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You actually confirmed my assumptions about self-perpetuating corruption. Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and

by rini17 5y ago

You actually confirmed my assumptions about self-perpetuating corruption. Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and mindset leave? Sending back money alone won't do it. These people may personally have worse life if they stayed, not denying that. But what about global view? First world will eventually have to deal with resulting political turmoil.

AussieWog93 5y ago
>Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and mindset leave? Sending back money alone won't do it. You're ignoring the WhatsApp factor. Immigrants experience first hand how well Western democracy works and then share that with everybody back home. It's also quite common, at least in my experience, for people to follow politics back home. Invariably, they advocate quite vocally for more democracy, less corruption and less discrimination.
- rini17 5y ago
  Whatsapp is not enough! Some of them need to stay there and actually get elected. Democracy needs not only advocacy but also competent politicians, and that's a rare talent. Probably there are enough of them in your country so you can't even imagine that as a requirement. Count yourself lucky.
lotsofpulp 5y ago
So the children born in developed countries (who got developed on the backs of undeveloped countries) are entitled to living better lives than children born in undeveloped countries, who should not have the opportunity to move out to developed countries?
- rightbyte 5y ago
  Most developed countries were not colonial powers. How did e.g. South Korea and Finland become "developed" on the backs of the third world?
  - lotsofpulp 5y ago
    Look at it by population. US/UK/EU/Can/Aus, the more popular immigration destinations.
    - AussieWog93 5y ago
      If providing a decent life to a hard working, aspirational individual whose work ethic and talent would have been pissed up the wall back at home counts as "developing off the back" of poorer nations, then I don't really see it as a bad thing at all. Don't forget that many developing countries have a wide array of policies in place to ensure that they can't make proper use of their human capital. My father-in-law, for example, is an environmental scientist who simply couldn't find work in his field (public sector) back in South Africa in the early 00s as there were racial quotas and affirmative action policies that didn't work in his favour. He was offered a job in NZ, after a solid year of being unemployed, and jumped ship immediately. His talent wasn't stolen by the developed world so much as it wasted by his underdeveloped home.
      - lotsofpulp 5y ago
        I was referring to the era when resources were extracted to developed countries or labor (slaves) were moved around as needed to developing countries as “developing of the back” of poorer countries. We are saying the same thing.

by rini17 5y ago

AussieWog93 5y ago

>Tell me who is going to actually improve that if most people with necessary skills and mindset leave? Sending back money alone won't do it. You're ignoring the WhatsApp factor. Immigrants experience first hand how well Western democracy works and then share that with everybody back home. It's also quite common, at least in my experience, for people to follow politics back home. Invariably, they advocate quite vocally for more democracy, less corruption and less discrimination.

rini17 5y ago
Whatsapp is not enough! Some of them need to stay there and actually get elected. Democracy needs not only advocacy but also competent politicians, and that's a rare talent. Probably there are enough of them in your country so you can't even imagine that as a requirement. Count yourself lucky.

lotsofpulp 5y ago

So the children born in developed countries (who got developed on the backs of undeveloped countries) are entitled to living better lives than children born in undeveloped countries, who should not have the opportunity to move out to developed countries?

rightbyte 5y ago
Most developed countries were not colonial powers. How did e.g. South Korea and Finland become "developed" on the backs of the third world?
- lotsofpulp 5y ago
  Look at it by population. US/UK/EU/Can/Aus, the more popular immigration destinations.
  - AussieWog93 5y ago
    If providing a decent life to a hard working, aspirational individual whose work ethic and talent would have been pissed up the wall back at home counts as "developing off the back" of poorer nations, then I don't really see it as a bad thing at all. Don't forget that many developing countries have a wide array of policies in place to ensure that they can't make proper use of their human capital. My father-in-law, for example, is an environmental scientist who simply couldn't find work in his field (public sector) back in South Africa in the early 00s as there were racial quotas and affirmative action policies that didn't work in his favour. He was offered a job in NZ, after a solid year of being unemployed, and jumped ship immediately. His talent wasn't stolen by the developed world so much as it wasted by his underdeveloped home.
    - lotsofpulp 5y ago
      I was referring to the era when resources were extracted to developed countries or labor (slaves) were moved around as needed to developing countries as “developing of the back” of poorer countries. We are saying the same thing.