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Does it count if you support the PRC territory reunited under the auspices of the ROC? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Chinas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T
by adolph 5y ago
Does it count if you support the PRC territory reunited under the auspices of the ROC?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Chinas https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two_Chinas
- irthomasthomas 5y agoI often wonder why we don't use North China, and South China. I guess it boils down to influence.
- HideousKojima 5y agoPersonally I prefer "Taiwan" and "West Taiwan" solely to annoy pro-CCP shills/50 cent army posters.
- jjoonathan 5y agoMy favorite way to poke the 50 cent army is to say I hope that Taiwan has nukes / the US should give Taiwan nukes. It cuts right to the core dissonance between the "Taiwan was always part of China" claims and the actual sovereignty situation on the ground.
- stevespang 5y ago[dead]
- adolph 5y agoDo they not already have one of those totally peaceful, totally civilian nuclear programs?
- kingkawn 5y agoCause the terminology is not historically relevant to the region or the way people talk about those areas
- adolph 5y agoWhy is “historically relevant” relevant? People can choose how they talk about the region and how people talk about some thing frames how folks think about it. The PRC wants to guide how people view its claims. On what basis is a different claim any less valid?
- kingkawn 5y agoHistorical relevance means using terminology that is relevant to the people who are there. North and south China have meanings to people already that aren’t the ones suggested above. That everyone isnt changing to match a drive-by attempt at terminology to satisfy no need is self explanatory.
- stjohnswarts 5y agoYeah North and South China are still mainland China to me. Taiwan is Taiwan and a perfectly useable name.
- adolph 5y ago> Historical relevance means using terminology that is relevant to the people who are there. Wouldn’t that approach needlessly advantage genocidaires?
- kingkawn 5y agoIt advantages common use by people that makes it easier to communicate, not the cultural engineering you’re imagining
- ad404b8a372f2b9 5y agoI reckon it's got more to do with land area and population.
- adolph 5y agoIf the PRC were confident in their claim, given the land area and population, you’d think they wouldn’t give two poos what people support.
- rich_sasha 5y agoPerhaps because both claim to be “the one China”, just figuring out who’s right: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-China_policy https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One-China_policy
- mytailorisrich 5y agoBecause of two things: 1. Taiwan is a single province of China, not a large split of the country like happened in Germany, Korea, Vietnam. In the US that would be like if a small state split from the rest. 2. Perhaps more importantly, the PRC considers that the ROC ceased to exist in 1949 and was fully superseded by the PRC. So Taiwan is really just a province of the PRC and must be referred to as such in order to walk the political/rhetorical line. For historical reasons they are very touchy about giving the impression that China is split into several states.
- philliphaydon 5y ago> Taiwan is a single province of China No. Taiwan is not part of China. For 200 years the Qing dynasty did nothing with Taiwan. It never ruled it, never controlled the people. In 1887 the decided oneday “let’s call Taiwan a Provence” This is the equivalent of a bunch of Americans moving to Canada and after a couple of generations America saying “let’s call Canada a state” When the Japanese invaded Taiwan, the Qing dynasty threw in the towel immediately and said “yeah we don’t care it’s yours”. Japan then ruled Taiwan with an iron fist, implementing law and order, education, infrastructure, and teaching Japanese. At no point in history has china ever ruled over Taiwan. Taiwan is not a Provence.
- mytailorisrich 5y agoI certainly agree that Taiwan is not a Provence. However, it is indeed historically and factually a province of China. This is actually internationally recognised and that's why in 1945 it was retroceded by Japan to the Republic of China, where it remains. If you want to nit-pick I will grant you that between 1683 and 1887 it was part of Fujian province rather that being an administrative province in its own right. > This is the equivalent of a bunch of Americans moving to Canada and after a couple of generations America saying “let’s call Canada a state” No, this is equivalent to Americans moving to Hawaii and calling it a state... And in fact, China took over Taiwan to counter Europeans who were seizing all the land they could all over the world, and tried to seize Taiwan as well. > At no point in history has china ever ruled over Taiwan. Formally it did between 1683 and 1895, and then it has been since 1945.
- poorjohnmacafee 5y agoThe ROC does in a sense represent the millennia of traditional chinese culture, whereas the communists sought to destroy it (great leap forward, cultural revolution) starting 70 years ago. The ROC were the ones who also fought off Japan to save China, while the communists just waited until they were weakened from fighting Japan and just swept down to take the country from them.
- rich_sasha 5y agoAs far as I can tell, it would be hard to picture the Kuomintang as goodies (in the period you describe).
- s1artibartfast 5y agoLike most things, it's not black and white. I don't think it is a stretch to say defending China from Japanese Conquest was good for China (and the WW2 allies)
- helloworld11 5y agoThey certainly weren't the "goodies". Chiang Kai Shek's regime was notoriously corrupt and authoritarian, but that they fought the Japanese invaders far more than Mao's communists did from their northern stronghold is indisputable. They often fought terribly, and in the Japanese Ichigo Offensive of 1944, Nationalist losses were catastrophic, but they also inflicted major material losses on the Japanese in turn. The communists did barely any of this in comparison. Mao was very self-serving in his tactics throughout the war and no less vicious/autocratic and corrupt regionally than Chiang.