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This whole story is a shock to me: I wrote my first online quizzes and problem sets in the 20th century. Submissions were always graded on the server side and a

by nanis 5y ago

This whole story is a shock to me: I wrote my first online quizzes and problem sets in the 20th century. Submissions were always graded on the server side and answers were never available to the browser. I was involved in a lot of crappy testing software people wanted to sell our university. That was the first criterion I insisted on these publishers satisfied. By the mid-aughts, everyone seemed to have understood it. ... WTF happened that now we are talking about disabling view-source in browsers as a security measure?! I wasn't even aware that was a thing (even though I've had to use Chrome in many enterprise settings). Is this just the `npm install` automatons not understanding the distinction between the client and server in client/server applications?

db48x 5y ago
Worse. It is apparently to protect teachers who create quizzes in Google Forms. They don’t know anything about servers or clients, just that Google Forms is easy to use.
- btilly 5y ago
  It gets worse. Google Forms won't show the answers in Response view. It only happens in Editor view. See https://support.google.com/docs/thread/39605334/google-forms-quiz-page-source-shows-correct-answers?hl=en https://support.google.com/docs/thread/39605334/google-forms... to verify.
- nanis 5y ago
  > quizzes in Google Forms. Idiocracy is here. This is only acceptable is the purpose is to provide practice questions that do not count for credit. Just like it is a good idea to provide answers to practice questions at the end of the book (sometimes printed upside down). Of course, to be useful as a learning tool, the answers to such practice question must include an explanation of why, say, (c) is a better answer than (a), (b), and (d). So, set up practice questions in Google forms, put actual answers/explanations on a web page for students to learn. You can still do exams in Google forms ... Just don't leave the grading to Google forms. Instead, grade asynchronously. Again, that would be actual work, so, no leave everything to Google, and accuse students of cheating and take away `view-source`. Right. That's what things have come to.
  - daviddever23box 5y ago
    If you can view the answers in view-source, that's a failing grade for the test writers, whether it's Forms or any other tool. Fail the teachers, pass the students smart enough to discover this (or, more well-versed in technology than those tasked to teach them). Unacceptable capitulation to poor educational quality.
    - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
      The problem is that there are no platforms from the government or states. Schools or I bet individual teachers have to find a solution for themselves. There are solutions out there some cost a lot of money and some are just not easy to deploy. This is systemic and not anything we should put on teachers or individuals that have no chance to change the shitty work environments they are in.
      - chromanoid 5y ago
        I totally agree. After 30h of teaching, (depending on the teacher) around 10h to 40h of preparation per week I don't see any room for dealing with shitty software problems. Simple cheap solutions directly benefit the children.

by nanis 5y ago

db48x 5y ago

Worse. It is apparently to protect teachers who create quizzes in Google Forms. They don’t know anything about servers or clients, just that Google Forms is easy to use.

btilly 5y ago
It gets worse. Google Forms won't show the answers in Response view. It only happens in Editor view. See https://support.google.com/docs/thread/39605334/google-forms-quiz-page-source-shows-correct-answers?hl=en https://support.google.com/docs/thread/39605334/google-forms... to verify.
nanis 5y ago
> quizzes in Google Forms. Idiocracy is here. This is only acceptable is the purpose is to provide practice questions that do not count for credit. Just like it is a good idea to provide answers to practice questions at the end of the book (sometimes printed upside down). Of course, to be useful as a learning tool, the answers to such practice question must include an explanation of why, say, (c) is a better answer than (a), (b), and (d). So, set up practice questions in Google forms, put actual answers/explanations on a web page for students to learn. You can still do exams in Google forms ... Just don't leave the grading to Google forms. Instead, grade asynchronously. Again, that would be actual work, so, no leave everything to Google, and accuse students of cheating and take away `view-source`. Right. That's what things have come to.
- daviddever23box 5y ago
  If you can view the answers in view-source, that's a failing grade for the test writers, whether it's Forms or any other tool. Fail the teachers, pass the students smart enough to discover this (or, more well-versed in technology than those tasked to teach them). Unacceptable capitulation to poor educational quality.
  - YXNjaGVyZWdlbgo 5y ago
    The problem is that there are no platforms from the government or states. Schools or I bet individual teachers have to find a solution for themselves. There are solutions out there some cost a lot of money and some are just not easy to deploy. This is systemic and not anything we should put on teachers or individuals that have no chance to change the shitty work environments they are in.
    - chromanoid 5y ago
      I totally agree. After 30h of teaching, (depending on the teacher) around 10h to 40h of preparation per week I don't see any room for dealing with shitty software problems. Simple cheap solutions directly benefit the children.