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This dorm really is an abomination and the correct response here would've been for the university to say "thanks, but no thanks" to Munger's money with the stip

by cletus 5y ago

This dorm really is an abomination and the correct response here would've been for the university to say "thanks, but no thanks" to Munger's money with the stipulations he placed on it. In following this story someone raised the comparison to University of Cincinnati's Sander Hall [1], which was actually less crowded than this. This now demolished building had problems from criminal offences to evacuations caused by people intentionally setting off fire alarms. Evacuating this dorm in such cases is going to be a nightmare given the ratio of students to fire stairs and you know that's going to happen. Architecture matters. The experience matters. Common areas, such as they are, with this many students will undoubtedly turn feral almost immediately. Putting people in windowless cells but defending it as "everyone gets their own room" is not the solution. Billionaires reach an age when the only thing they value is putting their name on everything. It's why there are so many concert halls, colleges, etc named "Carnegie" (after Andrew Carnegie, the 19th century steel industrialist). You don't have to take their money. I'm sure UCSB isn't struggling for cash. [1]: https://medium.com/@spncrtckrmn/the-rise-and-demise-of-ucs-sander-hall-239eacf2788e https://medium.com/@spncrtckrmn/the-rise-and-demise-of-ucs-s...

memetomancer 5y ago
Needs pointing out: You are asserting stuff like "This dorm really is an abomination" and "Common areas, such as they are, with this many students will undoubtedly turn feral almost immediately" with out actually seeming to support your arguments. This comes off as hyperbolic and biased, and more likely, some combination of thoughtlessness and arrogance which makes the opposing view seem more honest. Your reference to a 50 year old dorm in another state, with a completely different layout and a culture more informed by the film Animal House than Instagram hardly bears up. The building is shorter with more space for emergency exits. It may well have integrated fire suppression and active monitoring. And each of these sleeping spaces with no windows is said to attach to a 'house' with a private common area and real windows. Nothing like the isolated skyscraper dorm you link to. Moreover, touchy feely points like "Architecture matters. The experience matters." only raise red flags for me, especially when considered with your next point: "Billionaires reach an age when the only thing they value is putting their name on everything." This particular billionaire clearly has an enthusiastic engagement with the details of the project and a vision for solving the problems he's mentioned in the article, namely removing the need for freshmen to lodge with a stranger. A billionaire that just wanted to "put their name on everything" would pay the money, let the architect do their thing and never consider what it would be like to live in the results, right? This guy seems to be trying to fix the complaints from his eight(!) children, so future generations don't face the same. You might have a point buried in your post somewhere, but in your rush to slam this whole thing without backing it up, you've lost me.
- chaosite 5y ago
  I agree with you on the rebuttal, but disagree with you on your description of this specific building. This is supposedly the floor plan: https://static.dezeen.com/uploads/2021/11/munger-hall-university-of-california-santa-barbara-floor-plan_dezeen_2364_col_0-1704x1226.jpg https://static.dezeen.com/uploads/2021/11/munger-hall-univer... > each of these sleeping spaces with no windows is said to attach to a 'house' with a private common area and real windows. Nothing like the isolated skyscraper dorm you link to. Yeah, but not quite. First, these "sleeping spaces with no windows" are apartments, a cluster of 7 single-occupancy bedrooms, with a common area in the middle, with kitchenette, shared bathrooms, etc. It's a self-contained unit. And most of these units have no windows at all. 8 of these units form a "house", with a large common area and real windows, as you see. But it's a space shared by 56 people, and their guests. Calling it private is rather stretching that term.
the_optimist 5y ago
What is the ratio (and the correct measure of) students to stairs?
- Majromax 5y ago
  From the floor plan linked elsewhere in this thread, I count ten stairwells spaced around the perimeter of the building, which would imply a ratio of about 450 residents per stairwell.
  - the_optimist 5y ago
    Is that an acceptable number? What’s the necessary throughput of a stairwell for an evacuation? I have certainly lived and worked in buildings where the number of people per stairwell was far higher.

by cletus 5y ago

memetomancer 5y ago

Needs pointing out: You are asserting stuff like "This dorm really is an abomination" and "Common areas, such as they are, with this many students will undoubtedly turn feral almost immediately" with out actually seeming to support your arguments. This comes off as hyperbolic and biased, and more likely, some combination of thoughtlessness and arrogance which makes the opposing view seem more honest. Your reference to a 50 year old dorm in another state, with a completely different layout and a culture more informed by the film Animal House than Instagram hardly bears up. The building is shorter with more space for emergency exits. It may well have integrated fire suppression and active monitoring. And each of these sleeping spaces with no windows is said to attach to a 'house' with a private common area and real windows. Nothing like the isolated skyscraper dorm you link to. Moreover, touchy feely points like "Architecture matters. The experience matters." only raise red flags for me, especially when considered with your next point: "Billionaires reach an age when the only thing they value is putting their name on everything." This particular billionaire clearly has an enthusiastic engagement with the details of the project and a vision for solving the problems he's mentioned in the article, namely removing the need for freshmen to lodge with a stranger. A billionaire that just wanted to "put their name on everything" would pay the money, let the architect do their thing and never consider what it would be like to live in the results, right? This guy seems to be trying to fix the complaints from his eight(!) children, so future generations don't face the same. You might have a point buried in your post somewhere, but in your rush to slam this whole thing without backing it up, you've lost me.

chaosite 5y ago
I agree with you on the rebuttal, but disagree with you on your description of this specific building. This is supposedly the floor plan: https://static.dezeen.com/uploads/2021/11/munger-hall-university-of-california-santa-barbara-floor-plan_dezeen_2364_col_0-1704x1226.jpg https://static.dezeen.com/uploads/2021/11/munger-hall-univer... > each of these sleeping spaces with no windows is said to attach to a 'house' with a private common area and real windows. Nothing like the isolated skyscraper dorm you link to. Yeah, but not quite. First, these "sleeping spaces with no windows" are apartments, a cluster of 7 single-occupancy bedrooms, with a common area in the middle, with kitchenette, shared bathrooms, etc. It's a self-contained unit. And most of these units have no windows at all. 8 of these units form a "house", with a large common area and real windows, as you see. But it's a space shared by 56 people, and their guests. Calling it private is rather stretching that term.

the_optimist 5y ago

What is the ratio (and the correct measure of) students to stairs?

Majromax 5y ago
From the floor plan linked elsewhere in this thread, I count ten stairwells spaced around the perimeter of the building, which would imply a ratio of about 450 residents per stairwell.
- the_optimist 5y ago
  Is that an acceptable number? What’s the necessary throughput of a stairwell for an evacuation? I have certainly lived and worked in buildings where the number of people per stairwell was far higher.