30 ms·

Gross. Wolt was in my mind one of the less amoral delivery services. It's delivery staff are (soon to be were I'm sure) actual employees.

slowmotiony 5y ago
Surely this is not the case anymore, nowadays Wolt drivers are either fresh arrived immigrants with no language or actual illegals - it's definitely not because Wolt cares about their wellbeing and wants to hire them as employees.
Hamuko 5y ago
Wolt's delivery staff haven't been treated as actual employees in its native Finland. It was actually quite recent when the occupational safety administration ruled that Wolt's delivery staff are actually employees, but Wolt is appealing.
- illuminati1911 5y ago
  I wonder if that's why they are now exiting. They can see that there is no future for this kind of business as governments crack down on the platform economy.
  - Kkoala 5y ago
    The same has been speculated in Finnish groups/forums, probably it affected the decision, but of course we can't know how much. They had also been thinking of going public, so this acquisition seems safer option
  - MomoXenosaga 5y ago
    Food delivery is a multi billion industry and being the number one app is still lucrative.
Kkoala 5y ago
The delivery staff definitely aren't/weren't actual employees. They all have some kind of business entity set up that they use to bill Wolt
- larschdk 5y ago
  It's still an open question whether this is legal in some countries, e.g. Denmark. It's being argued heavily that Wolt shouldn't be allowed to avoid pension, payed vacation, and payed sick leave, which are required by law for all workers. The competing Just Eat have just signed a union agreement with couriers which includes full benefits, without increasing prices for customers.
  - nebula8804 5y ago
    >pension, payed vacation, and payed sick leave, which are required by law for all workers Wait do you mean that someone like a janitor has all these benefits?
    - mschuster91 5y ago
      In Europe, yes. All of these are mandatory for all workers, including janitors and other staff.
    - da_chicken 5y ago
      Do you think the world doesn't need janitors? If they are doing necessary labor, by what basis should they be excluded from social benefits?
    - IanCal 5y ago
      Can't claim for Denmark, but in the UK absolutely. We distinguish between a few different types of employment but janitors would typically be employees and entitled to these things.
    - mihaic 5y ago
      I'm honestly not sure if you're sarcastic. These are all basic human rights in most developed countries, and even in many non-developed ones. At least in theory, regulations are designed primary for the people and not for better business at all costs.
deanc 5y ago
73% [1] of couriers don't want to be employees (in Finland). They are quite happy with this arrangement as it means they are paid more. The survey that was conducted was quite thorough and interesting. It's worth a read. (Just stating facts here, don't have an opinion myself on this) [1] https://blog.wolt.com/fin/2021/06/23/taloustutkimus-majority-of-wolt-couriers-wish-to-continue-as-contractors/ https://blog.wolt.com/fin/2021/06/23/taloustutkimus-majority...
- zpeti 5y ago
  [flagged]
  - Ekaros 5y ago
    Being non-employee at these income levels is just horrible deal. Miss quite many things from pensions to possible unemployment benefits and possibly even paid vacation. It only really starts to become reasonable if you can bill yourself as consultant in fields like IT.
  - Sharlin 5y ago
    There’s also no reason an employee couldn’t have fully flexible hours if the business model is suitable anyway. Well, in principle no reason, anyway, in practice current employment legislation and collective agreements in Finland place limits on working times because historically the risk of employers voluntelling employees to work less-than-pleasant hours has been deemed too high.
  - AnssiH 5y ago
    Employment does not have to mean fixed or restricted work times.
- mschuster91 5y ago
  Classic short-term fallacy. Yes, you get more net payout as a "contractor" - but you don't get paid sick leave or pension contributions unless you care for these on your own. This is why this model is very frowned upon by European societies as it inevitably leaves taxpayers to pick up the tab in the form of basic social security.

slowmotiony 5y ago

Surely this is not the case anymore, nowadays Wolt drivers are either fresh arrived immigrants with no language or actual illegals - it's definitely not because Wolt cares about their wellbeing and wants to hire them as employees.

Hamuko 5y ago

Wolt's delivery staff haven't been treated as actual employees in its native Finland. It was actually quite recent when the occupational safety administration ruled that Wolt's delivery staff are actually employees, but Wolt is appealing.

illuminati1911 5y ago
I wonder if that's why they are now exiting. They can see that there is no future for this kind of business as governments crack down on the platform economy.
- Kkoala 5y ago
  The same has been speculated in Finnish groups/forums, probably it affected the decision, but of course we can't know how much. They had also been thinking of going public, so this acquisition seems safer option
- MomoXenosaga 5y ago
  Food delivery is a multi billion industry and being the number one app is still lucrative.

Kkoala 5y ago

The delivery staff definitely aren't/weren't actual employees. They all have some kind of business entity set up that they use to bill Wolt

larschdk 5y ago
It's still an open question whether this is legal in some countries, e.g. Denmark. It's being argued heavily that Wolt shouldn't be allowed to avoid pension, payed vacation, and payed sick leave, which are required by law for all workers. The competing Just Eat have just signed a union agreement with couriers which includes full benefits, without increasing prices for customers.
- nebula8804 5y ago
  >pension, payed vacation, and payed sick leave, which are required by law for all workers Wait do you mean that someone like a janitor has all these benefits?
  - mschuster91 5y ago
    In Europe, yes. All of these are mandatory for all workers, including janitors and other staff.
  - da_chicken 5y ago
    Do you think the world doesn't need janitors? If they are doing necessary labor, by what basis should they be excluded from social benefits?
  - IanCal 5y ago
    Can't claim for Denmark, but in the UK absolutely. We distinguish between a few different types of employment but janitors would typically be employees and entitled to these things.
  - mihaic 5y ago
    I'm honestly not sure if you're sarcastic. These are all basic human rights in most developed countries, and even in many non-developed ones. At least in theory, regulations are designed primary for the people and not for better business at all costs.

deanc 5y ago

73% [1] of couriers don't want to be employees (in Finland). They are quite happy with this arrangement as it means they are paid more. The survey that was conducted was quite thorough and interesting. It's worth a read. (Just stating facts here, don't have an opinion myself on this) [1] https://blog.wolt.com/fin/2021/06/23/taloustutkimus-majority-of-wolt-couriers-wish-to-continue-as-contractors/ https://blog.wolt.com/fin/2021/06/23/taloustutkimus-majority...

zpeti 5y ago
[flagged]
- Ekaros 5y ago
  Being non-employee at these income levels is just horrible deal. Miss quite many things from pensions to possible unemployment benefits and possibly even paid vacation. It only really starts to become reasonable if you can bill yourself as consultant in fields like IT.
- Sharlin 5y ago
  There’s also no reason an employee couldn’t have fully flexible hours if the business model is suitable anyway. Well, in principle no reason, anyway, in practice current employment legislation and collective agreements in Finland place limits on working times because historically the risk of employers voluntelling employees to work less-than-pleasant hours has been deemed too high.
- AnssiH 5y ago
  Employment does not have to mean fixed or restricted work times.
mschuster91 5y ago
Classic short-term fallacy. Yes, you get more net payout as a "contractor" - but you don't get paid sick leave or pension contributions unless you care for these on your own. This is why this model is very frowned upon by European societies as it inevitably leaves taxpayers to pick up the tab in the form of basic social security.