can "motivate" that choice which credible threats of excessive violence, but that doesn't apply to countries who have the nuclear veto power.

LogonType10 5y ago

Hopefully the space force gets abolished just as other commenters want so that no one is left to enforce this international law.

anadem 5y ago
You can't seriously imagine that "the space force" could enforce something? Space farce.

jazzyjackson 5y ago

> Life as we know it today does not exist without satellites. Pilots and ship captains will have to navigate the old fashioned way, and I could be wrong but I believe radio is still the default for communications, weather reports etc. so i’m curious what i’m missing besides Google Maps not holding my hand to the grocery store. an economic impact surely, but life as we know it?

barbegal 5y ago
Satellites give better performance but there is no reason why a ground based system can't work just as well. LORAN gave accuracy to a hundred metres or so across a good portion of the globe https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/navigating-air/navigation-at-war/new-era-in-time-and-navigation/loran https://timeandnavigation.si.edu/navigating-air/navigation-a... Most location services on a phone are performed using WiFi and cellular data rather than GPS except in remote areas. With modern technology an array of autonomous radio transmitter buoys could give the same accuracy as GPS.
_moof 5y ago
Indeed. I'm perfectly fine with VOR/DME/ILS in the air and a sextant at sea. It's an irresponsible captain that can't navigate without GPS.
- yread 5y ago
  We don't need to go all the way back to sextant. We have radar, sonar and radio beacons. It would lead to more shipwrecks though as not all the places in the world have enough buoys or good charts
- williamtrask 5y ago
  Or a captain in cloudy weather
MisterBiggs 5y ago
Agriculture is heavily reliant tons of satellite data that couldn't be gathered otherwise. Logistics would suffer at least on the short term but I'm sure ground based technology would be sufficient in the long run. As long as your in a populated area your phone would know where you are. Hundreds of millions of people rely on satellite internet for income, education, entertainment, social life. The world wouldn't end but it would definitely be worse.

DocTomoe 5y ago

And if someone breaks that law, then what? Are you willing to risk a nuclear exchange over this? International law is a cute little thing, much like club rules at the country club. With the absence of a Leviathan, often broken and worse: unenforceable against most influential participants.