4 ms·

Have the option to view the tagged items in a tree, which is dynamically created from the tags. For example my audio player does just that, e.g. `%artist%/(%ye

Have the option to view the tagged items in a tree, which is dynamically created from the tags. For example my audio player does just that, e.g. `%artist%/(%year%) %album%/%tracknumber%.%title%`

theon144 5y ago
Also known as "facets". Sometimes you might want to browse "year/album/artist" too (think Various Artists / compilation albums), instead of the more common "artist/year/album". Or even "artist/year/album" for the more prolific artists out there. Progressively "drilling down" is super low-hanging fruit with regards to tag-based organization, it's seriously neglected.
- dredmorbius 5y ago
  Thanks, that's ... closer to what I have in mind. I also agree that the lack of drill-down on tag-based organisation ... kills about 99.9996% of the value. It's sufficiently valuable that you'd expect this to be part of basic implementation libraries by now.
dredmorbius 5y ago
How are relationships between tags determined or specified? A tagging system is flat by default. Though that makes rendering the tree somewhat easier...
- wander_homer 5y ago
  You don't need to define relationships between tags. Like in my audio player the songs have certain tags which don't have anything to do with each other and yet the player can create tree like structures from them. For example when you have songs with tags for %genre%, %artist%, %album% and %title%, the player can automatically generate various tree structures with different levels, like: 1. genre 2. artist 3. album 4. title or 1. genre 3. album 4. title or just 1. title or even less useful ones like 1. title 2. album
  - dredmorbius 5y ago
    And what is the player's method? Magic? Note that in the case of artist -> album -> title, there is in fact an actual explicit hierarchy that's being reconstructed. In the case of conceptual tags ... any such structure is far less evidently defined.
    - wander_homer 5y ago
      I'm not sure why you think there's magic involved. Say you have songs with three sort of tags, album, genre and title. I.e.: song_1: genre_1, album_1, title_1 song_2: genre_2, album_2, title_2 song_3: genre_1, album_3, title_3 Now when the user wants a tree with the first level being genre and the second being title, the player just goes through all the know genres to build the first level with two items (genre_1 and genre_2), then for the genre_1 sub-tree it generates a list of all songs with genre_1 and displays their title, ... So you end up with: genre_1 |-> title_1 |-> title_3 genre_2 |-> title_2 Those are basically just normal database lookups. Edit: In fact since the player allows for multi-value tags, items can even appear multiple times in the tree, e.g. when a song has multiple artists.
      - dredmorbius 5y ago
        The point to my question wasn't that there is magic involved, but to ask what the specific method was. Maybe I should have made that clearer, though I was hoping it would be obvious. In the artist -> album -> song case, to repeat myself, the recognised hierarchy reflects an actual one that's present in the original artefacts. (This needn't always be the case: multiple artists might play the same song, the same song might be on multiple albums, song title itself does not necessarily imply either artist or album. Though in the simple case it does.) In the genre/title example, how would it be clear that title is a subclass of genre rather than the other way 'round? And what of fusion or crossover works --- is DNA's remix of "Tom's Diner" folk-rock, a capella, or trip-hop?
        wander_homer 5y ago

Have the option to view the tagged items in a tree, which is dynamically created from the tags. For example my audio player does just that, e.g. `%artist%/(%year%) %album%/%tracknumber%.%title%`

theon144 5y ago

Also known as "facets". Sometimes you might want to browse "year/album/artist" too (think Various Artists / compilation albums), instead of the more common "artist/year/album". Or even "artist/year/album" for the more prolific artists out there. Progressively "drilling down" is super low-hanging fruit with regards to tag-based organization, it's seriously neglected.

dredmorbius 5y ago
Thanks, that's ... closer to what I have in mind. I also agree that the lack of drill-down on tag-based organisation ... kills about 99.9996% of the value. It's sufficiently valuable that you'd expect this to be part of basic implementation libraries by now.

dredmorbius 5y ago

How are relationships between tags determined or specified? A tagging system is flat by default. Though that makes rendering the tree somewhat easier...

wander_homer 5y ago
You don't need to define relationships between tags. Like in my audio player the songs have certain tags which don't have anything to do with each other and yet the player can create tree like structures from them. For example when you have songs with tags for %genre%, %artist%, %album% and %title%, the player can automatically generate various tree structures with different levels, like: 1. genre 2. artist 3. album 4. title or 1. genre 3. album 4. title or just 1. title or even less useful ones like 1. title 2. album
- dredmorbius 5y ago
  And what is the player's method? Magic? Note that in the case of artist -> album -> title, there is in fact an actual explicit hierarchy that's being reconstructed. In the case of conceptual tags ... any such structure is far less evidently defined.
  - wander_homer 5y ago
    I'm not sure why you think there's magic involved. Say you have songs with three sort of tags, album, genre and title. I.e.: song_1: genre_1, album_1, title_1 song_2: genre_2, album_2, title_2 song_3: genre_1, album_3, title_3 Now when the user wants a tree with the first level being genre and the second being title, the player just goes through all the know genres to build the first level with two items (genre_1 and genre_2), then for the genre_1 sub-tree it generates a list of all songs with genre_1 and displays their title, ... So you end up with: genre_1 |-> title_1 |-> title_3 genre_2 |-> title_2 Those are basically just normal database lookups. Edit: In fact since the player allows for multi-value tags, items can even appear multiple times in the tree, e.g. when a song has multiple artists.
    - dredmorbius 5y ago
      The point to my question wasn't that there is magic involved, but to ask what the specific method was. Maybe I should have made that clearer, though I was hoping it would be obvious. In the artist -> album -> song case, to repeat myself, the recognised hierarchy reflects an actual one that's present in the original artefacts. (This needn't always be the case: multiple artists might play the same song, the same song might be on multiple albums, song title itself does not necessarily imply either artist or album. Though in the simple case it does.) In the genre/title example, how would it be clear that title is a subclass of genre rather than the other way 'round? And what of fusion or crossover works --- is DNA's remix of "Tom's Diner" folk-rock, a capella, or trip-hop?
      - wander_homer 5y ago