5 ms·

Is it remotely possible to vote against this policy? Who controls Chromium features – I know it's open source and thus one could always fork it, but how is the

Is it remotely possible to vote against this policy? Who controls Chromium features – I know it's open source and thus one could always fork it, but how is the project governed? "Benign" dictatorship?

tialaramex 5y ago
You think you should get to vote against other people's local policies? Just you, or do we each get a vote? Where do I get my list of your policies in case I need to vote against some of them?
- azalemeth 5y ago
  That's a rather aggressive way of answering my question. I meant "who decided to let chromium disable view-source, and if this decision is unpopular, can it be reconsidered?". Your local policy is yours, but in much the same way that I don't think it's a good idea for an OS provider to provide a single, easy-to-use button saying "spy on this user who I pinky-swear is a member of my family under 18 and tell me everything they do and where their mobile is", an option to permit the disabling of view-source in a mainstream browser does not fit easily with me. I accept that there might be some situations in which you'd want to do it, but honestly it's the thin-edge of the wedge. "Benign dictatorship" is a common form of open-source project governance; it's not unreasonable to expect that is the case here (with Google, or a part of it, as the dictator). That being said, many open-source projects are managed in a way other than "benign dictatorship". Debian, for example, famously uses the Condorcet method [1] if there are any significant ideological disputes; see this vote [2] about Richard Stallman for an example. To my mind, a browser supporting -- in whatever form -- an option to disallow "view-source" could well be a controversial enough decision to necessitate a vote through this means. I don't know how Chromium is governed, and all I meant to do was ask how. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_method https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_method [2] https://www.debian.org/vote/2021/vote_002#outcome https://www.debian.org/vote/2021/vote_002#outcome
  - seba_dos1 5y ago
    Isn't it closing the hole that allowed you to bypass the blocklist by using source viewer rather than adding a way to block viewing the source altogether?
    - LadyCailin 5y ago
      I would argue that any client side blocking is pointless at best, and points to extreme lack of actual security at worst.
arcbyte 5y ago
Here's the link to vote, no registration required: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/new/ https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/new/
- ddalex 5y ago
  ~3/4 out of Firefox users have their analytics disabled if you're invisible your vote doesn't count anywhere ....
  - gsich 5y ago
    If you depend on metrics you get a product like Firefox. Worse with every iteration.
  - freediver 5y ago
    Do you have source for that?
- charcircuit 5y ago
  I don't see where to vote on issues on that page.
  - kingcharles 5y ago
    Whooooosh!
- tata71 5y ago
  All I found was an insecure browser...
zitterbewegung 5y ago
The best way to vote against changes like this is to use Firefox. The people who govern the project will pay attention to market share much better than anything else other than forking the project. I think you may have some core assumption that open source software has a voting system when none really exists and it’s either a committee or a corporation that gives no voting rights whatsoever. Participation instead gets things in when your are both trusted and the governance approves.
steffanA 5y ago
Why would you want to vote against this change? It's local policy and has no bearing on anyone else. Sites cannot enable it.

tialaramex 5y ago

You think you should get to vote against other people's local policies? Just you, or do we each get a vote? Where do I get my list of your policies in case I need to vote against some of them?

azalemeth 5y ago
That's a rather aggressive way of answering my question. I meant "who decided to let chromium disable view-source, and if this decision is unpopular, can it be reconsidered?". Your local policy is yours, but in much the same way that I don't think it's a good idea for an OS provider to provide a single, easy-to-use button saying "spy on this user who I pinky-swear is a member of my family under 18 and tell me everything they do and where their mobile is", an option to permit the disabling of view-source in a mainstream browser does not fit easily with me. I accept that there might be some situations in which you'd want to do it, but honestly it's the thin-edge of the wedge. "Benign dictatorship" is a common form of open-source project governance; it's not unreasonable to expect that is the case here (with Google, or a part of it, as the dictator). That being said, many open-source projects are managed in a way other than "benign dictatorship". Debian, for example, famously uses the Condorcet method [1] if there are any significant ideological disputes; see this vote [2] about Richard Stallman for an example. To my mind, a browser supporting -- in whatever form -- an option to disallow "view-source" could well be a controversial enough decision to necessitate a vote through this means. I don't know how Chromium is governed, and all I meant to do was ask how. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_method https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Condorcet_method [2] https://www.debian.org/vote/2021/vote_002#outcome https://www.debian.org/vote/2021/vote_002#outcome
- seba_dos1 5y ago
  Isn't it closing the hole that allowed you to bypass the blocklist by using source viewer rather than adding a way to block viewing the source altogether?
  - LadyCailin 5y ago
    I would argue that any client side blocking is pointless at best, and points to extreme lack of actual security at worst.

arcbyte 5y ago

Here's the link to vote, no registration required: https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/new/ https://www.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/new/

ddalex 5y ago
~3/4 out of Firefox users have their analytics disabled if you're invisible your vote doesn't count anywhere ....
- gsich 5y ago
  If you depend on metrics you get a product like Firefox. Worse with every iteration.
- freediver 5y ago
  Do you have source for that?
charcircuit 5y ago
I don't see where to vote on issues on that page.
- kingcharles 5y ago
  Whooooosh!
tata71 5y ago
All I found was an insecure browser...

zitterbewegung 5y ago

The best way to vote against changes like this is to use Firefox. The people who govern the project will pay attention to market share much better than anything else other than forking the project. I think you may have some core assumption that open source software has a voting system when none really exists and it’s either a committee or a corporation that gives no voting rights whatsoever. Participation instead gets things in when your are both trusted and the governance approves.

steffanA 5y ago

Why would you want to vote against this change? It's local policy and has no bearing on anyone else. Sites cannot enable it.