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An old timer told me to soak beans until they stop foaming (producing bubbles), which takes about 3 days. I disregarded it then, but years later experimented w

An old timer told me to soak beans until they stop foaming (producing bubbles), which takes about 3 days. I disregarded it then, but years later experimented with adding sourdough starter to the soak in an attempt to break down some of the indigestible starches. This lead me on a wild experimental phase of reading up on the lacto-fermention process. The Weston Price Foundation talks a lot about the problems of "anti-nutrients" like phytic acid and enzyme prohibitors in beans and grains. A preferment before cooking seems to eliminate these to the point where a final pressure cooking removes the rest. Drain the water, or slop some of the soak water in the next batch of beans to inoculate. I have found that if I let the soak go too long that a good deal of lactic acid builds up in the beans which causes them to take longer to cook. Rinsing well and then adding a 1/4 teaspoon of baking soda seems to neutralize the added acidity. The beans are smooth inside and have a distinctly greater umami flavor, likely due to some protein breakdown into amino acids. Fun stuff.

jdally987 5y ago
So wait, what would your quick & dirty advice be for the overall simplest way to achieve decent beans? I soak pintos (from the giant Walmart 20lb bags) overnight and into the instant pot for 22mins, but have noticed the same thing where if I get lazy and let them soak for almost 24hrs before cooking, they tend to come out way too firm and not satisfying at all. Wasn’t sure if it was just my imagination
- GhettoComputers 5y ago
  For decent tasting beans don’t soak them at all, clean and boil them normally with some salt or bullion. Never soak your beans if you want them to taste good.
  - nanomonkey 5y ago
    I eat a lot of beans, and not soaking the beans has always ended up giving me gas. Do you not experience this? As for flavor, I can't recall having more flavor coming from not soaking the beans. In fact I get more umami richness from a long soak.
    - GhettoComputers 5y ago
      Yes and soaking scientifically doesn't affect it either. >Gray and his colleagues developed a method for extracting most of the alpha-galactosides from beans. The beans are boiled for three minutes (effectively killing the bean and allowing the sugars to pass through the cell walls), then allowed to stand for two hours. That water is poured off and the beans are covered and soaked for another two hours. Then they’re drained, covered and soaked another two hours before being drained and rinsed a final time. >This method succeeded in ridding the beans of 90% of the troublesome sugars, but as you might expect, there was a side effect. “I used to do this blanch-soak method all the time at home and it works very nicely,” Gray says. “The one thing people who ate dinner with us have noted is that you do lose some flavor.” >What’s more -- without going into details of what they measured and how -- suffice it to say that even with almost all of the alpha-galactosides gone, there wasn’t a consistent marked decrease in human flatulence. >“We reduced the alpha-galactoside content by 90% but we haven’t done anything to dietary fiber,” says Gray, “and dietary fiber produces similar effects.” https://www.latimes.com/food/dailydish/la-dd-dont-soak-dried-beans-20140911-story.html https://www.latimes.com/food/dailydish/la-dd-dont-soak-dried...
- laurencerowe 5y ago
  Do you notice any improvement from soaking them overnight to just cooking them slightly longer in the instant pot?
- nanomonkey 5y ago
  My first suggestion would be to cook it longer than 22 minutes. Instapots only go up to around 9 lbs of pressure on high, from what I read, so any pressure cooking recipe that is expecting a 10-15 lb pressure stove top cooker will need some extra time added. I cook my pintos and red beans for 30 minutes. I would add a 1/4 teaspoon of baking soda to the water. I don't reuse my soak water, and I don't salt my water until after they have cooked. I may experiment with adding salt beforehand later, but I suspect that I'll need to add salt to the soak water too for this method. Adding garlic and bay leafs are nice, but not necessary, as is an onion. For red beans I often blacken an onion on the stove and then throw it in whole in the pot with the beans.
yissp 5y ago
Regarding the anti-nutrient thing, I recall reading that letting the beans (or grains) sprout will also break some of those down. I tried it once with some chickpeas and it does give them an interesting flavor, although it's a bit of a hassle and I haven't bothered to do it again.
- eyelidlessness 5y ago
  This lines up really well with other fermentation techniques like malting grain for eg beer/liquor. It wouldn’t be surprising at all if it has similar benefits for other hard to digest sugar sources like beans
kiliantics 5y ago
In the last year my perception of beans has changed a lot, mainly because I started getting beans from Rancho Gordo which are supposedly very fresh. The claim is that using recently-harvested beans will give you better results than you can get with most dry beans that are available. I have no idea what typical harvest-to-consumption times are for Goya or other brands like that, the Rancho Gordo beans are supposed to be no older than 1 year. I'm pretty convinced by this argument. In general I find that fresher produce is significantly better when you can get it. In NYC it's hard to come by except for at food co-ops and farmers markets. I've also bought very freshly-milled flour last year during the Great Sourdough Obsession and it was significantly more flavourful and better behaved. I wonder if the real issue with cooking beans is simply one of freshness but other than the Rancho Gordo claims I have yet to see other mention of this.

jdally987 5y ago

So wait, what would your quick & dirty advice be for the overall simplest way to achieve decent beans? I soak pintos (from the giant Walmart 20lb bags) overnight and into the instant pot for 22mins, but have noticed the same thing where if I get lazy and let them soak for almost 24hrs before cooking, they tend to come out way too firm and not satisfying at all. Wasn’t sure if it was just my imagination

GhettoComputers 5y ago
For decent tasting beans don’t soak them at all, clean and boil them normally with some salt or bullion. Never soak your beans if you want them to taste good.
- nanomonkey 5y ago
  I eat a lot of beans, and not soaking the beans has always ended up giving me gas. Do you not experience this? As for flavor, I can't recall having more flavor coming from not soaking the beans. In fact I get more umami richness from a long soak.
  - GhettoComputers 5y ago
    Yes and soaking scientifically doesn't affect it either. >Gray and his colleagues developed a method for extracting most of the alpha-galactosides from beans. The beans are boiled for three minutes (effectively killing the bean and allowing the sugars to pass through the cell walls), then allowed to stand for two hours. That water is poured off and the beans are covered and soaked for another two hours. Then they’re drained, covered and soaked another two hours before being drained and rinsed a final time. >This method succeeded in ridding the beans of 90% of the troublesome sugars, but as you might expect, there was a side effect. “I used to do this blanch-soak method all the time at home and it works very nicely,” Gray says. “The one thing people who ate dinner with us have noted is that you do lose some flavor.” >What’s more -- without going into details of what they measured and how -- suffice it to say that even with almost all of the alpha-galactosides gone, there wasn’t a consistent marked decrease in human flatulence. >“We reduced the alpha-galactoside content by 90% but we haven’t done anything to dietary fiber,” says Gray, “and dietary fiber produces similar effects.” https://www.latimes.com/food/dailydish/la-dd-dont-soak-dried-beans-20140911-story.html https://www.latimes.com/food/dailydish/la-dd-dont-soak-dried...
laurencerowe 5y ago
Do you notice any improvement from soaking them overnight to just cooking them slightly longer in the instant pot?
nanomonkey 5y ago
My first suggestion would be to cook it longer than 22 minutes. Instapots only go up to around 9 lbs of pressure on high, from what I read, so any pressure cooking recipe that is expecting a 10-15 lb pressure stove top cooker will need some extra time added. I cook my pintos and red beans for 30 minutes. I would add a 1/4 teaspoon of baking soda to the water. I don't reuse my soak water, and I don't salt my water until after they have cooked. I may experiment with adding salt beforehand later, but I suspect that I'll need to add salt to the soak water too for this method. Adding garlic and bay leafs are nice, but not necessary, as is an onion. For red beans I often blacken an onion on the stove and then throw it in whole in the pot with the beans.

yissp 5y ago

Regarding the anti-nutrient thing, I recall reading that letting the beans (or grains) sprout will also break some of those down. I tried it once with some chickpeas and it does give them an interesting flavor, although it's a bit of a hassle and I haven't bothered to do it again.

eyelidlessness 5y ago
This lines up really well with other fermentation techniques like malting grain for eg beer/liquor. It wouldn’t be surprising at all if it has similar benefits for other hard to digest sugar sources like beans

kiliantics 5y ago

In the last year my perception of beans has changed a lot, mainly because I started getting beans from Rancho Gordo which are supposedly very fresh. The claim is that using recently-harvested beans will give you better results than you can get with most dry beans that are available. I have no idea what typical harvest-to-consumption times are for Goya or other brands like that, the Rancho Gordo beans are supposed to be no older than 1 year. I'm pretty convinced by this argument. In general I find that fresher produce is significantly better when you can get it. In NYC it's hard to come by except for at food co-ops and farmers markets. I've also bought very freshly-milled flour last year during the Great Sourdough Obsession and it was significantly more flavourful and better behaved. I wonder if the real issue with cooking beans is simply one of freshness but other than the Rancho Gordo claims I have yet to see other mention of this.