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It doesn't makes any sense to compare a country with a population density of 25/km2 to one with 8,358/km2. Also, Singapore's deaths per positive test and deaths

by bryans 5y ago

It doesn't makes any sense to compare a country with a population density of 25/km2 to one with 8,358/km2. Also, Singapore's deaths per positive test and deaths per hospitalization are far lower even during the same outbreak period. Also, the suicide rates were already spiking by 19.15% in 2019, while the increase for 2020 was 13%, so to place the blame on lockdowns is misinformed and disingenuous, at best.

refurb 5y ago
Lies, damn lies and statistics. Why calculate density of Sweden based on the total country when most people live in a couple cities? That’s just lying. It’s like calculating Canada’s density over the Arctic when 80% live within 100 miles of the US border. And is my statistics about suicides wrong? 2020 was the highest since 2012?
- bryans 5y ago
  > Why calculate density of Sweden based on the total country when most people live in a couple cities? That’s just lying. It’s like calculating Canada’s density over the Arctic when 80% live within 100 miles of the US border. Even if you want to compare by Sweden's most dense region, it's still 282/km2 versus 8,358/km2. Your comparison makes no sense whatsoever. > And is my statistics about suicides wrong? 2020 was the highest since 2012? You weren't making some generalized point about suicides increasing (which would have been irrelevant to the conversation at hand), you were trying to imply that lockdowns were directly responsible for the increase, which the statistical trend refutes. Your commentary is intentionally disinformative.
  - refurb 5y ago
    https://www.worldscapitalcities.com/capital-facts-for-stockholm-sweden/ https://www.worldscapitalcities.com/capital-facts-for-stockh... ” Population density is concentrated within Stockholm including its immediately surrounding urban area, averaging 11,802 people per square mile (4,279 per square kilometer).” Clearly I’m the one spreading disinformation. Looking at city to city (Singapore is a city state) the density differences are minor. And in in terms of suicides they were up 13% in one year. Singapore seems to think the covid situation was a factor. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/suicide-highest-record-elderly-mental-health-isolation-covid-19-1984716 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/suicide-highest-re... Not sure kind of games you’re playing here.
    - bryans 5y ago
      Sure, we can compare city to city, but the comparison instantly falls apart, because that peak urban density is still nearly HALF of Singapore's entire density. There is no universe in which 50% is considered a "minor" difference, and that's STILL pretending the rest of Sweden doesn't even exist. That is the definition of an apples-to-oranges argument. In regards to the suicides, you just referenced an individual's personal thoughts on a potential reason for part of the increase. That's not evidence of anything, especially given that the statistical trend was already rising sharply upward, meaning there were existing issues being exacerbated long before COVID showed up. Even if we pretend that 100% of the 52 additional suicides in 2020 (a death rate of 12.6/mil) were directly caused by lockdowns, that's still a small fraction of the number of COVID deaths resulting from not having lockdowns, as is evidenced by ANY country's statistics. So, yeah, you are ignoring all of the obvious facts that refute your assertions, which makes you disinformative.
      - refurb 5y ago
        Wow! You sure back down quickly. You originally said we should use Sweden's 25 people/sq km and now you're willing to concede that in reality it's half? And sorry, but Singapore and Stockholm have the same population density in terms of order of magnitude. Come on man. Just admit you were wrong.
        bryans 5y ago
        Are you kidding me right now? You suggested we use the densest part of Sweden as a comparison, which is not how comparisons actually work, but I humored you anyway -- and it's still nearly HALF, which makes it not even comparable. So even when you unfairly nit-pick a particular region of Sweden, you're still completely wrong in all of your assertions. Your trolling is off the charts right now. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore Total area: 728.6 km2 Density: 7,804/km2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm Urban area: 381.63 km2 Urban density: 4,200/km2 Metro area: 6,519 km2 Metro density: 370/km2

by bryans 5y ago

refurb 5y ago

Lies, damn lies and statistics. Why calculate density of Sweden based on the total country when most people live in a couple cities? That’s just lying. It’s like calculating Canada’s density over the Arctic when 80% live within 100 miles of the US border. And is my statistics about suicides wrong? 2020 was the highest since 2012?

bryans 5y ago
> Why calculate density of Sweden based on the total country when most people live in a couple cities? That’s just lying. It’s like calculating Canada’s density over the Arctic when 80% live within 100 miles of the US border. Even if you want to compare by Sweden's most dense region, it's still 282/km2 versus 8,358/km2. Your comparison makes no sense whatsoever. > And is my statistics about suicides wrong? 2020 was the highest since 2012? You weren't making some generalized point about suicides increasing (which would have been irrelevant to the conversation at hand), you were trying to imply that lockdowns were directly responsible for the increase, which the statistical trend refutes. Your commentary is intentionally disinformative.
- refurb 5y ago
  https://www.worldscapitalcities.com/capital-facts-for-stockholm-sweden/ https://www.worldscapitalcities.com/capital-facts-for-stockh... ” Population density is concentrated within Stockholm including its immediately surrounding urban area, averaging 11,802 people per square mile (4,279 per square kilometer).” Clearly I’m the one spreading disinformation. Looking at city to city (Singapore is a city state) the density differences are minor. And in in terms of suicides they were up 13% in one year. Singapore seems to think the covid situation was a factor. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/suicide-highest-record-elderly-mental-health-isolation-covid-19-1984716 https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/suicide-highest-re... Not sure kind of games you’re playing here.
  - bryans 5y ago
    Sure, we can compare city to city, but the comparison instantly falls apart, because that peak urban density is still nearly HALF of Singapore's entire density. There is no universe in which 50% is considered a "minor" difference, and that's STILL pretending the rest of Sweden doesn't even exist. That is the definition of an apples-to-oranges argument. In regards to the suicides, you just referenced an individual's personal thoughts on a potential reason for part of the increase. That's not evidence of anything, especially given that the statistical trend was already rising sharply upward, meaning there were existing issues being exacerbated long before COVID showed up. Even if we pretend that 100% of the 52 additional suicides in 2020 (a death rate of 12.6/mil) were directly caused by lockdowns, that's still a small fraction of the number of COVID deaths resulting from not having lockdowns, as is evidenced by ANY country's statistics. So, yeah, you are ignoring all of the obvious facts that refute your assertions, which makes you disinformative.
    - refurb 5y ago
      Wow! You sure back down quickly. You originally said we should use Sweden's 25 people/sq km and now you're willing to concede that in reality it's half? And sorry, but Singapore and Stockholm have the same population density in terms of order of magnitude. Come on man. Just admit you were wrong.
      - bryans 5y ago
        Are you kidding me right now? You suggested we use the densest part of Sweden as a comparison, which is not how comparisons actually work, but I humored you anyway -- and it's still nearly HALF, which makes it not even comparable. So even when you unfairly nit-pick a particular region of Sweden, you're still completely wrong in all of your assertions. Your trolling is off the charts right now. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singapore Total area: 728.6 km2 Density: 7,804/km2 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm Urban area: 381.63 km2 Urban density: 4,200/km2 Metro area: 6,519 km2 Metro density: 370/km2