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Yeah, I remember with DNC hacking stuff as well, the evidence was very uncompelling... like a state actor doesn't have the resources to figure out such basic st

Yeah, I remember with DNC hacking stuff as well, the evidence was very uncompelling... like a state actor doesn't have the resources to figure out such basic stuff if they want to cover their tracks. Or the Sony one too.

cronix 5y ago
The more compelling case for me was William Binney's point (former Technical Director of NSA) that the timestamps in the Gucifer leak showed that the data was transferred at about the same rate as a usb stick, which was quite a bit faster than the physical connection the email server had (at that time). Basically concluding it was locally copied rather than hacked due to physically being impossible to transfer over the internet connection the server was physically connected to at that time at that speed shown in the timestamps.
- emodendroket 5y ago
  Yes, I agree. But the question has become too political for dispassionate consideration, I guess.
- jonas21 5y ago
  Just to make sure I understand correctly... the most compelling piece of evidence for you is the timestamps on the files? Something that's not only trivial to fake, but also would have been overwritten if the files were copied between systems between being stolen and being leaked.
  - cronix 5y ago
    more compelling != most compelling
    - jasonlotito 5y ago
      Context matters. If there are two cases, and one is more compelling than the other, then that one is also most compelling.
  - emodendroket 5y ago
    I would say that attribution is just extremely difficult to do at all, but there's not much money in giving that answer to your clients.
  - fumer 5y ago
    > Just to make sure I understand correctly... the most compelling piece of evidence for you is the timestamps on the files? If I understood it correctly, the most compelling evidence was the real data transfer rate of those emails, deduced from the file timestamps, which ruled out their provenance from the server. > Something that's not only trivial to fake (...) Well, in this case that would go against the original accusation, therefore it would either be pointless or the explanation would require a conspiracy with double agents planting fake compromising evidence.
- mc32 5y ago
  Unfortunately looking in, politics blur things and we’re likely never to know. Political tendencies will allow people to make attributions they agree with and then simultaneously question attributions they disagree with politically. USB sticks seem to be weird about transfer speeds and they look like they are size dependent. Bunch of small files take longer than one monolithic large file given a total size.
- the_why_of_y 5y ago
  > which was quite a bit faster than the physical connection the email server had (at that time) What was the connection speed? I've never seen it stated anywhere, and in case the server was hosted in a data center the argument would collapse fairly quickly.
vmception 5y ago
As well as non-state actors. I thought it was hilarious back in 2016-2017 how people took partisans sides on BOTH wrong answers! "It was Russia! The President is ignoring intelligence agencies! Disagreeing with me makes you a far right extremist!" Meanwhile kid in basement in rural Ohio: "top kek"

cronix 5y ago

The more compelling case for me was William Binney's point (former Technical Director of NSA) that the timestamps in the Gucifer leak showed that the data was transferred at about the same rate as a usb stick, which was quite a bit faster than the physical connection the email server had (at that time). Basically concluding it was locally copied rather than hacked due to physically being impossible to transfer over the internet connection the server was physically connected to at that time at that speed shown in the timestamps.

emodendroket 5y ago
Yes, I agree. But the question has become too political for dispassionate consideration, I guess.
jonas21 5y ago
Just to make sure I understand correctly... the most compelling piece of evidence for you is the timestamps on the files? Something that's not only trivial to fake, but also would have been overwritten if the files were copied between systems between being stolen and being leaked.
- cronix 5y ago
  more compelling != most compelling
  - jasonlotito 5y ago
    Context matters. If there are two cases, and one is more compelling than the other, then that one is also most compelling.
- emodendroket 5y ago
  I would say that attribution is just extremely difficult to do at all, but there's not much money in giving that answer to your clients.
- fumer 5y ago
  > Just to make sure I understand correctly... the most compelling piece of evidence for you is the timestamps on the files? If I understood it correctly, the most compelling evidence was the real data transfer rate of those emails, deduced from the file timestamps, which ruled out their provenance from the server. > Something that's not only trivial to fake (...) Well, in this case that would go against the original accusation, therefore it would either be pointless or the explanation would require a conspiracy with double agents planting fake compromising evidence.
mc32 5y ago
Unfortunately looking in, politics blur things and we’re likely never to know. Political tendencies will allow people to make attributions they agree with and then simultaneously question attributions they disagree with politically. USB sticks seem to be weird about transfer speeds and they look like they are size dependent. Bunch of small files take longer than one monolithic large file given a total size.
the_why_of_y 5y ago
> which was quite a bit faster than the physical connection the email server had (at that time) What was the connection speed? I've never seen it stated anywhere, and in case the server was hosted in a data center the argument would collapse fairly quickly.

vmception 5y ago

As well as non-state actors. I thought it was hilarious back in 2016-2017 how people took partisans sides on BOTH wrong answers! "It was Russia! The President is ignoring intelligence agencies! Disagreeing with me makes you a far right extremist!" Meanwhile kid in basement in rural Ohio: "top kek"