3 ms·

That link completely glosses over the fact that UK electrical networks are one big ring circuit instead of a radial circuit. This is because during WW2 they nee

by jorvi 5y ago

That link completely glosses over the fact that UK electrical networks are one big ring circuit instead of a radial circuit. This is because during WW2 they needed the metal savings, and this is also why every UK plug is fused and quite bulky. IMO the EU way is the best. Radial circuit, fused in groups, and the plug is either the Schuko plug (very safe since the earth/ground is always engaged first) or Europlug (relatively safe because it is only allowed for low class power appliances). Both type of plugs can be angled, although it is quite rare for an Europlug to be.

fy20 5y ago
Ignoring the circuit design and fuse location (which I agree with you on), the child proofing of British sockets is much better than Schuko sockets (CEE 7/3), as they require the ground pin to be engaged before protective cover of the live/neutral pins is opened - it's impossible to open just by pushing something in the live socket. How does this work with child proof Schuko sockets (I've never seen them)? Also as someone who lived in both the UK and now a Schuko country, I do sometimes miss having a switch on the socket :-) We have a floor lamp without a switch, so we have to physically unplug it to turn it off.
- atoav 5y ago
  AFAIK in childproof Schuko there is a lid covering the holes for neutral and phase and you have to press into both holes at once to open that lid up. The force to do so is also not insignificant. If I had to overcome it on purpose with two knitting needles I would fail as a grown up man. With two screwdrivers I could do it.
- globular-toast 5y ago
  > Also as someone who lived in both the UK and now a Schuko country, I do sometimes miss having a switch on the socket :-) We have a floor lamp without a switch, so we have to physically unplug it to turn it off. I've actually heard Americans make fun of our (UK) switches on the outlets. Usually something to the effect of "need to make sure the electric doesn't escape, when things are unplugged, lol". It completely misses the point. The point of the switches is we have a way to isolate a device without unplugging it. Without the switch the only way to isolate the thing is pull the cord out of the wall like some kind of neanderthal.
KaiserPro 5y ago
Schuko plug (very safe since the earth/ground is always engaged first) or Europlug (relatively safe because it is only allowed for low class power appliances) the problem is that they don't have contact covers. What I like about the British plug is that its closed most of the time, and really really difficult to put stuff in the live/neutral. That has advantages for safety, but also cleanliness. It cuts down dust ingress.
- f1refly 5y ago
  They can have contact covers no problem, it's just not in the plug standard. Every couple with kids I know installed socket safety protectors[0] in their power outlets if they wheren't int there already. Some built in ones just require to push the plug in a bit harder, but for even better safety turning ones as in the amazon link are available. [0] https://www.amazon.de/dp/B00CNRFU2Q https://www.amazon.de/dp/B00CNRFU2Q
traceroute66 5y ago
>metal savings.... why every UK plug is fused Metal savings is why every plug is fused ? How does that even make sense when historically fuses were all metal construct instead of the modern ceramic whatnots. And anyway, fused plugs were not a requirement until ... 1992: "That leave be given to bring in a Bill to amend the Plugs and Sockets Etc. (Safety) Regulations 1987 to require pre-wired plugs to be fitted to all domestic appliances by the manufacturer." (Citation: HC Deb, 29 January 1992, c955). As far as I know, the war has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with fuses in plugs. It was just introduced as part of the modernisation of UK electricity rules. If you look at historical houses, they still have/had central fuseboards with rewireable or cartridge fuses. See [1] The fuses on UK Plugs are for overload protection. Simple. See also this YouTube video for other reasons as to why UK plugs are the best[2]. Finally, if you have time on your hands, there is a 23 page treatise on the how's and why's of ring circuits. [3]. [1] https://electrical.theiet.org/wiring-matters/years/2021/84-march-2021/estimating-the-age-of-an-electrical-installation/ [2]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEfP1OKKz_Q [3] http://www.raymond-lai.com/-%20Online80/%E2%94%80Electrical%20&%20Mechanical%20Engineering%20%E6%A9%9F%E9%9B%BB%E5%B7%A5%E7%A8%8B/%E2%94%80Electricity%20%E9%9B%BB%E5%8A%9B/-%205%20In%20House%20Circuit%20%E5%AE%A4%E5%85%A7%E9%9B%BB%E8%B7%AF/-%20Circuits%20Sample%20%E7%B7%9A%E8%B7%AF%E4%BE%8B%E5%AD%90/13A%20Final%20Ring%20Circuit%20%E6%9C%80%E7%B5%82%E7%92%B0%E5%BD%A2%E9%9B%BB%E8%B7%AF/ring_circuits_-_history.pdf
- JetSetWilly 5y ago
  The plugs are part of the overall system they are in and are designed to that. If you have a ring circuit and 240volts like in the UK, then you had better have a plug that deals with common failure modes - switches on the sockets, fuses, ground as standard etc. If you have 120volts and a radial circuit then you can perhaps do without it. The US plug does have advantages, like being smaller. UK plugs are really annoyingly large and weighty.

by jorvi 5y ago

fy20 5y ago

Ignoring the circuit design and fuse location (which I agree with you on), the child proofing of British sockets is much better than Schuko sockets (CEE 7/3), as they require the ground pin to be engaged before protective cover of the live/neutral pins is opened - it's impossible to open just by pushing something in the live socket. How does this work with child proof Schuko sockets (I've never seen them)? Also as someone who lived in both the UK and now a Schuko country, I do sometimes miss having a switch on the socket :-) We have a floor lamp without a switch, so we have to physically unplug it to turn it off.

atoav 5y ago
AFAIK in childproof Schuko there is a lid covering the holes for neutral and phase and you have to press into both holes at once to open that lid up. The force to do so is also not insignificant. If I had to overcome it on purpose with two knitting needles I would fail as a grown up man. With two screwdrivers I could do it.
globular-toast 5y ago
> Also as someone who lived in both the UK and now a Schuko country, I do sometimes miss having a switch on the socket :-) We have a floor lamp without a switch, so we have to physically unplug it to turn it off. I've actually heard Americans make fun of our (UK) switches on the outlets. Usually something to the effect of "need to make sure the electric doesn't escape, when things are unplugged, lol". It completely misses the point. The point of the switches is we have a way to isolate a device without unplugging it. Without the switch the only way to isolate the thing is pull the cord out of the wall like some kind of neanderthal.

KaiserPro 5y ago

Schuko plug (very safe since the earth/ground is always engaged first) or Europlug (relatively safe because it is only allowed for low class power appliances) the problem is that they don't have contact covers. What I like about the British plug is that its closed most of the time, and really really difficult to put stuff in the live/neutral. That has advantages for safety, but also cleanliness. It cuts down dust ingress.

f1refly 5y ago
They can have contact covers no problem, it's just not in the plug standard. Every couple with kids I know installed socket safety protectors[0] in their power outlets if they wheren't int there already. Some built in ones just require to push the plug in a bit harder, but for even better safety turning ones as in the amazon link are available. [0] https://www.amazon.de/dp/B00CNRFU2Q https://www.amazon.de/dp/B00CNRFU2Q

traceroute66 5y ago

>metal savings.... why every UK plug is fused Metal savings is why every plug is fused ? How does that even make sense when historically fuses were all metal construct instead of the modern ceramic whatnots. And anyway, fused plugs were not a requirement until ... 1992: "That leave be given to bring in a Bill to amend the Plugs and Sockets Etc. (Safety) Regulations 1987 to require pre-wired plugs to be fitted to all domestic appliances by the manufacturer." (Citation: HC Deb, 29 January 1992, c955). As far as I know, the war has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with fuses in plugs. It was just introduced as part of the modernisation of UK electricity rules. If you look at historical houses, they still have/had central fuseboards with rewireable or cartridge fuses. See [1] The fuses on UK Plugs are for overload protection. Simple. See also this YouTube video for other reasons as to why UK plugs are the best[2]. Finally, if you have time on your hands, there is a 23 page treatise on the how's and why's of ring circuits. [3]. [1] https://electrical.theiet.org/wiring-matters/years/2021/84-march-2021/estimating-the-age-of-an-electrical-installation/ [2]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEfP1OKKz_Q [3] http://www.raymond-lai.com/-%20Online80/%E2%94%80Electrical%20&%20Mechanical%20Engineering%20%E6%A9%9F%E9%9B%BB%E5%B7%A5%E7%A8%8B/%E2%94%80Electricity%20%E9%9B%BB%E5%8A%9B/-%205%20In%20House%20Circuit%20%E5%AE%A4%E5%85%A7%E9%9B%BB%E8%B7%AF/-%20Circuits%20Sample%20%E7%B7%9A%E8%B7%AF%E4%BE%8B%E5%AD%90/13A%20Final%20Ring%20Circuit%20%E6%9C%80%E7%B5%82%E7%92%B0%E5%BD%A2%E9%9B%BB%E8%B7%AF/ring_circuits_-_history.pdf

JetSetWilly 5y ago
The plugs are part of the overall system they are in and are designed to that. If you have a ring circuit and 240volts like in the UK, then you had better have a plug that deals with common failure modes - switches on the sockets, fuses, ground as standard etc. If you have 120volts and a radial circuit then you can perhaps do without it. The US plug does have advantages, like being smaller. UK plugs are really annoyingly large and weighty.