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Well the difference between your daughters and my daughters is that they're reliant on a giant system and the good will of others and mine are reliant on themse

Well the difference between your daughters and my daughters is that they're reliant on a giant system and the good will of others and mine are reliant on themselves. When they walk home late at night they don't need to worry either, because they have guns.

PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
the giant system is more powerful and has been around much longer than the guns. and when you say "they're reliant", you make it sound as if somehow the citizens of berlin get offered the chance make a daily choice to be nice, when in reality, it's baked in at a much deeper level. there are hardly any crazy people in berlin (in the sense of wanting or needing to assault people). your daughters live in the middle of a giant system too, but instead of one that puts a priority on the kinds of things that berlin does, its a giant system that "requires" them to have guns. not only that, but they still have to worry: you don't get to pull out a gun in a dangerous situation without adding to the potential danger. btw, i live in new mexico now, and my daughters are both grown women who live in chicago and philadelphia, and still do not carry guns.
- betwixthewires 5y ago
  It doesn't require them to have guns. There are wild animals outside too, maybe we can make a system where that doesn't exist. Berlin sounds real nice. You never need to think about protecting yourself when things are going great. It may feel baked in at a deeper level, but don't forget, Berlin has at one time relatively recently been a very terrible place to live, especially for those that didn't have guns. The entire idea of having a gun is to make a dangerous situation more dangerous, it creates symmetry, an aggressor is now equal to his or her victim. New mexico is pretty nice too. Did you know that anyone who wants to can openly carry any gun they want in new mexico?
MisterBastahrd 5y ago
Your daughters ARE worrying. And the proof is that they have guns.
- betwixthewires 5y ago
  That's a ridiculously empty self supporting meaningless assertion, care to elaborate?
  - MisterBastahrd 5y ago
    Statistically, gun owners are far more likely to be injured by their own weapons than the weapons of others, and the sheer availability of firearms forces law enforcement officers to escalate situations far more quickly than they otherwise would. It follows that people who are walking around with guns live in fear of confrontation with other people who have guns. I have had five personal relationships with people who have died due to firearms. They are as follows: 1. My cousin, who killed himself while hunting ducks 2. My childhood friend, who killed himself while cleaning a rifle 3. My childhood friend, who was killed by cops after falling asleep at a railroad crossing and dropped his phone in the car when the police approached 4. My uncle, who committed suicide 5. Another childhood friend, who was drunk and disorderly and shot to death by cops while unarmed in the front yard of his house On the flip side, I don't personally know a single human being whose life was either saved or made better by possessing or being around someone who possessed a firearm.
    - betwixthewires 5y ago
      Statistically, you're an extreme outlier if you know 5 people who died of gunshot wounds. Of those 5 though, two were killed by cops. Can I draw from the fact that you included those that you don't want police to have firearms either? When you say "killed himself" for 1 and 2, do you mean deliberately? Again though, you're an extreme outlier. And even more so that you don't know personally a single individual who even once was saved by proximity to a firearm, such as for example saved from domestic violence by the arrival of armed police. I live around guns and people with guns, there are literally hundreds of guns around me within a quarter mile radius right now, I only have three gun deaths of anyone I have ever known, one was a suicide, one was an old lady who defended her orphanage from an armed intruder, and another was a man shot by his ex girlfriend while he attempted to assault her. The last two of course are examples of lives saved or made better by possessing a firearm. Then there are the other reasons to have them besides personal protection. Particularly there's the ethereal "deterrent to tyranny" you hear cited, but practically speaking there's also the ability to procure meat without a massive supply chain and the ability to defend against wildlife in areas where that is a tangible threat.

PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago

the giant system is more powerful and has been around much longer than the guns. and when you say "they're reliant", you make it sound as if somehow the citizens of berlin get offered the chance make a daily choice to be nice, when in reality, it's baked in at a much deeper level. there are hardly any crazy people in berlin (in the sense of wanting or needing to assault people). your daughters live in the middle of a giant system too, but instead of one that puts a priority on the kinds of things that berlin does, its a giant system that "requires" them to have guns. not only that, but they still have to worry: you don't get to pull out a gun in a dangerous situation without adding to the potential danger. btw, i live in new mexico now, and my daughters are both grown women who live in chicago and philadelphia, and still do not carry guns.

betwixthewires 5y ago
It doesn't require them to have guns. There are wild animals outside too, maybe we can make a system where that doesn't exist. Berlin sounds real nice. You never need to think about protecting yourself when things are going great. It may feel baked in at a deeper level, but don't forget, Berlin has at one time relatively recently been a very terrible place to live, especially for those that didn't have guns. The entire idea of having a gun is to make a dangerous situation more dangerous, it creates symmetry, an aggressor is now equal to his or her victim. New mexico is pretty nice too. Did you know that anyone who wants to can openly carry any gun they want in new mexico?

MisterBastahrd 5y ago

Your daughters ARE worrying. And the proof is that they have guns.

betwixthewires 5y ago
That's a ridiculously empty self supporting meaningless assertion, care to elaborate?
- MisterBastahrd 5y ago
  Statistically, gun owners are far more likely to be injured by their own weapons than the weapons of others, and the sheer availability of firearms forces law enforcement officers to escalate situations far more quickly than they otherwise would. It follows that people who are walking around with guns live in fear of confrontation with other people who have guns. I have had five personal relationships with people who have died due to firearms. They are as follows: 1. My cousin, who killed himself while hunting ducks 2. My childhood friend, who killed himself while cleaning a rifle 3. My childhood friend, who was killed by cops after falling asleep at a railroad crossing and dropped his phone in the car when the police approached 4. My uncle, who committed suicide 5. Another childhood friend, who was drunk and disorderly and shot to death by cops while unarmed in the front yard of his house On the flip side, I don't personally know a single human being whose life was either saved or made better by possessing or being around someone who possessed a firearm.
  - betwixthewires 5y ago
    Statistically, you're an extreme outlier if you know 5 people who died of gunshot wounds. Of those 5 though, two were killed by cops. Can I draw from the fact that you included those that you don't want police to have firearms either? When you say "killed himself" for 1 and 2, do you mean deliberately? Again though, you're an extreme outlier. And even more so that you don't know personally a single individual who even once was saved by proximity to a firearm, such as for example saved from domestic violence by the arrival of armed police. I live around guns and people with guns, there are literally hundreds of guns around me within a quarter mile radius right now, I only have three gun deaths of anyone I have ever known, one was a suicide, one was an old lady who defended her orphanage from an armed intruder, and another was a man shot by his ex girlfriend while he attempted to assault her. The last two of course are examples of lives saved or made better by possessing a firearm. Then there are the other reasons to have them besides personal protection. Particularly there's the ethereal "deterrent to tyranny" you hear cited, but practically speaking there's also the ability to procure meat without a massive supply chain and the ability to defend against wildlife in areas where that is a tangible threat.