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The verb is route. Rooting a phone... you made me sit up there ;) They do have a registry, but it's not relevant to this order. When you send me a message, you

by Arnt 5y ago

The verb is route. Rooting a phone... you made me sit up there ;) They do have a registry, but it's not relevant to this order. When you send me a message, your phone sends Signal my phone number and an encrypted blob. Signal routes that to my phone and the server doesn't keep a long-term record of that. Thus, Signal-the-server has a record for the next many seconds at least containing the destination of a messsage. It does not have my profile name, your profile name or any way to connect your phone number to that message. Signal running on my phone has enough state concerning you to decrypt the encrypted blob and see that it's from you. Signal, the organisation, is in control of all the source code and could change the code to gain control of all the information Luxembourg is asking for. But the past is immutable. Noone can go back in time and retroactively store more data. Signal didn't log the destination phone number at the time and so it's not available now, Signal didn't transmit the profile names to the server and so it never arrived and could not be stored.

bsaul 5y ago
then they'll probably be compelled to keep the history in some stash. iirc , internet providers had to face exactly this requirements in the 90s.
- Arnt 5y ago
  Nah, the treaty of Westphalia holds. Countries are sovereign in their territory and basically powerless outside it. Luxembourg doesn't compel foreign foundations in foreign jurisdictions. Luxembourg has the legal right to forbid people in its territory from using apps like Signal, though. But I doubt it would even try to that, because it's really difficult to write a scope that includes things like Signal messages and yet excludes things like messages that instruct and authorise your bank to transfer money.
  - newaccount2021 5y ago
    extradition treaties, international law enforcement treaties etc all undermine your premise

by Arnt 5y ago

bsaul 5y ago

then they'll probably be compelled to keep the history in some stash. iirc , internet providers had to face exactly this requirements in the 90s.

Arnt 5y ago
Nah, the treaty of Westphalia holds. Countries are sovereign in their territory and basically powerless outside it. Luxembourg doesn't compel foreign foundations in foreign jurisdictions. Luxembourg has the legal right to forbid people in its territory from using apps like Signal, though. But I doubt it would even try to that, because it's really difficult to write a scope that includes things like Signal messages and yet excludes things like messages that instruct and authorise your bank to transfer money.
- newaccount2021 5y ago
  extradition treaties, international law enforcement treaties etc all undermine your premise