5 ms·

New Zealand has previously given citizenship to island nation citizens, it is likely that that will continue if things worsen.

AutumnCurtain 5y ago
Between wealthy doomsday preppers and Pacific climate refugees, New Zealand is dealing with the immigrant trends of 2050 today!
- ocschwar 5y ago
  Well, a nation with a thriving Polynesian culture is probably the best place to collect atoll refugees.
  - AutumnCurtain 5y ago
    And a liberal democracy that prizes multiculturalism, I absolutely agree they are a good fit. You get all that human capital and goodwill too, it's good business.
    - FredPret 5y ago
      Probably going to help make their damn rugby team even stronger too!
  - BitwiseFool 5y ago
    Perhaps, perhaps not. In Hawaii there is actually a lot of tension between the Kanaka Maoli (Native Hawaiians), the Marshallese, and Micronesians. I am not keen as to exactly why this is, but I think it underscores the importance of providing more resources for both the Pacific Islanders already living receiving limited assistance, and the new arrivals. I think the government shouldn't just assume they'll get along because of shared cultural heritage.
    - deleted 5y ago
      [deleted]
    - wahern 5y ago
      I don't know if there's a word for it, but pretty much every nation has at least one other nation that it traditionally looks down upon, usually one that to outsiders seems quite similar and which often have in fact strong ties between them. France and England are a classic example, though maybe a little odd in that it's mutual. (I suppose Argentina and Chile are similar in that regard--each thinks the other is categorically beneath them?) Sometimes there's a clear regional hierarchy, like U.S. -> Mexico -> Guatemala even though it's not necessarily obvious to all involved--U.S. has traditionally looked down on Mexico but doesn't have any sense of a hierarchy beyond that, whereas Mexicans might not care less what people in the U.S. think but certainly feel they're better than Guatemalans. Sometimes it's a non-transitive circle. It can be very complex, and it doesn't have to make any sense, though often it's a simple reflection of comparative wealth or prestige. But it's a universally understood phenomenon. There's the famous quote by Jean-Jacques Dessalines, leader of the Haitian Revolution, who circa 1804 called the Polish "the White Negroes of Europe", exempting them from the murderous extirpation of all white-skinned people in the newly independent state. Fast forward to the 21st century and British prejudice against the Polish (and specifically Polish immigrant laborers) is a major impetus for Brexit. Anyhow, I've learned to be careful about equivocating nations or cultures. Saying something like, "country X seemed just as nice as Y" might rub someone from X or Y the wrong way. It's all thinly disguised racism, of course. But it does pose an interesting woke paradox: what if all a nation has left is its prejudice against another nation?
      - vurpo 5y ago
        I think it's actually that human cultures are infinitely nested, with every group containing subgroups with some level of disdain towards each other. Conflicts on a higher level often seem to "override" conflicts on the lower levels (although I don't know how often this actually is true). For example: I'm from Finland, and if our team plays hockey against Sweden it's as if there's a war against them or something. However, if Sweden plays against Canada you'll still see people cheer for Sweden over here. I believe this reveals the existence of a tree-like hierarchy (very loose) of human cultures, and I also believe it goes way lower than just the country level (all the way down to individual people). xkcd also said it a long time ago: https://xkcd.com/1095/ https://xkcd.com/1095/

AutumnCurtain 5y ago

Between wealthy doomsday preppers and Pacific climate refugees, New Zealand is dealing with the immigrant trends of 2050 today!

ocschwar 5y ago
Well, a nation with a thriving Polynesian culture is probably the best place to collect atoll refugees.
- AutumnCurtain 5y ago
  And a liberal democracy that prizes multiculturalism, I absolutely agree they are a good fit. You get all that human capital and goodwill too, it's good business.
  - FredPret 5y ago
    Probably going to help make their damn rugby team even stronger too!
- BitwiseFool 5y ago
  Perhaps, perhaps not. In Hawaii there is actually a lot of tension between the Kanaka Maoli (Native Hawaiians), the Marshallese, and Micronesians. I am not keen as to exactly why this is, but I think it underscores the importance of providing more resources for both the Pacific Islanders already living receiving limited assistance, and the new arrivals. I think the government shouldn't just assume they'll get along because of shared cultural heritage.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
  - wahern 5y ago
    I don't know if there's a word for it, but pretty much every nation has at least one other nation that it traditionally looks down upon, usually one that to outsiders seems quite similar and which often have in fact strong ties between them. France and England are a classic example, though maybe a little odd in that it's mutual. (I suppose Argentina and Chile are similar in that regard--each thinks the other is categorically beneath them?) Sometimes there's a clear regional hierarchy, like U.S. -> Mexico -> Guatemala even though it's not necessarily obvious to all involved--U.S. has traditionally looked down on Mexico but doesn't have any sense of a hierarchy beyond that, whereas Mexicans might not care less what people in the U.S. think but certainly feel they're better than Guatemalans. Sometimes it's a non-transitive circle. It can be very complex, and it doesn't have to make any sense, though often it's a simple reflection of comparative wealth or prestige. But it's a universally understood phenomenon. There's the famous quote by Jean-Jacques Dessalines, leader of the Haitian Revolution, who circa 1804 called the Polish "the White Negroes of Europe", exempting them from the murderous extirpation of all white-skinned people in the newly independent state. Fast forward to the 21st century and British prejudice against the Polish (and specifically Polish immigrant laborers) is a major impetus for Brexit. Anyhow, I've learned to be careful about equivocating nations or cultures. Saying something like, "country X seemed just as nice as Y" might rub someone from X or Y the wrong way. It's all thinly disguised racism, of course. But it does pose an interesting woke paradox: what if all a nation has left is its prejudice against another nation?
    - vurpo 5y ago
      I think it's actually that human cultures are infinitely nested, with every group containing subgroups with some level of disdain towards each other. Conflicts on a higher level often seem to "override" conflicts on the lower levels (although I don't know how often this actually is true). For example: I'm from Finland, and if our team plays hockey against Sweden it's as if there's a war against them or something. However, if Sweden plays against Canada you'll still see people cheer for Sweden over here. I believe this reveals the existence of a tree-like hierarchy (very loose) of human cultures, and I also believe it goes way lower than just the country level (all the way down to individual people). xkcd also said it a long time ago: https://xkcd.com/1095/ https://xkcd.com/1095/