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In fairness, we're only hearing one side of the argument here. It's easy enough for anyone to say they're hard-working diligent team players, but we don't know
by andygrd 5y ago
In fairness, we're only hearing one side of the argument here. It's easy enough for anyone to say they're hard-working diligent team players, but we don't know if they're getting the work done! Don't get me wrong, Google are notoriously nasty when you get on the wrong side of management, but to start claiming discrimination is a bit fresh.
- andygrd 5y agoAlso, publicly naming the manager is pretty bad karma. It's like they're anticipating or expecting some Twitter pile on.
- blip54321 5y agoYeah. That was a bad call. Having been a manager, about 1/10th of employees had... issues. Those employees took up an inordinate amount of management time and especially energy. I don't know whether she or her manager were the problem; in most cases, it's 50/50. If I know a potential hire had issues before, it raises the risk of a hire a lot. I want to avoid that kind of employee. If they act unprofessionally after leaving, that goes up to 95/5. Perhaps her boss had issues, but she definitely did as well. Posting a list of management emails? Naming her boss publicly? That goes to a serious red flag. When I was managing, I would never have hired someone who did this. The risk goes in several directions too. Since then, I've picked up a harassing stalker. Having an employee do this sort of thing went from psychologically draining to potentially devastating to my safety. Privacy is kind of important.
- evgen 5y agoNaming their manager in twitter complaint and then asking people to spam every node in the org chart from their manager up to Sundar. Yeah, that is going to get the results you want...
- Ecstatify 5y agoNot the best move but at the same time what else is there she can do? Being young, in your "dream job" and then being told "there’s someone waiting outside to collect your corp devices" without any real explanation. It's 100% HR + Managers fault that this situation has escalated to this. If a future employer asks for a reference from Google she's screwed. This whole "don't say anything bad about X, it will reflect badly on you" is how the Epsteins and Weinsteins of the world go undetected for years. If what she says is true she should probably go to a lawyer and sue.
- UncleMeat 5y agoThis is a weird one. Google is notoriously slow to fire people for performance reasons. People get Needs Improvement ratings. They go on PIPs. It takes ages. A sudden termination typically means something else. This can either mean that the individual did something especially foolish or a lot of people are doing the wrong thing to get this person fired (a manager, a skip, some people in HR, and probably a director would be involved in this sort of thing). But the complaints here seem to be related to performance management. Getting a frustratingly low rating. Being told that they aren't doing enough work. For this sort of situation I'd expect the firing process to take months. "CME for missing a meeting" is strange, but the good news is that manager calibration notes are stored in durable systems and in many locales people have the legal right to see them. So it'd be possible to see if this was actually the reason for a rating. We'll see if more information comes out.
- 0xy 5y agoThe individual was very likely on a PIP. They mentioned "performance issues". It could've went on for months. If a manager really wants you gone they can manufacture evidence and have you yanked quickly by constructing unobtainable and/or subjective PIP targets.
- pg_1234 5y agoNot at all, ALWAYS name the bad managers ... it's the only way they will face repercussions, and the only way to deter others from following in their footsteps.
- rStar 5y agogoogle is so big nobody can get anyone else’s attention. so making a public stink, while very questionable otherwise, may get someone’s attention who’s able to fix this mess
- blip54321 5y agoIt does deter others from following in their footsteps. Once name-and-shame comes in, that deters anyone but the super-privileged from going into management. No one who can't weather name-and-shame will go for jobs like that. Name-and-shame is... random. I've never been hit, but the people I've seen hit... It hasn't had much to do with them, so much as with the people doing the shaming.
- rStar 5y agoname and shame. only way to change
- WesolyKubeczek 5y agoTruth be told, there’s this giant argument in support of this side: the person is on H1B work visa. Which makes one think twice before slacking off on the job or whatever they were accused of. Compared to residents, the price for not keeping the job is way too high, so I’d rather assume they really worked their arse off.
- webmobdev 5y agoA friend from India is a recent immigrant (arrived on H1-B) and is now a US citizen. He is working for a company that also has a lot of fellow indians on H1-B visa. His salary is rougly 50% higher (for the same profile), and he gets to go home by 6 PM while they still slog with all the extra work they are expected to do.
- WesolyKubeczek 5y agoLemme guess, the non-cititens also dream of getting residence or citizenship and work humanly hours and go home at six while their slack will be picked up by the next wave of serfs. Bonus if they can boss around some.
- manuelabeledo 5y agoIgnoring the fact that H-1B visa holders have to be paid a “prevailing wage”, which makes extremely difficult for them to be 50% underpaid, are you suggesting that your friend has kept the same work profile as recently arrived workers for well over ten years? I have know Indians who, after almost two decades in the country, finally managed to get ahold a green card. Most I have worked with, have been on H-1B visas for at least eight years. It is hard to believe that someone would have left his or her home country, for a specialized and well paid job in the US, but haven’t progressed at all in the seniority scale in decades.
- webmobdev 5y ago"Prevailing wage" doesn't mean equal wages because there's no such thing - there's a payscale for every position, and it is different in every company. And H1-B visa holders invariably get the lower end of the payscale (often the lowest). This ends up being even lower when they arrive through indian IT consultancy firms. > are you suggesting that your friend has kept the same work profile as recently arrived workers for well over ten years? I have no idea where you got that idea from. He married a US citizen, and became one himself after a few years. As soon as he became a US citizen, he got an offer from an indian IT consultancy firm with a pay hike of $75,000 based on his multi-national experience / expertise and, ofcourse, the fact that he was a US citizen.
- rStar 5y agoin fairness, it’s easy to continue to be naive when you give the biggest corporation on earth, more or less, every possible benefit of the doubt