4 ms·

I forget where I saw it but I remember someone on the right criticizing those on the left by saying "I will start treating climate change like an emergency when

by Veelox 5y ago

I forget where I saw it but I remember someone on the right criticizing those on the left by saying "I will start treating climate change like an emergency when they start acting like it's and emergency". A lot of the "solutions" to climate change that are suggested align with what the left already wants. If it's really an emergency let's act like one. The navy runs A1B reactors that are somewhere in the range of 500MW the US uses somewhere around 450000MW at any given time. That's 900 A1B reactors. They cost somewhere around $200m to put on a carrier. That puts it at around $180b to take us to 0 carbon power generation. If people believed the world was going to be uninhabitable soon you think they would be willing take some kind of path like this but instead they suggest lots of things they already want.

stnmtn 5y ago
Do you think that it might be more complicated than the scenario you've devised, or do you believe it is as simple and foolproof as you say?
- shrimpx 5y ago
  As long as we’ve figured out nuclear waste management, it’s pretty straightforward. Unfortunately nuclear too is a political issue.
- Veelox 5y ago
  Oh it's not fool proof and there are would probably be cost over runs and you would probably need to make power produces whole for their capital out lays. There might be an nuclear incident. I feel like if the world was going to end in 30 years people would be willing to discuss more direct action.
ghostbrainalpha 5y ago
Devils Advocate, a lot of "what the left already wants" they only already want because they have been worried about climate change for 20 years. For example protecting national parks. But I 100% agree, that a true path forward would involve the left taking actions to fix climate change that would be more popular with the conservative crowd. If all the coal plants we were closing, were being replaced with nuclear power in the same cities and states, there would be a lot of job protection. And that might help move things forward. Or a call for Solar Panels on homes, with panels made in the U.S. might be a good compromise as well.
- ihumanable 5y ago
  This is what the left has been advocating for for decades. https://www.whitehouse.gov/build-back-better/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/build-back-better/ > Ensures clean energy technology – from wind turbine blades to solar panels to electric cars – will be built in the United States with American made steel and other materials, creating hundreds of thousands of good jobs here at home. > The Build Back Better legislation will target incentives to grow domestic supply chains in solar, wind, and other critical industries in communities on the frontlines of the energy transition. In addition, the framework will boost the competitiveness of existing industries, like steel, cement, and aluminum, through grants, loans, tax credits, and procurement to drive capital investment in the decarbonization and revitalization of American manufacturing. --- > The framework will also fund port electrification; facilitate the deployment of cleaner transit, buses, and trucks; and support critical community capacity building, including grants to environmental justice communities. In addition, the framework will create a new Civilian Climate Corps – with over 300,000 members that look like America. This diverse new workforce will conserve our public lands, bolster community resilience, and address the changing climate, all while putting good-paying union jobs within reach for more Americans. --- > The consumer rebates and credits included in the Build Back Better framework will save the average American family hundreds of dollars per year in energy costs. These measures include enhancement and expansion of existing home energy and efficiency tax credits, as well as the creation of a new, electrification-focused rebate program. The framework will cut the cost of installing rooftop solar for a home by around 30 percent, shortening the payback period by around 5 years; and the framework’s electric vehicle tax credit will lower the cost of an electric vehicle that is made in America with American materials and union labor by $12,500 for a middle-class family. In addition, the framework will help rural communities tap into the clean energy opportunity through targeted grants and loans through the Department of Agriculture. --- Clinton's campaign had similar promises around retraining coal miners to provide them good jobs in Wind and Solar.
  - ghostbrainalpha 5y ago
    You think grants to environmental justice communities, and a diverse workforce that "looks like America" sounds like compromise to conservatives? Clinton's campaign did have promises of getting coal miners jobs in wind and solar, but if those industries can't completely replace what we have now, how can they possibly replace all the jobs? When a coal mine turns into a nuclear power plant that is something that feels like is going to generate even more jobs than existed previously. Where renewables feel like less jobs. Those assumptions may be incorrect but that is how it is going to sound to the average voter.
Zababa 5y ago
Especially when the most visible actions are ridiculous stuff like banning plastic straws.
tcmart14 5y ago
Leftist here (and not `democrat left`, actual left). I would love to build nuclear reactors, lots of them. Problem is, it is a political issue that spans across all political leanings in America. You can find conservatives who would agree with me on building reactors, and conservatives who won't. You can find liberals who would agree with me, and those who won't. Best I have is, crux of the problem is that to get people out of their hysteria means being able to learn a little about nuclear, which most people don't want to do anyway.

by Veelox 5y ago

stnmtn 5y ago

Do you think that it might be more complicated than the scenario you've devised, or do you believe it is as simple and foolproof as you say?

shrimpx 5y ago
As long as we’ve figured out nuclear waste management, it’s pretty straightforward. Unfortunately nuclear too is a political issue.
Veelox 5y ago
Oh it's not fool proof and there are would probably be cost over runs and you would probably need to make power produces whole for their capital out lays. There might be an nuclear incident. I feel like if the world was going to end in 30 years people would be willing to discuss more direct action.

ghostbrainalpha 5y ago

Devils Advocate, a lot of "what the left already wants" they only already want because they have been worried about climate change for 20 years. For example protecting national parks. But I 100% agree, that a true path forward would involve the left taking actions to fix climate change that would be more popular with the conservative crowd. If all the coal plants we were closing, were being replaced with nuclear power in the same cities and states, there would be a lot of job protection. And that might help move things forward. Or a call for Solar Panels on homes, with panels made in the U.S. might be a good compromise as well.

ihumanable 5y ago
This is what the left has been advocating for for decades. https://www.whitehouse.gov/build-back-better/ https://www.whitehouse.gov/build-back-better/ > Ensures clean energy technology – from wind turbine blades to solar panels to electric cars – will be built in the United States with American made steel and other materials, creating hundreds of thousands of good jobs here at home. > The Build Back Better legislation will target incentives to grow domestic supply chains in solar, wind, and other critical industries in communities on the frontlines of the energy transition. In addition, the framework will boost the competitiveness of existing industries, like steel, cement, and aluminum, through grants, loans, tax credits, and procurement to drive capital investment in the decarbonization and revitalization of American manufacturing. --- > The framework will also fund port electrification; facilitate the deployment of cleaner transit, buses, and trucks; and support critical community capacity building, including grants to environmental justice communities. In addition, the framework will create a new Civilian Climate Corps – with over 300,000 members that look like America. This diverse new workforce will conserve our public lands, bolster community resilience, and address the changing climate, all while putting good-paying union jobs within reach for more Americans. --- > The consumer rebates and credits included in the Build Back Better framework will save the average American family hundreds of dollars per year in energy costs. These measures include enhancement and expansion of existing home energy and efficiency tax credits, as well as the creation of a new, electrification-focused rebate program. The framework will cut the cost of installing rooftop solar for a home by around 30 percent, shortening the payback period by around 5 years; and the framework’s electric vehicle tax credit will lower the cost of an electric vehicle that is made in America with American materials and union labor by $12,500 for a middle-class family. In addition, the framework will help rural communities tap into the clean energy opportunity through targeted grants and loans through the Department of Agriculture. --- Clinton's campaign had similar promises around retraining coal miners to provide them good jobs in Wind and Solar.
- ghostbrainalpha 5y ago
  You think grants to environmental justice communities, and a diverse workforce that "looks like America" sounds like compromise to conservatives? Clinton's campaign did have promises of getting coal miners jobs in wind and solar, but if those industries can't completely replace what we have now, how can they possibly replace all the jobs? When a coal mine turns into a nuclear power plant that is something that feels like is going to generate even more jobs than existed previously. Where renewables feel like less jobs. Those assumptions may be incorrect but that is how it is going to sound to the average voter.

Zababa 5y ago

Especially when the most visible actions are ridiculous stuff like banning plastic straws.

tcmart14 5y ago

Leftist here (and not `democrat left`, actual left). I would love to build nuclear reactors, lots of them. Problem is, it is a political issue that spans across all political leanings in America. You can find conservatives who would agree with me on building reactors, and conservatives who won't. You can find liberals who would agree with me, and those who won't. Best I have is, crux of the problem is that to get people out of their hysteria means being able to learn a little about nuclear, which most people don't want to do anyway.