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Perhaps a dumb question but who was handling the insurance before this? Homeowners does not cover rentals, correct? So you needed rental insurance? I’ve always

Perhaps a dumb question but who was handling the insurance before this? Homeowners does not cover rentals, correct? So you needed rental insurance? I’ve always seen airbnb to be too risky to do with your primary residence, which seems to greatly diminish from the efficiency of the service (and of home ownership)

carlivar 5y ago
I host an Airbnb and I have a policy specifically covering short term rentals.
- ProAm 5y ago
  How much is this policy (say in terms of your normal owners policy). Are you in the US? This would be good info to know about.
  - carlivar 5y ago
    I'm in the U.S. I don't find the policy any more expensive than it would be for a long term rental property. This is a ski town condo and most of the risk to the insurer is fire I think, not Airbnb renters.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
bombcar 5y ago
Nobody. AirBNB lived on the gray area where people rented properties that weren’t setup or insured for such.
- addicted 5y ago
  That’s basically the gig economy. Shifting all the hidden and one off costs to unsophisticated gig workers who are unable to factor those costs in.
  - jrockway 5y ago
    AirBnB is interesting in that it's like the gig economy, but actors that have unlimited capital can participate. If you have a few million bucks, you can park it in real estate in a touristy place and rent it out for $150 a night (compared to <$100 a night you'd get renting to a full-time renter). These "superhosts" know exactly what they're getting into. This is different than the gig economy where workers are just pouring hours of their lives into a dead-end job. You never get more efficient at being an Uber driver or a Doordash delivery person. You put in the hours, you get paid, and nothing changes for the rest of your life. (This is certainly true of some non-gig jobs, but at least you get a guaranteed 40 hours of paid work a week, don't have to buy your own supplies, get some paid holidays, and get health insurance.)
    - TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago
      Uber drivers get progressively more economically inefficient the more they drive as the maintenance costs or driving a vehicle increase the more you drive it, up until it needs replacing either due to wear and tear or regulatory / contractual requirements.
      - sokoloff 5y ago
        The monthly decrease in value of the car gets less over time though. It loses the most value in the first month/year, less the next year, etc.
        csunbird 5y ago
        But, a car that is being used for Uber/Taxi service loses way more value over time, as a normal private car (in Europe for example) will make 10k to 15k kilometers per year, while Uber/Taxi cars will make double of that easily.
        sokoloff 5y ago
        Yes. The use of a car in Uber service is extracting value from the car. My point was that the rate of that extraction goes down over time and distance, partially (perhaps more than) offsetting the increase in repair costs over time and distance.
- jliptzin 5y ago
  Not true. There are many insurance companies that specifically serve Airbnb properties. I use Proper insurance.
xapata 5y ago
AirBnB did. I forget the exact terms, but a while back someone's house got trashed and it hit the news. AirBnB announced they'd cover the damage to her house and started an insurance policy.
- Gigachad 5y ago
  If you check the airbnb hosts subreddit, there are endless stories of hosts being ghosted by support after a guest trashed the place.
  - CaptainZapp 5y ago
    Except, of course, when it blew up either on social media or in the press. Then suddenly "they made it right" and some spokesdrone trumpeted some bullshit like "In this exceptional case we didn't live up to our members / hosts high expectations". With rare exceptions I also don't see any more advantage compared to staying in a hotel. But to each his own, I suppose.
    - sokoloff 5y ago
      As a guest, I way prefer Airbnb (or VRBO or similar) to hotels. Having a kitchen, having area that’s both private to my group yet common is great. We rent them for work offsites, family trips, and individual travel. 98% of the time everything goes smoothly.
      - throwawaygh 5y ago
        I used to feel this way and have since flipped. Unless I'm traveling with a large group for an extended period of time, I really prefer hotels. Bed made & bathroom cleaned every day, breakfast served, ample obvious parking, investment in paid support staff instead of an asshole or at-best disinterested "host", etc. Plus hotels are almost always cheaper for parties <= 2.
    - _nalply 5y ago
      My family has special needs not covered by a hotel but I can provide the needs myself if I have access to a kitchen. Therefore most of the time a hotel room is not the right thing for us.
gandutraveler 5y ago
In Hawaii at least the home insurance companies have products for long term and short term rentals based on the homeownership. As a host I also have additional a liability and umbrella insurance. There is also some coverage from my property managers.
m-i-l 5y ago
> who was handling the insurance before this? In the UK, "homeowners insurance" definitely wouldn't cover you for Airbnb style scenarios, and most "landlords insurance" wouldn't either, e.g. because you needed formal tenancy agreements (e.g. Assured Shorthold Tenancy), no potential for long void periods etc. However, some specialist insurance companies would insure you for Airbnb style scenarios via "holiday let insurance". You'd still need that cover because AirCover only provides insurance for the period while guests are there, i.e. you would still need insurance for break-ins, water leaks, cleaners injuring themselves, etc. in-between guests. So this supplements rather than replaces your existing insurance. Not sure why this is so prominent on the HN home page because it isn't really something "that good hackers would find interesting" or something "that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity".

carlivar 5y ago

I host an Airbnb and I have a policy specifically covering short term rentals.

ProAm 5y ago
How much is this policy (say in terms of your normal owners policy). Are you in the US? This would be good info to know about.
- carlivar 5y ago
  I'm in the U.S. I don't find the policy any more expensive than it would be for a long term rental property. This is a ski town condo and most of the risk to the insurer is fire I think, not Airbnb renters.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

bombcar 5y ago

Nobody. AirBNB lived on the gray area where people rented properties that weren’t setup or insured for such.

addicted 5y ago
That’s basically the gig economy. Shifting all the hidden and one off costs to unsophisticated gig workers who are unable to factor those costs in.
- jrockway 5y ago
  AirBnB is interesting in that it's like the gig economy, but actors that have unlimited capital can participate. If you have a few million bucks, you can park it in real estate in a touristy place and rent it out for $150 a night (compared to <$100 a night you'd get renting to a full-time renter). These "superhosts" know exactly what they're getting into. This is different than the gig economy where workers are just pouring hours of their lives into a dead-end job. You never get more efficient at being an Uber driver or a Doordash delivery person. You put in the hours, you get paid, and nothing changes for the rest of your life. (This is certainly true of some non-gig jobs, but at least you get a guaranteed 40 hours of paid work a week, don't have to buy your own supplies, get some paid holidays, and get health insurance.)
  - TheSpiceIsLife 5y ago
    Uber drivers get progressively more economically inefficient the more they drive as the maintenance costs or driving a vehicle increase the more you drive it, up until it needs replacing either due to wear and tear or regulatory / contractual requirements.
    - sokoloff 5y ago
      The monthly decrease in value of the car gets less over time though. It loses the most value in the first month/year, less the next year, etc.
      - csunbird 5y ago
        But, a car that is being used for Uber/Taxi service loses way more value over time, as a normal private car (in Europe for example) will make 10k to 15k kilometers per year, while Uber/Taxi cars will make double of that easily.
        sokoloff 5y ago
        Yes. The use of a car in Uber service is extracting value from the car. My point was that the rate of that extraction goes down over time and distance, partially (perhaps more than) offsetting the increase in repair costs over time and distance.
jliptzin 5y ago
Not true. There are many insurance companies that specifically serve Airbnb properties. I use Proper insurance.

xapata 5y ago

AirBnB did. I forget the exact terms, but a while back someone's house got trashed and it hit the news. AirBnB announced they'd cover the damage to her house and started an insurance policy.

Gigachad 5y ago
If you check the airbnb hosts subreddit, there are endless stories of hosts being ghosted by support after a guest trashed the place.
- CaptainZapp 5y ago
  Except, of course, when it blew up either on social media or in the press. Then suddenly "they made it right" and some spokesdrone trumpeted some bullshit like "In this exceptional case we didn't live up to our members / hosts high expectations". With rare exceptions I also don't see any more advantage compared to staying in a hotel. But to each his own, I suppose.
  - sokoloff 5y ago
    As a guest, I way prefer Airbnb (or VRBO or similar) to hotels. Having a kitchen, having area that’s both private to my group yet common is great. We rent them for work offsites, family trips, and individual travel. 98% of the time everything goes smoothly.
    - throwawaygh 5y ago
      I used to feel this way and have since flipped. Unless I'm traveling with a large group for an extended period of time, I really prefer hotels. Bed made & bathroom cleaned every day, breakfast served, ample obvious parking, investment in paid support staff instead of an asshole or at-best disinterested "host", etc. Plus hotels are almost always cheaper for parties <= 2.
  - _nalply 5y ago
    My family has special needs not covered by a hotel but I can provide the needs myself if I have access to a kitchen. Therefore most of the time a hotel room is not the right thing for us.

gandutraveler 5y ago

In Hawaii at least the home insurance companies have products for long term and short term rentals based on the homeownership. As a host I also have additional a liability and umbrella insurance. There is also some coverage from my property managers.

m-i-l 5y ago

> who was handling the insurance before this? In the UK, "homeowners insurance" definitely wouldn't cover you for Airbnb style scenarios, and most "landlords insurance" wouldn't either, e.g. because you needed formal tenancy agreements (e.g. Assured Shorthold Tenancy), no potential for long void periods etc. However, some specialist insurance companies would insure you for Airbnb style scenarios via "holiday let insurance". You'd still need that cover because AirCover only provides insurance for the period while guests are there, i.e. you would still need insurance for break-ins, water leaks, cleaners injuring themselves, etc. in-between guests. So this supplements rather than replaces your existing insurance. Not sure why this is so prominent on the HN home page because it isn't really something "that good hackers would find interesting" or something "that gratifies one's intellectual curiosity".