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Isn't this just a market opportunity for other companies? Google isn't the only company that owns the field of information retrieval. They just came the right

by fault1 5y ago

Isn't this just a market opportunity for other companies? Google isn't the only company that owns the field of information retrieval. They just came the right place/right time after the .com crash.

eftychis 5y ago
Are you going to vote with your money and pay for such a company to exist is the right question I would say.
sm4rk0 5y ago
It is in a perfect market, but Google holds the monopoly and the game is set against competition.
- fault1 5y ago
  A monopoly for information retrieval? Surely not. For online ads? Sure you can make that case. Their business in the end is based on delivering relevant content. If there is a market for the traffic Google refuses to host, then there are probably market opportunities there.
  - sm4rk0 5y ago
    For video-sharing platforms. 1. When you buy an Android phone there's a good chance that YouTube app is preinstalled. 2. If you search the net for "how to do XYZ" or for any song you'll get 99% video results from YouTube. 3. Almost every company/celebrity/influencer/... has a YouTube account and until recently (TikTok, Odysee, BitChute,...) alternative platforms (Vimeo, Dailymotion,...) were mostly a niche market.
imwillofficial 5y ago
And how is it a fair market when the government subsidies give google et al a home field advantage?
- fault1 5y ago
  government subsidies?
colordrops 5y ago
There are a couple problems with the "market opportunity" argument. The first is that no, there isn't a market opportunity due to network and monopolistic forces. The second is that there is a fundamental issue with the system itself, whereby both state and private establishment players eventually force any player with a large piece of the market to do things like censor certain narratives.
- rabuse 5y ago
  While I agree that network effects play a large role in entrenchment, I wouldn't be so surprised if smaller players start swooping up the dissenters and begin slowly chipping away at the giants.
  - phone8675309 5y ago
    Monopoly power and political access means you can both strangle your competitors in the grave and then use regulatory capture to regulate them out of competitiveness if they survive your initial choking attempt. Time it right and you can have a set of regulations tailored to your competitors that only minimally impact you and then, when the next party gets its turn at power and all of your competitors are dead, get those regulations removed in the next big wave of corporate deregulation. It really is a sweet game. Too bad we'll never get to play it.
BitwiseFool 5y ago
In principle, yes. But Google seems to hold a unique position because of network effects. Countless YouTube clones have been created but none ever seem to gain enough critical mass to become viable competitors. Trying to build a competing platform on the value proposition of being anti-censorship is also fraught with perception issues.
- oriki 5y ago
  I mean, not just perception issues, but also the fact that you're inherently setting yourself up to build a platform with a core userbase of "People banned from [the more popular version of the platform they're cloning]." You build VidMe and the first people interested in VidMe are people that got kicked off of YouTube, which it turns out are rarely oppressed free speech advocates and much more often trolls and similarly unwanted individuals. If your userbase is entirely toxic, nobody wants to stay there, and your platform never really succeeds because of that. It's worth noting that I'm loosely parroting the content of a Folding Ideas video[1] that covers the discussion of the creator vs platform relationship overall. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3snVCRo_bI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3snVCRo_bI
gwright 5y ago
> Isn't this just a market opportunity for other companies? Perhaps but that doesn't preclude criticizing those editorial choices as harmful (false narratives, ideological bubbles, general free-speech principles).

by fault1 5y ago

Isn't this just a market opportunity for other companies? Google isn't the only company that owns the field of information retrieval. They just came the right place/right time after the .com crash.

eftychis 5y ago

Are you going to vote with your money and pay for such a company to exist is the right question I would say.

sm4rk0 5y ago

It is in a perfect market, but Google holds the monopoly and the game is set against competition.

fault1 5y ago
A monopoly for information retrieval? Surely not. For online ads? Sure you can make that case. Their business in the end is based on delivering relevant content. If there is a market for the traffic Google refuses to host, then there are probably market opportunities there.
- sm4rk0 5y ago
  For video-sharing platforms. 1. When you buy an Android phone there's a good chance that YouTube app is preinstalled. 2. If you search the net for "how to do XYZ" or for any song you'll get 99% video results from YouTube. 3. Almost every company/celebrity/influencer/... has a YouTube account and until recently (TikTok, Odysee, BitChute,...) alternative platforms (Vimeo, Dailymotion,...) were mostly a niche market.

imwillofficial 5y ago

And how is it a fair market when the government subsidies give google et al a home field advantage?

fault1 5y ago
government subsidies?

colordrops 5y ago

There are a couple problems with the "market opportunity" argument. The first is that no, there isn't a market opportunity due to network and monopolistic forces. The second is that there is a fundamental issue with the system itself, whereby both state and private establishment players eventually force any player with a large piece of the market to do things like censor certain narratives.

rabuse 5y ago
While I agree that network effects play a large role in entrenchment, I wouldn't be so surprised if smaller players start swooping up the dissenters and begin slowly chipping away at the giants.
- phone8675309 5y ago
  Monopoly power and political access means you can both strangle your competitors in the grave and then use regulatory capture to regulate them out of competitiveness if they survive your initial choking attempt. Time it right and you can have a set of regulations tailored to your competitors that only minimally impact you and then, when the next party gets its turn at power and all of your competitors are dead, get those regulations removed in the next big wave of corporate deregulation. It really is a sweet game. Too bad we'll never get to play it.

BitwiseFool 5y ago

In principle, yes. But Google seems to hold a unique position because of network effects. Countless YouTube clones have been created but none ever seem to gain enough critical mass to become viable competitors. Trying to build a competing platform on the value proposition of being anti-censorship is also fraught with perception issues.

oriki 5y ago
I mean, not just perception issues, but also the fact that you're inherently setting yourself up to build a platform with a core userbase of "People banned from [the more popular version of the platform they're cloning]." You build VidMe and the first people interested in VidMe are people that got kicked off of YouTube, which it turns out are rarely oppressed free speech advocates and much more often trolls and similarly unwanted individuals. If your userbase is entirely toxic, nobody wants to stay there, and your platform never really succeeds because of that. It's worth noting that I'm loosely parroting the content of a Folding Ideas video[1] that covers the discussion of the creator vs platform relationship overall. [1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3snVCRo_bI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3snVCRo_bI

gwright 5y ago

> Isn't this just a market opportunity for other companies? Perhaps but that doesn't preclude criticizing those editorial choices as harmful (false narratives, ideological bubbles, general free-speech principles).