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Famine would be a choice though, not an inevitable consequence of fertilizer availability. Crops can be shifted to legumes, and away from livestock production,

Famine would be a choice though, not an inevitable consequence of fertilizer availability. Crops can be shifted to legumes, and away from livestock production, we spend a lot of calories on preference these days.

coffeemig 5y ago
Maybe that’s the play to transition western consumers off of meat diets. Gotta happen someday soon, right?
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
- gjsman-1000 5y ago
  No. Don’t underestimate how radical and unpopular dropping meat is with the more level-headed parts of the country. One can admit the existence of Climate Change while thinking the proposed solutions are too far and just power-hungry bunk.
  - coffeemig 5y ago
    I’m not saying I’m excited about it. I’ve seen other policies go through lately that make level-headed people tear their hair out.
jtdev 5y ago
You clearly know very little about agriculture. Beef cattle actually graze many hundreds of thousands of acres of land that could not realistically be converted to legume production.
- dang 5y ago
  Please do not cross into personal attack on HN, no matter how little someone else knows or you feel they know. Your comment would be fine without the first sentence, and even better if you had added one or two sentences more to explain why it could not realistically be converted to legume production. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=share%20know%20learn%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor... Edit: having looked at your comment history, it's painfully clear that you're using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's the line at which we ban accounts*, regardless of what they're battling for, so I've banned this account. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. * https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=false&page=0&query=primarily%20test%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...
- maxerickson 5y ago
  Corn can be converted, and it's not like finishing of livestock consumes zero corn and soy. Also, what's with the insulting tone?
  - tomrod 5y ago
    I agree, grandparent comment is pretty brash while also being substantively wrong. Most of our meat in the US comes from factory farms. > 70.4 percent of cows, 98.3 percent of pigs, 99.8 percent of turkeys, 98.2 percent of egg-laying hens, and over 99.9 percent of chickens raised for meat come from factory farms. https://www.livekindly.co/99-animal-products-factory-farms/ https://www.livekindly.co/99-animal-products-factory-farms/ This said, the range that beef cattle occasionally graze could be reclaimed, but not necessarily for legume production. Legumes: https://gilmour.com/planting-zones-hardiness-map https://gilmour.com/planting-zones-hardiness-map Beef: https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biological-sciences/grazing-lands https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biolog... There is overlap, but no where close to 100%.
- tomrod 5y ago
  Factory farmed meat processes aren't open range.
- notfromhere 5y ago
  Grazed cattle doesn’t need fertilizer

coffeemig 5y ago

Maybe that’s the play to transition western consumers off of meat diets. Gotta happen someday soon, right?

deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
gjsman-1000 5y ago
No. Don’t underestimate how radical and unpopular dropping meat is with the more level-headed parts of the country. One can admit the existence of Climate Change while thinking the proposed solutions are too far and just power-hungry bunk.
- coffeemig 5y ago
  I’m not saying I’m excited about it. I’ve seen other policies go through lately that make level-headed people tear their hair out.

jtdev 5y ago

You clearly know very little about agriculture. Beef cattle actually graze many hundreds of thousands of acres of land that could not realistically be converted to legume production.

dang 5y ago
Please do not cross into personal attack on HN, no matter how little someone else knows or you feel they know. Your comment would be fine without the first sentence, and even better if you had added one or two sentences more to explain why it could not realistically be converted to legume production. https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sort=byDate&type=comment&query=share%20know%20learn%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?dateRange=all&page=0&prefix=true&sor... Edit: having looked at your comment history, it's painfully clear that you're using HN primarily for ideological battle. That's the line at which we ban accounts*, regardless of what they're battling for, so I've banned this account. If you don't want to be banned, you're welcome to email hn@ycombinator.com and give us reason to believe that you'll follow the rules in the future. They're here: https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html. * https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comment&storyText=false&prefix=false&page=0&query=primarily%20test%20by:dang https://hn.algolia.com/?sort=byDate&dateRange=all&type=comme...
maxerickson 5y ago
Corn can be converted, and it's not like finishing of livestock consumes zero corn and soy. Also, what's with the insulting tone?
- tomrod 5y ago
  I agree, grandparent comment is pretty brash while also being substantively wrong. Most of our meat in the US comes from factory farms. > 70.4 percent of cows, 98.3 percent of pigs, 99.8 percent of turkeys, 98.2 percent of egg-laying hens, and over 99.9 percent of chickens raised for meat come from factory farms. https://www.livekindly.co/99-animal-products-factory-farms/ https://www.livekindly.co/99-animal-products-factory-farms/ This said, the range that beef cattle occasionally graze could be reclaimed, but not necessarily for legume production. Legumes: https://gilmour.com/planting-zones-hardiness-map https://gilmour.com/planting-zones-hardiness-map Beef: https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biological-sciences/grazing-lands https://www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biolog... There is overlap, but no where close to 100%.
tomrod 5y ago
Factory farmed meat processes aren't open range.
notfromhere 5y ago
Grazed cattle doesn’t need fertilizer