5 ms·

Maybe you are right and he didn't read the article, but I think his points still stand. This is a ridiculous decision. When someone puts something into the pub

Maybe you are right and he didn't read the article, but I think his points still stand. This is a ridiculous decision. When someone puts something into the public space and everyone dislikes it, that should visible to anyone. This is just going to make ridiculous conspiracy videos and other harmful material like racist propaganda seem more legit than it is viewed by the rest of the public.

FridayoLeary 5y ago
Don't be silly. Of course YouTube can be relied on to properly censor videos themselves. They will make sure you never see anything that may make you uncomfortable. Your complete lack of faith is astonishing. (sarcasm)
- politician 5y ago
  Remember, discomfort is literally violence now.
toomuchtodo 5y ago
> that should visible to anyone. This is just going to make ridiculous conspiracy videos and other harmful material like racist propaganda seem more legit than it is viewed by the rest of the public. Report videos that violates Youtube's guidelines, and start your own platform if you take issue with the engagement tools they offer. Arguably, the data shows that outrage drives unhealthy engagement [1], and this appears to reduce outrage driven engagement, no different than HN flamewar detection and other mechanisms to encourage more civil discourse. EDIT: Youtube isn't the internet, nor "commons", it's a single web property. Lots of other forums for your speech (including your own Mastadon, Discourse, or Peertube instance). [1] https://www.google.com/search?q=outrage+drives+engagement https://www.google.com/search?q=outrage+drives+engagement
- 14 5y ago
  Ah the old just rebuild the entire internet and all your hardware from the ground up if you don’t like what you see argument.
  - politician 5y ago
    The ole just move to a different country instead of trying to influence the government.
    - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
      The ole just move to Denver if the public polices you support aren't working out as expected.
- downWidOutaFite 5y ago
  This downvoted comment reminded me of HN's compromise which is to reduce the color contrast on disliked content. I think it works well.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
14 5y ago
Or how about repair videos. There are countless diy fixes for cars, computer, cell phone repair, and countless others. I use the dislike count to see if I am wasting my time watching a bad repair video. That doesn’t mean I won’t watch it but that I am more aware I may need to skim through or fast forward to key parts like the actual removal of a part or something. Anyways I think this is a negative change.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- darkwizard42 5y ago
  I think this is the common problem with rating systems though. Youtube is saying that the dislike count and ratio are used to unfairly pile on and reduce the real signal of the video. Instead some videos get brigaded for various reason ("I don't like this person" gets conflated with "I don't think this content is useful") There was a user-submitted recipe app that had a similar problem, where rating system on recipes is challenging because does it imply that the recipe was incorrect, the food tasty, the writing poor? It is too hard to get that signal from a single point of "average rating"
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
yakkityyak 5y ago
I think like/dislike ratios suck and promote mindless dogpiling.
- SV_BubbleTime 5y ago
  Now tell me more about the gray comments here on HN. If this system wasn’t designed to promote brigading and hive mind reflex… well… unintended consequence?
  - yakkityyak 5y ago
    HN and reddit have a similar problem of conflating accuracy with "I (dis)agree with this"
    - shadowgovt 5y ago
      In general, that's the risk of crowdsourcing signal on anything... You get the wisdom of the crowds. What that means depends on the crowd.
    - kelnos 5y ago
      And even then, HN's guidelines say the downvote button is for comments that don't add to the discussion. Even a comment with incorrect information can add to the discussion (though admittedly much less often than an accurate comment), so it's not really about accuracy, either. (But I will admit that I often downvote things simply because they are inaccurate.)
  - jodrellblank 5y ago
    Often people will post comments which are inflamatory, off-topic, advertising, etc. and 'the community' can mark them down. The parent poster saying "I've never hit a like or dislike button in my life" is a little bit like saying "I've never thrown litter or picked up litter in my life". Both understandable, one respectable, the other a bit weird - if you like the environment you are in but leave all the litter collecting to others and don't contribute to it, what's that saying about you and your one-sided use of the environment? If you want HN or YouTube to have stuff you like, and not be overrun by the wild west of the internet, and there are no paid editors like the newspapers of old, not adding to the collective voting is like saying "everyone else, moderate this for me into a place I like, thank you".
2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago
Did they remove comments?
paganel 5y ago
It will also help legitimate politicians look more popular than they really are. That's what brought us "Let's go Brandon".

FridayoLeary 5y ago

Don't be silly. Of course YouTube can be relied on to properly censor videos themselves. They will make sure you never see anything that may make you uncomfortable. Your complete lack of faith is astonishing. (sarcasm)

politician 5y ago
Remember, discomfort is literally violence now.

toomuchtodo 5y ago

> that should visible to anyone. This is just going to make ridiculous conspiracy videos and other harmful material like racist propaganda seem more legit than it is viewed by the rest of the public. Report videos that violates Youtube's guidelines, and start your own platform if you take issue with the engagement tools they offer. Arguably, the data shows that outrage drives unhealthy engagement [1], and this appears to reduce outrage driven engagement, no different than HN flamewar detection and other mechanisms to encourage more civil discourse. EDIT: Youtube isn't the internet, nor "commons", it's a single web property. Lots of other forums for your speech (including your own Mastadon, Discourse, or Peertube instance). [1] https://www.google.com/search?q=outrage+drives+engagement https://www.google.com/search?q=outrage+drives+engagement

14 5y ago
Ah the old just rebuild the entire internet and all your hardware from the ground up if you don’t like what you see argument.
- politician 5y ago
  The ole just move to a different country instead of trying to influence the government.
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    The ole just move to Denver if the public polices you support aren't working out as expected.
downWidOutaFite 5y ago
This downvoted comment reminded me of HN's compromise which is to reduce the color contrast on disliked content. I think it works well.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

14 5y ago

Or how about repair videos. There are countless diy fixes for cars, computer, cell phone repair, and countless others. I use the dislike count to see if I am wasting my time watching a bad repair video. That doesn’t mean I won’t watch it but that I am more aware I may need to skim through or fast forward to key parts like the actual removal of a part or something. Anyways I think this is a negative change.

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
darkwizard42 5y ago
I think this is the common problem with rating systems though. Youtube is saying that the dislike count and ratio are used to unfairly pile on and reduce the real signal of the video. Instead some videos get brigaded for various reason ("I don't like this person" gets conflated with "I don't think this content is useful") There was a user-submitted recipe app that had a similar problem, where rating system on recipes is challenging because does it imply that the recipe was incorrect, the food tasty, the writing poor? It is too hard to get that signal from a single point of "average rating"
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]

yakkityyak 5y ago

I think like/dislike ratios suck and promote mindless dogpiling.

SV_BubbleTime 5y ago
Now tell me more about the gray comments here on HN. If this system wasn’t designed to promote brigading and hive mind reflex… well… unintended consequence?
- yakkityyak 5y ago
  HN and reddit have a similar problem of conflating accuracy with "I (dis)agree with this"
  - shadowgovt 5y ago
    In general, that's the risk of crowdsourcing signal on anything... You get the wisdom of the crowds. What that means depends on the crowd.
  - kelnos 5y ago
    And even then, HN's guidelines say the downvote button is for comments that don't add to the discussion. Even a comment with incorrect information can add to the discussion (though admittedly much less often than an accurate comment), so it's not really about accuracy, either. (But I will admit that I often downvote things simply because they are inaccurate.)
- jodrellblank 5y ago
  Often people will post comments which are inflamatory, off-topic, advertising, etc. and 'the community' can mark them down. The parent poster saying "I've never hit a like or dislike button in my life" is a little bit like saying "I've never thrown litter or picked up litter in my life". Both understandable, one respectable, the other a bit weird - if you like the environment you are in but leave all the litter collecting to others and don't contribute to it, what's that saying about you and your one-sided use of the environment? If you want HN or YouTube to have stuff you like, and not be overrun by the wild west of the internet, and there are no paid editors like the newspapers of old, not adding to the collective voting is like saying "everyone else, moderate this for me into a place I like, thank you".

2OEH8eoCRo0 5y ago

Did they remove comments?

paganel 5y ago

It will also help legitimate politicians look more popular than they really are. That's what brought us "Let's go Brandon".