3 ms·

Covid increases your chances of myocarditis by an order of magnitude, so it seems obvious that the vaccine that prevents covid is the way to go.

Mikeb85 5y ago
But the odds of getting Covid are far less than the odds of getting the vaccine. You have to compare the odds of getting the vaccine (100%) AND getting myocarditis with Moderna versus the odds of being exposed to Covid AND getting a breakthrough case with Pfizer AND getting myocarditis from said breakthrough case with Pfizer since the vaccine makes the symptoms of breakthrough cases milder anyway. The problem is that getting the vaccine is a 100% event, versus a far less than 100% event in scenario 2 (breakthrough Covid case with Pfizer that causes myocarditis in that age group specifically). Add up ALL the maths. Edit - this isn't a vaccine versus no vaccine comparison. This is vaccine versus vaccine. Pfizer (in the current recommended dose) has proven very effective AND safer. Also, what percentage of breakthrough cases with Pfizer have resulted in myocarditis? Maybe that particular stat changes the risk profile. I'm guessing it's low though. Edit 2 - also maybe the risks of Moderna can simply be reduced by reducing the dosage. Who knows. More testing will occur over time I'm sure.
- eitland 5y ago
  > But the odds of getting Covid are far less than the odds of getting the vaccine. At this point my conclusion is that everyone either get - the vaccine, - the vaccine and covid - or covid without the vaccine - or just covid within the next couple of years unless they live outside of society. I see no way an ordinary unvaccinated person can avoid catching covid now except using extremely much more invasive countermeasures than the vaccine. But I might have missed something. How do you suggest people avoid it? (Just theoretical interest. I took the vaccine as soon as it was clear that those charge took it themselves ;-)
  - Mikeb85 5y ago
    > I see no way an ordinary unvaccinated person can avoid catching covid Read my post again. I specifically said I'm comparing vaccines, not comparing vaccine to no-vaccine. Don't try to argue a strawman. Pfizer prevents enough infections that the risk of a breakthrough case is low. Plus the risk of getting exposed to Covid over any given time period is less than 1, even if it's 1 over a long enough time period. It's also a low enough risk for the age group being discussed that they can take the time to make an informed choice of Pfizer vs. Moderna.
uncoder0 5y ago
Is this true for the young male population? I've not seen that data.
carlmr 5y ago
I don't think this assertion holds since most breakthrough cases are much milder than unvaccinated infections.

Mikeb85 5y ago

But the odds of getting Covid are far less than the odds of getting the vaccine. You have to compare the odds of getting the vaccine (100%) AND getting myocarditis with Moderna versus the odds of being exposed to Covid AND getting a breakthrough case with Pfizer AND getting myocarditis from said breakthrough case with Pfizer since the vaccine makes the symptoms of breakthrough cases milder anyway. The problem is that getting the vaccine is a 100% event, versus a far less than 100% event in scenario 2 (breakthrough Covid case with Pfizer that causes myocarditis in that age group specifically). Add up ALL the maths. Edit - this isn't a vaccine versus no vaccine comparison. This is vaccine versus vaccine. Pfizer (in the current recommended dose) has proven very effective AND safer. Also, what percentage of breakthrough cases with Pfizer have resulted in myocarditis? Maybe that particular stat changes the risk profile. I'm guessing it's low though. Edit 2 - also maybe the risks of Moderna can simply be reduced by reducing the dosage. Who knows. More testing will occur over time I'm sure.

eitland 5y ago
> But the odds of getting Covid are far less than the odds of getting the vaccine. At this point my conclusion is that everyone either get - the vaccine, - the vaccine and covid - or covid without the vaccine - or just covid within the next couple of years unless they live outside of society. I see no way an ordinary unvaccinated person can avoid catching covid now except using extremely much more invasive countermeasures than the vaccine. But I might have missed something. How do you suggest people avoid it? (Just theoretical interest. I took the vaccine as soon as it was clear that those charge took it themselves ;-)
- Mikeb85 5y ago
  > I see no way an ordinary unvaccinated person can avoid catching covid Read my post again. I specifically said I'm comparing vaccines, not comparing vaccine to no-vaccine. Don't try to argue a strawman. Pfizer prevents enough infections that the risk of a breakthrough case is low. Plus the risk of getting exposed to Covid over any given time period is less than 1, even if it's 1 over a long enough time period. It's also a low enough risk for the age group being discussed that they can take the time to make an informed choice of Pfizer vs. Moderna.

uncoder0 5y ago

Is this true for the young male population? I've not seen that data.

carlmr 5y ago

I don't think this assertion holds since most breakthrough cases are much milder than unvaccinated infections.