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Just rattling off the action movies I can immediately think of, I don’t believe any of which include a conspiracy in their plot/synopsis. The only action movie

Just rattling off the action movies I can immediately think of, I don’t believe any of which include a conspiracy in their plot/synopsis. The only action movie I can think of about a conspiracy is the movie Conspiracy with Mel Gibson, got any others? - The Last Action Hero - Robocop - Karate Kid - Baby Driver - Rocky - The Revenant - Mad Max - ConAir - Terminator

daniel-cussen 5y ago
Terminator is an easy one. The terminator at the beginning has done nothing wrong, and fights a gang[1] of bikers who antagonize him and gang up on him, and fight him together, for being naked after traveling through time. Karate Kid had the Cobra Cai, I think it was called, the rival school. I didn't see it, but I believe they were bullies. Maybe you're right about that one, although I think Daniel-san triumphs against a bully, there might have been several, or the bully had little supporters. It's a coming of age movie, though. It's also a sports movie, they do Karate-Do, which is for decorative, spirital, and sport purposes, not Karate-Jutsu, the military or let's call it "action". Robocop, there's that company that makes the robot that Robocop has to fight in the end, there's a lot of people working in that company and together they built an automatic murder machine, which they then set loose. And IIRC they're doing a housing development and have ties to the criminal activity in the city Robocop tries to clean up. And like that evil robot had missiles coming out of its back I think, the special effects were glitchy, which made it look like an even greater monstrosity. Companies are groups of persons so absolutely can be guilty of conspiracy if the facts warrant it, incorporation documents don't give permission to traffic heroin. So it happens to fronts for drug dealing and it almost happened to Abbott Laboratories, also basically for drug dealing, only with a drug patients hated instead of craving. Rocky does not involve a conspiracy, except of course the conspiracy that Rocky works for, the mob, as a debt collector. Which is the reason behind his conflict with Mickey, while Rocky says "it's a living" Mickey replies "it's a waste of life!" But I think I can hand you this one. One catch: this is a sports movie, not an action movie. I haven't seen the others. [1] gang is a well-marketed and very glamourous word for conspiracy, which is the term courts use when there's the formal elements of a conspiracy: meeting of the minds, two or more participants in a crime acting in coordination, there's a third one [EDIT: secrecy, and illegality or bad faith are others] but that's the gist of it, it just means criminal teamwork. Some things you do alone, some things with others, same goes for crime...at any rate, don't accuse someone of being a conspiracy theorist to a judge. Judges deal with conspiracies continually, sometimes multiple different ones per day, and there absolutely are people trying to play that judge by "covering" for each other. You will curry zero favor with that judge by putting the word "conspiracy" in your opponents mouth and then claim he must be delusional. That always works on talk TV, but not in court. Judges simply don't have the luxury of being able to pretend criminals never cooperate, like none of them had a single friend.
- dllthomas 5y ago
  Fully agreed on the sports movie vs action movie note. Saying that Robocop isn't about a conspiracy strikes me as bizarre - the whole thing was a government contractor abusing its power. I think your take on Terminator is a little weird - Arnold isn't the hero, and the gang fight is a complete throw away; that doesn't make it a conspiracy movie. T2 is more so, with the secret use of future tech.
  - daniel-cussen 5y ago
    OK so I just watched the clip and no that's absolutely a conspiracy of wastes of a fuck 100%. They do everything. They insult him, they click his fingers at him, sure he asks for clothes in the imperative but if you don't know the rest of the plot it could just be a weird naked guy asking for clothes, I've seen people in tough situations make much worse requests. I saw some in SF for instance, really gritty scene I remember a crack addict at a wondrous and cheap Chinese food restaurant named Quickly. He said crack cures hunger, over and over, like that was what he was going to eat, and he was there because he had no crack, so he needed actual food to cure his hunger. So in SF people ignored him, but in this clip the losers say "Fuck you, Asshole" and then all three take out a switchblade with the camera focussed on the blade opening, and they guy's naked, one of the losers stabs him, at this point you don't yet know how hardcore the Terminator is. So what this film is doing is using a small wannabe conspiracy to raise the status of the true villain of the movie. But there's no intention of the losers being the good guy, at this point Arnold's the closest to being the good guy.
    - dllthomas 5y ago
      I didn't say that the "gang" was "good guys". My point was that the film's pitting of the main villain against a group of (extremely minor) villains in a single, throw away scene is unrelated to the upthread assertion under discussion that action movies pit individual heroes against a conspiracy so they can have the heroes defeat individual members of the conspiracy over the course of the movie. Whether or not we call the group a conspiracy, the scene doesn't make the broader case.
dllthomas 5y ago
Enemy Of The State is for me the canonical conspiracy theory action movie. A conspiracy theory dynamic was shoehorned into the Minority Report movie (the short story is very different). Hydra stuff in recent MCU comes to mind. Predator is an interesting inversion in that, while there is a bit of CIA backstabbing, the real conspiracy relevant to the conjecture above is actually "our heroes", who are eliminated by the single antagonist until the climactic fight. I guess that's kind of a horror thing, though?
LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago
- Echelon Conspiracy - The Island - The Truman Show - Capricorn One - Alternative 3 - The Parallax View - The Anderson Tapes - THX 1138 edit: depending on how you look at it - Contact

daniel-cussen 5y ago

Terminator is an easy one. The terminator at the beginning has done nothing wrong, and fights a gang[1] of bikers who antagonize him and gang up on him, and fight him together, for being naked after traveling through time. Karate Kid had the Cobra Cai, I think it was called, the rival school. I didn't see it, but I believe they were bullies. Maybe you're right about that one, although I think Daniel-san triumphs against a bully, there might have been several, or the bully had little supporters. It's a coming of age movie, though. It's also a sports movie, they do Karate-Do, which is for decorative, spirital, and sport purposes, not Karate-Jutsu, the military or let's call it "action". Robocop, there's that company that makes the robot that Robocop has to fight in the end, there's a lot of people working in that company and together they built an automatic murder machine, which they then set loose. And IIRC they're doing a housing development and have ties to the criminal activity in the city Robocop tries to clean up. And like that evil robot had missiles coming out of its back I think, the special effects were glitchy, which made it look like an even greater monstrosity. Companies are groups of persons so absolutely can be guilty of conspiracy if the facts warrant it, incorporation documents don't give permission to traffic heroin. So it happens to fronts for drug dealing and it almost happened to Abbott Laboratories, also basically for drug dealing, only with a drug patients hated instead of craving. Rocky does not involve a conspiracy, except of course the conspiracy that Rocky works for, the mob, as a debt collector. Which is the reason behind his conflict with Mickey, while Rocky says "it's a living" Mickey replies "it's a waste of life!" But I think I can hand you this one. One catch: this is a sports movie, not an action movie. I haven't seen the others. [1] gang is a well-marketed and very glamourous word for conspiracy, which is the term courts use when there's the formal elements of a conspiracy: meeting of the minds, two or more participants in a crime acting in coordination, there's a third one [EDIT: secrecy, and illegality or bad faith are others] but that's the gist of it, it just means criminal teamwork. Some things you do alone, some things with others, same goes for crime...at any rate, don't accuse someone of being a conspiracy theorist to a judge. Judges deal with conspiracies continually, sometimes multiple different ones per day, and there absolutely are people trying to play that judge by "covering" for each other. You will curry zero favor with that judge by putting the word "conspiracy" in your opponents mouth and then claim he must be delusional. That always works on talk TV, but not in court. Judges simply don't have the luxury of being able to pretend criminals never cooperate, like none of them had a single friend.

dllthomas 5y ago
Fully agreed on the sports movie vs action movie note. Saying that Robocop isn't about a conspiracy strikes me as bizarre - the whole thing was a government contractor abusing its power. I think your take on Terminator is a little weird - Arnold isn't the hero, and the gang fight is a complete throw away; that doesn't make it a conspiracy movie. T2 is more so, with the secret use of future tech.
- daniel-cussen 5y ago
  OK so I just watched the clip and no that's absolutely a conspiracy of wastes of a fuck 100%. They do everything. They insult him, they click his fingers at him, sure he asks for clothes in the imperative but if you don't know the rest of the plot it could just be a weird naked guy asking for clothes, I've seen people in tough situations make much worse requests. I saw some in SF for instance, really gritty scene I remember a crack addict at a wondrous and cheap Chinese food restaurant named Quickly. He said crack cures hunger, over and over, like that was what he was going to eat, and he was there because he had no crack, so he needed actual food to cure his hunger. So in SF people ignored him, but in this clip the losers say "Fuck you, Asshole" and then all three take out a switchblade with the camera focussed on the blade opening, and they guy's naked, one of the losers stabs him, at this point you don't yet know how hardcore the Terminator is. So what this film is doing is using a small wannabe conspiracy to raise the status of the true villain of the movie. But there's no intention of the losers being the good guy, at this point Arnold's the closest to being the good guy.
  - dllthomas 5y ago
    I didn't say that the "gang" was "good guys". My point was that the film's pitting of the main villain against a group of (extremely minor) villains in a single, throw away scene is unrelated to the upthread assertion under discussion that action movies pit individual heroes against a conspiracy so they can have the heroes defeat individual members of the conspiracy over the course of the movie. Whether or not we call the group a conspiracy, the scene doesn't make the broader case.

dllthomas 5y ago

Enemy Of The State is for me the canonical conspiracy theory action movie. A conspiracy theory dynamic was shoehorned into the Minority Report movie (the short story is very different). Hydra stuff in recent MCU comes to mind. Predator is an interesting inversion in that, while there is a bit of CIA backstabbing, the real conspiracy relevant to the conjecture above is actually "our heroes", who are eliminated by the single antagonist until the climactic fight. I guess that's kind of a horror thing, though?

LargoLasskhyfv 5y ago

- Echelon Conspiracy - The Island - The Truman Show - Capricorn One - Alternative 3 - The Parallax View - The Anderson Tapes - THX 1138 edit: depending on how you look at it - Contact