4 ms·

But a good time to revisit FOSTA/SESTA to see if those laws are worth it

floatingatoll 5y ago
And then to post a relevant link about it.
heavyset_go 5y ago
Agreed. I've noticed an uptick of what appears to be sex workers on dating apps. Surely some of them were trafficked, just like some were on Craiglist. I'm not sure why Craiglist personals weren't okay, but the same exact thing on Tinder or Bumble is.
- jdavis703 5y ago
  Banning all dating services would have immediate public backlash. SESTA/FOSTA really only caused a stir among people who care about sex work or tech freedom/privacy. There was very little mainstream media coverage of it, and the little there was took a heavy slant to the anti-sex trafficking angle.
  - vmception 5y ago
    Looks like there is a constitutional challenge in progress, 9th circuit too so could go any direction after district court
- _jal 5y ago
  Craigslist felt at risk of being targeted the same way Backpage was. Not wishing to go to jail, they chose to remove anything that could possibly be used against them.
  - dragonwriter 5y ago
    > Craigslist felt at risk of being targeted the same way Backpage was. Craigslist had already been targeted multiple times by law enforcement, and had revised the structure and policies of their personals sections multiple times to try to stop that. SESTA/FOSTA was when they gave up trying to find a way to make it work, but it wasn't just the Backpage example.
- cowmoo728 5y ago
  Take a look at the #fmty (fly me to you) hashtag on twitter someday. Twitter has become an open market for adult services.
- vmception 5y ago
  Its all about the liability they are willing to assume. Dont confuse that with the law itself. Its the same about wondering why one person gets culturally “cancelled” and another doesn't for the same action: The people beside them have a large enough rainy day fund and don't mind the risk. It says nothing about what the culture actually believes either way, only the risk tolerance of the wealthy backers. Huh, reminds me of the princeton study that said the same thing about progressive laws that get passed, where the culture has no effect on anything except that sometimes it coincidentally matches what wealthy special interests were already doing, with the caveat that its more of a direct democracy for the wealthy special interests but an additional level of representative democracy for everyone else.
_jal 5y ago
It is. Techdirt has been excellent at tracking this stuff, as they do: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20210728/13245147264/enough-about-fostas-unintended-consequences-they-were-always-intended.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20210728/13245147264/enoug... The short version: it is pretty obvious that it did what the people pushing it wanted it to do, but it did not do what they said it would do. They continue to lie about it in multiple ways. The same actors are currently targeting payment processors in their continued attempts to conflate and ban prostitution, trafficking, pornography, nudity and frequently sex education wherever they can. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20211008/17285147720/prudish-mastercard-about-to-make-life-difficult-tons-websites.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20211008/17285147720/prudi...
tyingq 5y ago
If it's lucrative, the listings don't go away. They just end up on sites that are out of reach of FOSTA/SESTA.

And then to post a relevant link about it.

Agreed. I've noticed an uptick of what appears to be sex workers on dating apps. Surely some of them were trafficked, just like some were on Craiglist. I'm not sure why Craiglist personals weren't okay, but the same exact thing on Tinder or Bumble is.

jdavis703 5y ago
Banning all dating services would have immediate public backlash. SESTA/FOSTA really only caused a stir among people who care about sex work or tech freedom/privacy. There was very little mainstream media coverage of it, and the little there was took a heavy slant to the anti-sex trafficking angle.
- vmception 5y ago
  Looks like there is a constitutional challenge in progress, 9th circuit too so could go any direction after district court
_jal 5y ago
Craigslist felt at risk of being targeted the same way Backpage was. Not wishing to go to jail, they chose to remove anything that could possibly be used against them.
- dragonwriter 5y ago
  > Craigslist felt at risk of being targeted the same way Backpage was. Craigslist had already been targeted multiple times by law enforcement, and had revised the structure and policies of their personals sections multiple times to try to stop that. SESTA/FOSTA was when they gave up trying to find a way to make it work, but it wasn't just the Backpage example.
cowmoo728 5y ago
Take a look at the #fmty (fly me to you) hashtag on twitter someday. Twitter has become an open market for adult services.
vmception 5y ago
Its all about the liability they are willing to assume. Dont confuse that with the law itself. Its the same about wondering why one person gets culturally “cancelled” and another doesn't for the same action: The people beside them have a large enough rainy day fund and don't mind the risk. It says nothing about what the culture actually believes either way, only the risk tolerance of the wealthy backers. Huh, reminds me of the princeton study that said the same thing about progressive laws that get passed, where the culture has no effect on anything except that sometimes it coincidentally matches what wealthy special interests were already doing, with the caveat that its more of a direct democracy for the wealthy special interests but an additional level of representative democracy for everyone else.

_jal 5y ago

It is. Techdirt has been excellent at tracking this stuff, as they do: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20210728/13245147264/enough-about-fostas-unintended-consequences-they-were-always-intended.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20210728/13245147264/enoug... The short version: it is pretty obvious that it did what the people pushing it wanted it to do, but it did not do what they said it would do. They continue to lie about it in multiple ways. The same actors are currently targeting payment processors in their continued attempts to conflate and ban prostitution, trafficking, pornography, nudity and frequently sex education wherever they can. https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20211008/17285147720/prudish-mastercard-about-to-make-life-difficult-tons-websites.shtml https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20211008/17285147720/prudi...

tyingq 5y ago

If it's lucrative, the listings don't go away. They just end up on sites that are out of reach of FOSTA/SESTA.