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This is because there's not just a monetary policy union, there's also a fiscal policy union in thr US and a shared underlying nation state identity that enable

by sfifs 5y ago

This is because there's not just a monetary policy union, there's also a fiscal policy union in thr US and a shared underlying nation state identity that enables it. Essentially the federal taxes of the richer states support the poorer states. For an even better example, see India where the poorer states get very large subsidies and investments and quite a few have had substantial quality of life improvements over the years. People argue that Europe can't have a union because of its diversity but India is far more diverse in terms of languages, culture, religion and politics and has still managed to forge a nation atate. In Europe, the rich countries essentially keep their own taxes and don't transfer and invest taxes in the poorer ones, so being tied to a strong currency trips up the poorer states badly - all the disadvantages of being a weaker area tied to a strong currency without any mitigation factors beyond the right to move away.

madaxe_again 5y ago
This completely ignores structural development funds, of whom Portugal is a huge net beneficiary. Those funds are paid for by member state contributions, which come from… taxes!
- 6sup6 5y ago
  Beneficiary? If you are a Portuguese citizen, you will be shocked when you learn how much corruption goes around those EU funds. I saw it with my own eyes in the area of suicide prevention. I can even point names ( just have to open older emails and chats)
  - madaxe_again 5y ago
    Governmental spending is inherently inefficient, but is better than no spending - and corruption is a national problem. I get shaken down by the GNR - is that the EU’s fault? The President da camara likes to be given a gift to grant planning permission - is that the EU’s fault? Conversely, I have seen successful implementation of multi-billion euro projects.
  - bserge 5y ago
    Isn't that the government's and even the population's fault? Why can Germany invest money so much better than half of Europe? Same for Nordic countries. I've been thinking about it a lot. It has to be culture. Germans in the government actually care about their own country and countrymen. They still line up their own pockets, mind you, but not as bad as Eastern Europe, for example. And mental healthcare in Germany is absolute garbage, by the way. Which is pretty weird considering how much they invest into it. But again, culture. You're suicidal - you're weak. You don't have ADHD, you're just lazy. Homeopathy is real. Vaccines are dangerous. Etc.
- ClumsyPilot 5y ago
  There is more money transfered from London to Cornwall daily than from Germany to Portugal in a year. EU structuran development funds are ~34 billion a year for all of EU. Unemployment and other benefits in UK alone are 200 billion. the amount of fiscal transfer that happens withing any nation is huge: all the unemployment benefits, infrastructure spending, salaries of government employees working in poor areas, etc.

by sfifs 5y ago

madaxe_again 5y ago

This completely ignores structural development funds, of whom Portugal is a huge net beneficiary. Those funds are paid for by member state contributions, which come from… taxes!

6sup6 5y ago
Beneficiary? If you are a Portuguese citizen, you will be shocked when you learn how much corruption goes around those EU funds. I saw it with my own eyes in the area of suicide prevention. I can even point names ( just have to open older emails and chats)
- madaxe_again 5y ago
  Governmental spending is inherently inefficient, but is better than no spending - and corruption is a national problem. I get shaken down by the GNR - is that the EU’s fault? The President da camara likes to be given a gift to grant planning permission - is that the EU’s fault? Conversely, I have seen successful implementation of multi-billion euro projects.
- bserge 5y ago
  Isn't that the government's and even the population's fault? Why can Germany invest money so much better than half of Europe? Same for Nordic countries. I've been thinking about it a lot. It has to be culture. Germans in the government actually care about their own country and countrymen. They still line up their own pockets, mind you, but not as bad as Eastern Europe, for example. And mental healthcare in Germany is absolute garbage, by the way. Which is pretty weird considering how much they invest into it. But again, culture. You're suicidal - you're weak. You don't have ADHD, you're just lazy. Homeopathy is real. Vaccines are dangerous. Etc.
ClumsyPilot 5y ago
There is more money transfered from London to Cornwall daily than from Germany to Portugal in a year. EU structuran development funds are ~34 billion a year for all of EU. Unemployment and other benefits in UK alone are 200 billion. the amount of fiscal transfer that happens withing any nation is huge: all the unemployment benefits, infrastructure spending, salaries of government employees working in poor areas, etc.