4 ms·

There's a dead comment from a throwaway that I mostly disagree with. Except for this last line: >This seems like the government outsourcing controversial activ

There's a dead comment from a throwaway that I mostly disagree with. Except for this last line: >This seems like the government outsourcing controversial activities to Israel. It certainly feels that way to me, as well. The US is in a sticky situation. This just feels like a standard burn. You're caught, now you're out. NSO made too much noise and got cut loose. Obviously the NSA and others are going to continue this kind of work.

colinmhayes 5y ago
It makes perfect sense for the US to outsource controversial work to the Israeli military industrial complex, just like it makes perfect sense for fortune 500 corporations to outsource controversial work to mckinsey. Plausible deniability for the party that cares about their image, money for the party that has embraced the destruction of theirs. I guess the US could use domestic contractors instead, but then they'd have to admit the contractors were sanctioned when they don't bring criminal charges. I'd be much more worried if US government was found to be hacking/assassinating Saudi dissidents, because that would mean the leaders of the US government are completely incompetent. That's not to say it's not happening, just that it would be idiotic for the government to do that themselves when they can use foreign contractors instead.
sol_invictus 5y ago
Yep. Also see: Wuhan lab, and the US ties to it.
slg 5y ago
Here is the formerly dead comment[1]. I just vouched for it so it is no longer dead. I'm not sure why you would agree with the quoted portion and disagree with the rest. The rest is documented historical fact.[2] [1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29095907 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29095907 [2] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion
- COGlory 5y ago
  'Jews as moneylenders' has a strong religious context I don't see in this story. That's all. Thanks for vouching for the comment.
  - slg 5y ago
    Jews as moneylenders is a stereotype that originates from history due to both religious and political motivations such as those previously mentioned. I can understand being uneasy with that in a modern context. I have also criticized people on HN before for equating all Jews with Israel or vice versa, but I don't see that happening here. The analogy works if the modern equivalent is any other country because the primary link is the outsourcing of a controversial job and not Jewishness.
LogonType10 5y ago
Do you think US intelligence agencies were hindered whatsoever by their bad reputation?
- COGlory 5y ago
  Absolutely. Look at the Patriot Act. It took a national crisis to justify that for them.
  - LogonType10 5y ago
    What did they do after the patriot act that they weren't doing before it?
rougka 5y ago
NSO is a private company which is unrelated to the US intelligence relations with Israel, there’s no outsourcing here and it actually makes more sense NSO causes major headaches to the US (see murder of Khashoggi) than otherwise
deleted 5y ago
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colinmhayes 5y ago

It makes perfect sense for the US to outsource controversial work to the Israeli military industrial complex, just like it makes perfect sense for fortune 500 corporations to outsource controversial work to mckinsey. Plausible deniability for the party that cares about their image, money for the party that has embraced the destruction of theirs. I guess the US could use domestic contractors instead, but then they'd have to admit the contractors were sanctioned when they don't bring criminal charges. I'd be much more worried if US government was found to be hacking/assassinating Saudi dissidents, because that would mean the leaders of the US government are completely incompetent. That's not to say it's not happening, just that it would be idiotic for the government to do that themselves when they can use foreign contractors instead.

sol_invictus 5y ago

Yep. Also see: Wuhan lab, and the US ties to it.

slg 5y ago

Here is the formerly dead comment[1]. I just vouched for it so it is no longer dead. I'm not sure why you would agree with the quoted portion and disagree with the rest. The rest is documented historical fact.[2] [1] - https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29095907 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29095907 [2] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edict_of_Expulsion

COGlory 5y ago
'Jews as moneylenders' has a strong religious context I don't see in this story. That's all. Thanks for vouching for the comment.
- slg 5y ago
  Jews as moneylenders is a stereotype that originates from history due to both religious and political motivations such as those previously mentioned. I can understand being uneasy with that in a modern context. I have also criticized people on HN before for equating all Jews with Israel or vice versa, but I don't see that happening here. The analogy works if the modern equivalent is any other country because the primary link is the outsourcing of a controversial job and not Jewishness.

LogonType10 5y ago

Do you think US intelligence agencies were hindered whatsoever by their bad reputation?

COGlory 5y ago
Absolutely. Look at the Patriot Act. It took a national crisis to justify that for them.
- LogonType10 5y ago
  What did they do after the patriot act that they weren't doing before it?

rougka 5y ago

NSO is a private company which is unrelated to the US intelligence relations with Israel, there’s no outsourcing here and it actually makes more sense NSO causes major headaches to the US (see murder of Khashoggi) than otherwise

deleted 5y ago

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