9 ms·

The boring technology behind a one-person Internet company (2018)

214 points by firefly284 5y ago

nso95 5y ago
Seems like a pretty typical stack
WalterGR 5y ago
(2018)
1cvmask 5y ago
I found this post on their "pivot" story to be more interesting: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29032799 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29032799
tapan_jk 5y ago
> Most of my time is spent on talking to other human beings, replying emails (30%~40% of my time), and thinking (!!!), which is not considered as “real work” by engineers :) Oh, burn! /s
- throwawayswede 5y ago
  I don't think it's not considered real work by engineers, but by non-engineer product managers.
  - deleted 5y ago
    [deleted]
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
ulimn 5y ago
Is this the same post? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20985875 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20985875
- neogodless 5y ago
  Yes - while a slightly different URL, it forwards to the same URL. That submission from Sept 16, 2019 has 451 comments!
cudgy 5y ago
Interesting post to see how this solution is accomplished, but how is this a one-person company, if there are contractors? How are the contractors utilized and how much do they cost on average? Are the contractors needed or could this be done by a single engineer?
- npsimons 5y ago
  Would you consider someone delegating tasks to a personal assistant on a billable hours basis a multi-person company? How about paying a freelancer once for the initial design of the website? Both these tactics are discussed in "Start Small, Stay Small" a book aimed at single developer software product "startups." It's pretty clear that if you want to shorten time to market, you leverage existing assets - when it's people using React or FLOSS databases, no one bats an eye, but farming out tasks here and there that aren't worth your burn rate (pay someone cheaper who can do it faster), how is that different? When the government hires contractors they're not considered part of the government workforce (ie, civil servants).
  - cudgy 5y ago
    A single engineer owner with multiple contractors is different from multiple employees under a single engineer owner in what way? It is dishonest to claim that one is “one-person” while another is not when they are organizationally the same. Reminds me of people that call themselves “retired early” when they are effectively entrepreneurs with their own businesses and side hustles. Kudos to the original poster though for making a business that they own by themselves I assume. However, taking all the credit for themselves despite using contractors to build their company is disingenuous.
    - npsimons 5y ago
      "Hey, look at this guy over here, claiming to be a 'one-person company', when he pays for a VPS instead of constructing a server from hardware, then self-hosting it himself. Pfft, I'll bet he doesn't even personally service the AC that is used to cool the building the server is in either! Probably pays an ISP too, instead of creating his own Internet from scratch."
throwaway158497 5y ago
listennotes has become my go to site when I want to find podcast for my daily commute (about 30min). Its got good UI/UX. Pretty well executed for a one man company. I wonder though if the niche search engine market can fetch them enough money to be profitable.
- RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago
  Regarding the profitability, the founder discusses in other posts, that they get the bulk of their revenue from their API (they also have some cash flow coming from ads). I think he was for a while bootstrapping, and then got some VC funding. Still he pays for a not that cheap office at a WeWork location in SF and from the API service numbers I saw, if they are legit, he should have more than enough ARR to live well from his site (and that's exactly the impression one gets from reading his blog posts). Nonetheless, he is totally against posting openly about the financials of his business, and showing actual data.
  - throwaway158497 5y ago
    Thanks. That is indeed good news.
beamatronic 5y ago
One of the links in the article, www.celeryproject.org, doesn't seem to work at this time
- rootusrootus 5y ago
  That's interesting they don't seem to be running a functioning main web page, but their docs do work. https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/ https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/
- edmundsauto 5y ago
  You can check out their docs here, not sure if they maintain their homepage. https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/ https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]
yabones 5y ago
Obviously, things have changed quite a bit in the three years since this was written. I'm curious what we now consider boring that was "exciting" then. First thing that comes to mind are the managed kubernetes services that weren't really "mature" back then. Are those boring? Some would say yes, I personally would say "not yet".
- moooo99 5y ago
  I wouldn't consider managed kubernetes services as boring. But I think nowadays more people accept that Kubernetes is an overpowered solution for most projects, especially side projects.
sdevonoes 5y ago
I was expecting: PHP + MySQL + a bunch of shell scripts to install stuff on servers + reading logs via command line by ssh as root. Instead I found: Redis, Rabbitmq, DataDog, ES, React + Redux, Ansible, PagerDuty... I wouldn't call that "boring technology". Sure, you are not using Docker nor K8s... but still.
- posharma 5y ago
  exactly what i thought.
- grouseway 5y ago
  I'm currently reading logs via command line by ssh as you describe for a simple service and not satisfied with this. What would be a step up without a lot of extra infrastructure?
  - dfinninger 5y ago
    I’ve personally used Graylog[1] with success in the past. However, I’ve had an excellent time with Grafana and have been following their Loki[2] project. My company uses other solutions, so I haven’t needed it, but the Grafana stack might suit your use case. [1] https://www.graylog.org/products/open-source https://www.graylog.org/products/open-source [2] https://grafana.com/docs/loki/latest/ https://grafana.com/docs/loki/latest/
    - Sammi 5y ago
      The question was: "What would be a step up [from ssh] without a lot of extra infrastructure?" I think you just way overshot it. My attempt at a simple step up would be mounting the logs with sshfs and using your favorite editor.
  - turtlebits 5y ago
    New Relic has a free tier, just install their agent (or another compatible logging agent).
  - cbzbc 5y ago
RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago
The founder has some really informative and very detailed articles, e.g. this one about being rejected after his YC interview. https://www.listennotes.com/blog/my-y-combinator-interview-experience-w18-22/ https://www.listennotes.com/blog/my-y-combinator-interview-e... It's interesting to read why he thinks he got rejected.
- Mikeb85 5y ago
  Great article, but I think he's far too hard on himself and reading too deep into his rejection (plenty of immigrants, non-native English speakers and people in their 30's from non-Ivy League schools succeed at building businesses). He's built a bootstrapped site that is probably going to be able to sustain himself for years. But small businesses and big businesses are fundamentally different. I come from the restaurant space, and all my favourite restaurants are 'small' and likely can't exist in any place other than where they are. They can't scale. But they're much better qualitatively than restaurants that can scale. Some of the other products and things in my life that I enjoy also come from small artisans and could never scale. And that's OK. He didn't build a massively scalable business but he did build a (seemingly) good one.
  - HWR_14 5y ago
    I think his earlier expectation that without a greencard he was summarily rejected might be true. It's a lot of risk to assume of "the founder/entire team might be deported". Other than that, I think you are correct he was reading too much into his demographics/education.
  - RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago
    Idk if he is even hard on himself. He actually sounds like someone happy with how the site ended up evolving. And maybe even looking back in hindsight to the YC experience, he realized that they might have not been a good fit anyways. I mean, he says it quite bluntly, VCs are in the business to do money, they don't finance you as a charitable exercise or because they like tech for the sake of tech. He found a nice ARR through the API service, and if that sustains him well, and as he says, does not cause him much stress nor makes him work long hours, it's probably an even better outcome that being pressured by the VC to fulfill some exorbitant growth. To me it sounds really cool to be a one-man band, and his posts describing the tech stack are really delightful to read (he's definitely someone who knows what he is doing, I guess that comes with being 'old' and having previous 'not-serial-entrepeneur' tech experience as a developer.

214 points by firefly284 5y ago

nso95 5y ago

Seems like a pretty typical stack

WalterGR 5y ago

(2018)

1cvmask 5y ago

I found this post on their "pivot" story to be more interesting: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29032799 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29032799

tapan_jk 5y ago

> Most of my time is spent on talking to other human beings, replying emails (30%~40% of my time), and thinking (!!!), which is not considered as “real work” by engineers :) Oh, burn! /s

throwawayswede 5y ago
I don't think it's not considered real work by engineers, but by non-engineer product managers.
- deleted 5y ago
  [deleted]
deleted 5y ago
[deleted]

ulimn 5y ago

Is this the same post? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20985875 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20985875

neogodless 5y ago
Yes - while a slightly different URL, it forwards to the same URL. That submission from Sept 16, 2019 has 451 comments!

cudgy 5y ago

Interesting post to see how this solution is accomplished, but how is this a one-person company, if there are contractors? How are the contractors utilized and how much do they cost on average? Are the contractors needed or could this be done by a single engineer?

npsimons 5y ago
Would you consider someone delegating tasks to a personal assistant on a billable hours basis a multi-person company? How about paying a freelancer once for the initial design of the website? Both these tactics are discussed in "Start Small, Stay Small" a book aimed at single developer software product "startups." It's pretty clear that if you want to shorten time to market, you leverage existing assets - when it's people using React or FLOSS databases, no one bats an eye, but farming out tasks here and there that aren't worth your burn rate (pay someone cheaper who can do it faster), how is that different? When the government hires contractors they're not considered part of the government workforce (ie, civil servants).
- cudgy 5y ago
  A single engineer owner with multiple contractors is different from multiple employees under a single engineer owner in what way? It is dishonest to claim that one is “one-person” while another is not when they are organizationally the same. Reminds me of people that call themselves “retired early” when they are effectively entrepreneurs with their own businesses and side hustles. Kudos to the original poster though for making a business that they own by themselves I assume. However, taking all the credit for themselves despite using contractors to build their company is disingenuous.
  - npsimons 5y ago
    "Hey, look at this guy over here, claiming to be a 'one-person company', when he pays for a VPS instead of constructing a server from hardware, then self-hosting it himself. Pfft, I'll bet he doesn't even personally service the AC that is used to cool the building the server is in either! Probably pays an ISP too, instead of creating his own Internet from scratch."

throwaway158497 5y ago

listennotes has become my go to site when I want to find podcast for my daily commute (about 30min). Its got good UI/UX. Pretty well executed for a one man company. I wonder though if the niche search engine market can fetch them enough money to be profitable.

RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago
Regarding the profitability, the founder discusses in other posts, that they get the bulk of their revenue from their API (they also have some cash flow coming from ads). I think he was for a while bootstrapping, and then got some VC funding. Still he pays for a not that cheap office at a WeWork location in SF and from the API service numbers I saw, if they are legit, he should have more than enough ARR to live well from his site (and that's exactly the impression one gets from reading his blog posts). Nonetheless, he is totally against posting openly about the financials of his business, and showing actual data.
- throwaway158497 5y ago
  Thanks. That is indeed good news.

beamatronic 5y ago

One of the links in the article, www.celeryproject.org, doesn't seem to work at this time

rootusrootus 5y ago
That's interesting they don't seem to be running a functioning main web page, but their docs do work. https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/ https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/
edmundsauto 5y ago
You can check out their docs here, not sure if they maintain their homepage. https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/ https://docs.celeryproject.org/en/stable/

deleted 5y ago

[deleted]

yabones 5y ago

Obviously, things have changed quite a bit in the three years since this was written. I'm curious what we now consider boring that was "exciting" then. First thing that comes to mind are the managed kubernetes services that weren't really "mature" back then. Are those boring? Some would say yes, I personally would say "not yet".

moooo99 5y ago
I wouldn't consider managed kubernetes services as boring. But I think nowadays more people accept that Kubernetes is an overpowered solution for most projects, especially side projects.

sdevonoes 5y ago

I was expecting: PHP + MySQL + a bunch of shell scripts to install stuff on servers + reading logs via command line by ssh as root. Instead I found: Redis, Rabbitmq, DataDog, ES, React + Redux, Ansible, PagerDuty... I wouldn't call that "boring technology". Sure, you are not using Docker nor K8s... but still.

posharma 5y ago
exactly what i thought.
grouseway 5y ago
I'm currently reading logs via command line by ssh as you describe for a simple service and not satisfied with this. What would be a step up without a lot of extra infrastructure?
- dfinninger 5y ago
  I’ve personally used Graylog[1] with success in the past. However, I’ve had an excellent time with Grafana and have been following their Loki[2] project. My company uses other solutions, so I haven’t needed it, but the Grafana stack might suit your use case. [1] https://www.graylog.org/products/open-source https://www.graylog.org/products/open-source [2] https://grafana.com/docs/loki/latest/ https://grafana.com/docs/loki/latest/
  - Sammi 5y ago
    The question was: "What would be a step up [from ssh] without a lot of extra infrastructure?" I think you just way overshot it. My attempt at a simple step up would be mounting the logs with sshfs and using your favorite editor.
- turtlebits 5y ago
  New Relic has a free tier, just install their agent (or another compatible logging agent).
- cbzbc 5y ago

RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago

The founder has some really informative and very detailed articles, e.g. this one about being rejected after his YC interview. https://www.listennotes.com/blog/my-y-combinator-interview-experience-w18-22/ https://www.listennotes.com/blog/my-y-combinator-interview-e... It's interesting to read why he thinks he got rejected.

Mikeb85 5y ago
Great article, but I think he's far too hard on himself and reading too deep into his rejection (plenty of immigrants, non-native English speakers and people in their 30's from non-Ivy League schools succeed at building businesses). He's built a bootstrapped site that is probably going to be able to sustain himself for years. But small businesses and big businesses are fundamentally different. I come from the restaurant space, and all my favourite restaurants are 'small' and likely can't exist in any place other than where they are. They can't scale. But they're much better qualitatively than restaurants that can scale. Some of the other products and things in my life that I enjoy also come from small artisans and could never scale. And that's OK. He didn't build a massively scalable business but he did build a (seemingly) good one.
- HWR_14 5y ago
  I think his earlier expectation that without a greencard he was summarily rejected might be true. It's a lot of risk to assume of "the founder/entire team might be deported". Other than that, I think you are correct he was reading too much into his demographics/education.
- RapperWhoMadeIt 5y ago
  Idk if he is even hard on himself. He actually sounds like someone happy with how the site ended up evolving. And maybe even looking back in hindsight to the YC experience, he realized that they might have not been a good fit anyways. I mean, he says it quite bluntly, VCs are in the business to do money, they don't finance you as a charitable exercise or because they like tech for the sake of tech. He found a nice ARR through the API service, and if that sustains him well, and as he says, does not cause him much stress nor makes him work long hours, it's probably an even better outcome that being pressured by the VC to fulfill some exorbitant growth. To me it sounds really cool to be a one-man band, and his posts describing the tech stack are really delightful to read (he's definitely someone who knows what he is doing, I guess that comes with being 'old' and having previous 'not-serial-entrepeneur' tech experience as a developer.