4 ms·

From one white man to another white man: you're not being attacked, democrats aren't anti-white (have you looked at the leadership? very white indeed!), and you

From one white man to another white man: you're not being attacked, democrats aren't anti-white (have you looked at the leadership? very white indeed!), and you are still living in the system that our white ancestors made for us. Other people not being oppressed as much doesn't mean your liberties are at risk. It's OK to teach and learn about how racist people made racist systems. You don't need to feel guilty, unless you are out here actively supporting racist systems? If you're trying to use the social privileges that come with being a white man in America to dismantle racist structures, then you're doing great! If you're tried and don't want to do that work, ok, understandable: just don't throw in your two cents I'd you see other people doing this intense labor.

remarkEon 5y ago
>It's OK to teach and learn about how racist people made racist systems. Read: your ancestors are racist, and made a racist system for you >You don't need to feel guilty, unless you are out here actively supporting racist systems? Read: here comes the guilt trip >If you're trying to use the social privileges that come with being a white man in America to dismantle racist structures, then you're doing great! If you're tried and don't want to do that work, ok, understandable: just don't throw in your two cents I'd you see other people doing this intense labor. Read: there it is. At some point I figured people would realize this Kafkaesque formulation really turns people off. Any disagreement with the premise - any at all - and you are now required to retreat to claiming you're not a "racist" in front of someone who has set the rhetorical boundaries where such a claim is rejected outright, always. I actually think that's really the point, and it's nothing more than a new and pathological way to bully someone.
omegaworks 5y ago
This race has proven that it doesn't actually matter whether or not white people are being attacked (they're not) or whether CRT is even being taught in schools (it's not). Republicans effectively created a media moral panic around "Critical Race Theory" and it paid off for them in spades.
- nverno 5y ago
  It doesnt help that democrats paint anyone who finds this stuff obnoxious as republicans- they are alienating the largest constituent in America- independents.
  - PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
    There is a school of thought that says that there almost no "Independents" in the USA at all, only people unwilling to use "Democratic" or "Republican" as a label, and that the overwhelming majority of them fall into the "almost-never-trump Republican" category.
    - nverno 5y ago
      Lemme guess- that 'school of thought' originates in one of the two major parties. Statistically, independents are the largest demographic by registration, so any further insight is based on various polls I'd assume? Basically everyone close to me is independent (mostly in the 'leans' democrat category), generally despises both parties, and I know many people who have voted for candidates from different parties in back to back elections.
  - omegaworks 5y ago
    First off, not a democrat. Secondly, Republicans concretely instrumented and benefited from the CRT media moral panic. Not "painting" anyone, simply stating facts. https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conse...
    - nverno 5y ago
      My comment was about democrats on the whole (and republicans) making it an us vs. them thing, not you personally.
    - rsj_hn 5y ago
      It wasn't Republicans who thought it a good idea to constantly tell white schoolboys that they are "oppressors". If a political party can't take such virulent institutionalized hate and make political hay out of it, then it's not a political party worth keeping.
twofornone 5y ago
Look, first off, I'm not a white man. Second, I wasn't trying to debate whether this is right or wrong, only explaining why parents are voting out democrats. However I do take offense to your implication that teaching white children concepts like white privilege in a way that instills white guilt, and molding them to accept unilaterally determined reverse discrimination, does not constitute oppression. It's quite possible to teach about racism and discrimination and slavery without burdening white children with what amounts to a rehashed original sin, obligating them to accept reverse racism as though it is the only way to correct historic wrongs which they had no part in. >You don't need to feel guilty, unless you are out here actively supporting racist system This is dishonest, because it is a refrain used to guilt people into supporting progressive policies by implication that they are racist if they don't, completely sidestepping the argument over whether such policies are sound. >If you're trying to use the social privileges that come with being a white man in America to dismantle racist structures, then you're doing great! This is also dishonest, because it sidesteps the question of whether or not white men are actually privileged to such an extent that artificially correcting for said privilege (i.e. creating institutional racism) is justified. It also ignores the question of whether our institutions are actually racist - to a modern progressive this is a given, but the science is ultimately based on correlation and conjecture. The strongest proof that pundits have of institutional racism is inequality of outcome; however in a perfect meritocracy it is irrational to conflate equality of opportunity with equality of outcome. See Nordic countries for an example. To summarize, my primary points are twofold: the way that antiracism is being taught to white children is potentially harmful, and the degree to which our systems are actually unequal because of racism on behalf of whites is not nearly as certain as militant activists seem to believe. Before you downvote, recognize that I am communicating the perspective held by voters that are dramatically underrepresented online. And to an increasing degree they are not white, minorities do not appreciate the implication that they will forever be saddled with the burden of past oppression unless the white man steps in and helps them. Incidentally, I have do have a personal stake the this matter, because the same points used to justify reverse discrimination against whites can trivially be aimed at Jews, given their drastic overrepresentation among positions of power and wealth. I personally don't think people realize how dangerous it is to teach such racial awareness to children, especially in such a discriminatory manner.

remarkEon 5y ago

>It's OK to teach and learn about how racist people made racist systems. Read: your ancestors are racist, and made a racist system for you >You don't need to feel guilty, unless you are out here actively supporting racist systems? Read: here comes the guilt trip >If you're trying to use the social privileges that come with being a white man in America to dismantle racist structures, then you're doing great! If you're tried and don't want to do that work, ok, understandable: just don't throw in your two cents I'd you see other people doing this intense labor. Read: there it is. At some point I figured people would realize this Kafkaesque formulation really turns people off. Any disagreement with the premise - any at all - and you are now required to retreat to claiming you're not a "racist" in front of someone who has set the rhetorical boundaries where such a claim is rejected outright, always. I actually think that's really the point, and it's nothing more than a new and pathological way to bully someone.

omegaworks 5y ago

This race has proven that it doesn't actually matter whether or not white people are being attacked (they're not) or whether CRT is even being taught in schools (it's not). Republicans effectively created a media moral panic around "Critical Race Theory" and it paid off for them in spades.

nverno 5y ago
It doesnt help that democrats paint anyone who finds this stuff obnoxious as republicans- they are alienating the largest constituent in America- independents.
- PaulDavisThe1st 5y ago
  There is a school of thought that says that there almost no "Independents" in the USA at all, only people unwilling to use "Democratic" or "Republican" as a label, and that the overwhelming majority of them fall into the "almost-never-trump Republican" category.
  - nverno 5y ago
    Lemme guess- that 'school of thought' originates in one of the two major parties. Statistically, independents are the largest demographic by registration, so any further insight is based on various polls I'd assume? Basically everyone close to me is independent (mostly in the 'leans' democrat category), generally despises both parties, and I know many people who have voted for candidates from different parties in back to back elections.
- omegaworks 5y ago
  First off, not a democrat. Secondly, Republicans concretely instrumented and benefited from the CRT media moral panic. Not "painting" anyone, simply stating facts. https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conservative-activist-invented-the-conflict-over-critical-race-theory https://www.newyorker.com/news/annals-of-inquiry/how-a-conse...
  - nverno 5y ago
    My comment was about democrats on the whole (and republicans) making it an us vs. them thing, not you personally.
  - rsj_hn 5y ago
    It wasn't Republicans who thought it a good idea to constantly tell white schoolboys that they are "oppressors". If a political party can't take such virulent institutionalized hate and make political hay out of it, then it's not a political party worth keeping.

twofornone 5y ago

Look, first off, I'm not a white man. Second, I wasn't trying to debate whether this is right or wrong, only explaining why parents are voting out democrats. However I do take offense to your implication that teaching white children concepts like white privilege in a way that instills white guilt, and molding them to accept unilaterally determined reverse discrimination, does not constitute oppression. It's quite possible to teach about racism and discrimination and slavery without burdening white children with what amounts to a rehashed original sin, obligating them to accept reverse racism as though it is the only way to correct historic wrongs which they had no part in. >You don't need to feel guilty, unless you are out here actively supporting racist system This is dishonest, because it is a refrain used to guilt people into supporting progressive policies by implication that they are racist if they don't, completely sidestepping the argument over whether such policies are sound. >If you're trying to use the social privileges that come with being a white man in America to dismantle racist structures, then you're doing great! This is also dishonest, because it sidesteps the question of whether or not white men are actually privileged to such an extent that artificially correcting for said privilege (i.e. creating institutional racism) is justified. It also ignores the question of whether our institutions are actually racist - to a modern progressive this is a given, but the science is ultimately based on correlation and conjecture. The strongest proof that pundits have of institutional racism is inequality of outcome; however in a perfect meritocracy it is irrational to conflate equality of opportunity with equality of outcome. See Nordic countries for an example. To summarize, my primary points are twofold: the way that antiracism is being taught to white children is potentially harmful, and the degree to which our systems are actually unequal because of racism on behalf of whites is not nearly as certain as militant activists seem to believe. Before you downvote, recognize that I am communicating the perspective held by voters that are dramatically underrepresented online. And to an increasing degree they are not white, minorities do not appreciate the implication that they will forever be saddled with the burden of past oppression unless the white man steps in and helps them. Incidentally, I have do have a personal stake the this matter, because the same points used to justify reverse discrimination against whites can trivially be aimed at Jews, given their drastic overrepresentation among positions of power and wealth. I personally don't think people realize how dangerous it is to teach such racial awareness to children, especially in such a discriminatory manner.