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> Docker... don't get me started, and don't make excuses. (~700 people at Mirantis and ~150k at Apple can't figure this out?) The whole reason Docker exists ma

by least 5y ago

> Docker... don't get me started, and don't make excuses. (~700 people at Mirantis and ~150k at Apple can't figure this out?) The whole reason Docker exists makes complaining about its performance on non-linux operating systems asinine. > Why don't sed, awk, grep, etc.. all the Linux things work quite right? Because MacOS is BSD-based and those tools aren't "Linux" things. You can install the GNU equivalents easily if you dislike them. > I could forgive Linux, but not an OS and Hardware made by the biggest company on the damn planet. Software development doesn't particularly care about the fact that Apple is the biggest company on the planet. The pooled resources going into development of linux is quite substantial and yet it too still has plenty of software issues. LTS kernels can have hundreds of patches because software development is hard no matter how many eyes you have looking at it.

pengaru 5y ago
> The whole reason Docker exists makes complaining about its performance on non-linux operating systems asinine. TIL there's a single "whole" reason Docker exists. Please, enlighten me, what exactly is that reason?
- least 5y ago
  A quick search would answer your question: https://www.docker.com/why-docker https://www.docker.com/why-docker
  - pengaru 5y ago
    Can you distill that into the single whole reason you're referring to? It's unclear to me just reading that marketing page. If it's "to provide a standardized unit of software that allows developers to isolate their app from its environment, solving the 'it works on my machine' headache", I don't see how it makes expecting good performance asinine. Linux's ABI is stable, MacOS can definitely implement it... there's nothing in Docker/Linux containers in general, forcing MacOS to incur virtualization overhead.
    - MonaroVXR 5y ago
      It doesn't solve the "it works on my machine" that's the ironic thing, that I've discovered through someone else too
- tarsinge 5y ago
  Docker is built on specific features of the Linux kernel. From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docker_(software) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docker_(software): > When running on Linux, Docker uses the resource isolation features of the Linux kernel (such as cgroups and kernel namespaces) and a union-capable file system (such as OverlayFS)to allow containers to run within a single Linux instance, avoiding the overhead of starting and maintaining virtual machines.[12] Docker on macOS uses a Linux virtual machine to run the containers.
  - pengaru 5y ago
    And MacOS is built on Darwin; a hodgepodge of FreeBSD atop Mach and years of iterating on that. Point being, Apple has zero barriers to making Mach look like an existing interface to userspace a la FreeBSD. They can take advantage of Linux's stable ABI and add the necessary Linux interfaces for native Linux containers support, and it could be performant. The whole x86 on ARM problem seems like the more difficult one to make performant from where I'm sitting, but there's no shortage of claims to the contrary saying x86 emulation on the M1 is fast enough even for demanding video games.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- coldtea 5y ago
  >Please, enlighten me, what exactly is that reason? To serve as an easier to use facade on top of Linux kernel virtualization options. It only works on Linux - or with an emulated Linux.
deleted 5y ago
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by least 5y ago

pengaru 5y ago

> The whole reason Docker exists makes complaining about its performance on non-linux operating systems asinine. TIL there's a single "whole" reason Docker exists. Please, enlighten me, what exactly is that reason?

least 5y ago
A quick search would answer your question: https://www.docker.com/why-docker https://www.docker.com/why-docker
- pengaru 5y ago
  Can you distill that into the single whole reason you're referring to? It's unclear to me just reading that marketing page. If it's "to provide a standardized unit of software that allows developers to isolate their app from its environment, solving the 'it works on my machine' headache", I don't see how it makes expecting good performance asinine. Linux's ABI is stable, MacOS can definitely implement it... there's nothing in Docker/Linux containers in general, forcing MacOS to incur virtualization overhead.
  - MonaroVXR 5y ago
    It doesn't solve the "it works on my machine" that's the ironic thing, that I've discovered through someone else too
tarsinge 5y ago
Docker is built on specific features of the Linux kernel. From Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docker_(software) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Docker_(software): > When running on Linux, Docker uses the resource isolation features of the Linux kernel (such as cgroups and kernel namespaces) and a union-capable file system (such as OverlayFS)to allow containers to run within a single Linux instance, avoiding the overhead of starting and maintaining virtual machines.[12] Docker on macOS uses a Linux virtual machine to run the containers.
- pengaru 5y ago
  And MacOS is built on Darwin; a hodgepodge of FreeBSD atop Mach and years of iterating on that. Point being, Apple has zero barriers to making Mach look like an existing interface to userspace a la FreeBSD. They can take advantage of Linux's stable ABI and add the necessary Linux interfaces for native Linux containers support, and it could be performant. The whole x86 on ARM problem seems like the more difficult one to make performant from where I'm sitting, but there's no shortage of claims to the contrary saying x86 emulation on the M1 is fast enough even for demanding video games.
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
coldtea 5y ago
>Please, enlighten me, what exactly is that reason? To serve as an easier to use facade on top of Linux kernel virtualization options. It only works on Linux - or with an emulated Linux.

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]