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Democracy is when the people in general have power. Not when they are allowed (perhaps, begrudgingly) to demonstrate with placards outside of the buildings tha

Democracy is when the people in general have power. Not when they are allowed (perhaps, begrudgingly) to demonstrate with placards outside of the buildings that house/employ people with power. Cite any reputable social science that says that democracy is an actual thing implemented in liberal democracies. Then we can take it from there. > actually, funding lobbying efforts. Billionaires and multi-millionaires will outspend your gofundme lobbying. It’s simple economics.

sputr 5y ago
No, that's not what democracy is. That's what you want it to be. And no, the rich can't outspend the population, if the population realized what's happening. Not only is 10USD/EUR per month times the entire population just an incredible amount of money ... it's way more effective. Most damage from lobby happens because corporate lobbyist are the only ones there. Just one publicly funded lobbyist there to remind the decisions makers of what is right and prevent their ability to rationalize would make an incredible difference. But you need to pay that person.
- avgcorrection 5y ago
  > No, that's not what democracy is. That's what you want it to be. I don’t even know what that means. Seems that you have no answers. > Not only is 10USD/EUR per month times the entire population just an incredible amount of money ... it's way more effective. That’s about 3B USD a month for the entire US population. Not a small amount but the political system is absolutely flush with money. Plus you need to organize hundreds of millions of people and convince them to spend it towards one cause/pool. Which is orders of magnitude (as we like to say) harder than the billionaire class loosely organizing togheter. (Not to mention that you have to keep out grifters etc...) Not to mention many people can’t afford those kinds of “just two starbucks a month” recurring expenses that HN readers scoff at. > Most damage from lobby happens because corporate lobbyist are the only ones there. Just one publicly funded lobbyist there to remind the decisions makers of what is right and prevent their ability to rationalize would make an incredible difference. The keywords “right” and “rationalize” tells me that you are idealizing. The decision-makers don’t care about what’s right; they care about money and power. And if they do start to care about what is “right” then they will be replaced with someone else. The decision makers need money to stay in power. In turn they turn to the biggest pockets. Predictable outcomes.

sputr 5y ago

No, that's not what democracy is. That's what you want it to be. And no, the rich can't outspend the population, if the population realized what's happening. Not only is 10USD/EUR per month times the entire population just an incredible amount of money ... it's way more effective. Most damage from lobby happens because corporate lobbyist are the only ones there. Just one publicly funded lobbyist there to remind the decisions makers of what is right and prevent their ability to rationalize would make an incredible difference. But you need to pay that person.

avgcorrection 5y ago
> No, that's not what democracy is. That's what you want it to be. I don’t even know what that means. Seems that you have no answers. > Not only is 10USD/EUR per month times the entire population just an incredible amount of money ... it's way more effective. That’s about 3B USD a month for the entire US population. Not a small amount but the political system is absolutely flush with money. Plus you need to organize hundreds of millions of people and convince them to spend it towards one cause/pool. Which is orders of magnitude (as we like to say) harder than the billionaire class loosely organizing togheter. (Not to mention that you have to keep out grifters etc...) Not to mention many people can’t afford those kinds of “just two starbucks a month” recurring expenses that HN readers scoff at. > Most damage from lobby happens because corporate lobbyist are the only ones there. Just one publicly funded lobbyist there to remind the decisions makers of what is right and prevent their ability to rationalize would make an incredible difference. The keywords “right” and “rationalize” tells me that you are idealizing. The decision-makers don’t care about what’s right; they care about money and power. And if they do start to care about what is “right” then they will be replaced with someone else. The decision makers need money to stay in power. In turn they turn to the biggest pockets. Predictable outcomes.