4 ms·

This feels off. Farming today is a seven day, every day work week. There is no day off with livestock, no matter what century, and what season. If the sun se

This feels off. Farming today is a seven day, every day work week. There is no day off with livestock, no matter what century, and what season. If the sun sets, or the weather is bad outside, there are plenty of work to be done indoors. I would presume it was even harder without all the automation and technology in the Middle Ages. Maybe they did not labour for the employer all the time, but all the 'free time' was spent labouring for sustenance, and other life's maintenance. If I recall correctly, the 8 hour day, 40 hour week, and five day work-week are all 19th century trends.

dragonwriter 5y ago
> If I recall correctly, the 8 hour day, 40 hour week, and five day work-week are all 19th century trends. They were reactions to the extended working hours employed in the industrial revolution to maximize capital utilization in factories.
- tcmart14 5y ago
  Yup. Can't forget. The 8 hour work day was because unions fought for it, not because companies willing gave it.
solarmist 5y ago
I'm not sure I agree. I'm sure the plots they were farming were much smaller and there were more hands per plot. Also, I believe most families wouldn't have been able to afford more than a couple of smaller animals, and if they were lucky/slightly better off a cow/goat. Plus, if you look at the lowest figure in the article is mentions 1440 hours annually which works out to a bit under 30 hours a week, so not hugely less time. On the flip side everything had to be build by hand from scratch so domestic labor probably accounted for at least an equal amount of time. I'd guess that between work and home the average was probably 60 hours a week. Not too far off nowadays, just distributed differently.
btbuildem 5y ago
Farming is an excellent example. But the farming we know today has been subject to relentless pressures of capitalism, and it has been industrialized to support economies of scale. Mom and pop farms are vestiges of the past. So I'm not sure your comparison holds, maybe a better analogy would be a hobby farm? Usually those involve people who have primary jobs and choose this as a lifestyle. My guess would the the farming hours in that context cannot be too many; it would interfere with their day jobs.
- id02009 5y ago
  Just an anecdote, but I remember my aunt and uncle farm. No economies of scale at all. My uncle would leave to work, and I remember my aunt's day. Prepare breakfast for kids. Let chickens out. Go to shop (on foot, they had no car) bring necessities. Go tend the vegetables garden. Cook dinner. Take care for elderly mom. Uncle back from work, it's 3pm, she was already busy for 9 hours. I think at this point she allowed herself to watch TV. I know it's from 1990s, but it feels weird to claim that 15th century work was less, when you would not be able to buy a shovel in a store...
fy20 5y ago
My wife's 85 year old grandma lives on a small dairy farm (less than 20 animals) and farms it pretty much the same way it was done a century ago. Actually today it's more of a "homestead" than what you'd thing of as a "farm", but this is what "farms" used to be. During summer there is always a lot to do, as they need to tend to the fields to grow feed and food for themselves, and they are often working from sunrise to sunset. But during the winter it's just looking after the animals - they stay in the barn as it's too cold in our climate to be outdoors - so it's mainly feeding and cleaning which doesn't take too much time. The idea of such seasonable work seems somewhat appealing to me, as you work hard to get things done for one part of the year, then go into maintenance mode for another. It seems like it is a good chance to recharge and reflect on things, instead of just picking up the next Jira card and forgetting about what you've just done. I imagine places that have holiday code freezes must feel a bit like that, but this is a longer period.
StopTheWorld 5y ago
> If I recall correctly, the 8 hour day, 40 hour week, and five day work-week are all 19th century trends If it is, hunter gatherers often worked even less, as Marshall Sahlins noted in "The Original Affluent Society" and other books. Even modern hunter gatherers often work less, although there are less in existence now than there were a few decades ago.

dragonwriter 5y ago

> If I recall correctly, the 8 hour day, 40 hour week, and five day work-week are all 19th century trends. They were reactions to the extended working hours employed in the industrial revolution to maximize capital utilization in factories.

tcmart14 5y ago
Yup. Can't forget. The 8 hour work day was because unions fought for it, not because companies willing gave it.

solarmist 5y ago

I'm not sure I agree. I'm sure the plots they were farming were much smaller and there were more hands per plot. Also, I believe most families wouldn't have been able to afford more than a couple of smaller animals, and if they were lucky/slightly better off a cow/goat. Plus, if you look at the lowest figure in the article is mentions 1440 hours annually which works out to a bit under 30 hours a week, so not hugely less time. On the flip side everything had to be build by hand from scratch so domestic labor probably accounted for at least an equal amount of time. I'd guess that between work and home the average was probably 60 hours a week. Not too far off nowadays, just distributed differently.

btbuildem 5y ago

Farming is an excellent example. But the farming we know today has been subject to relentless pressures of capitalism, and it has been industrialized to support economies of scale. Mom and pop farms are vestiges of the past. So I'm not sure your comparison holds, maybe a better analogy would be a hobby farm? Usually those involve people who have primary jobs and choose this as a lifestyle. My guess would the the farming hours in that context cannot be too many; it would interfere with their day jobs.

id02009 5y ago
Just an anecdote, but I remember my aunt and uncle farm. No economies of scale at all. My uncle would leave to work, and I remember my aunt's day. Prepare breakfast for kids. Let chickens out. Go to shop (on foot, they had no car) bring necessities. Go tend the vegetables garden. Cook dinner. Take care for elderly mom. Uncle back from work, it's 3pm, she was already busy for 9 hours. I think at this point she allowed herself to watch TV. I know it's from 1990s, but it feels weird to claim that 15th century work was less, when you would not be able to buy a shovel in a store...

fy20 5y ago

My wife's 85 year old grandma lives on a small dairy farm (less than 20 animals) and farms it pretty much the same way it was done a century ago. Actually today it's more of a "homestead" than what you'd thing of as a "farm", but this is what "farms" used to be. During summer there is always a lot to do, as they need to tend to the fields to grow feed and food for themselves, and they are often working from sunrise to sunset. But during the winter it's just looking after the animals - they stay in the barn as it's too cold in our climate to be outdoors - so it's mainly feeding and cleaning which doesn't take too much time. The idea of such seasonable work seems somewhat appealing to me, as you work hard to get things done for one part of the year, then go into maintenance mode for another. It seems like it is a good chance to recharge and reflect on things, instead of just picking up the next Jira card and forgetting about what you've just done. I imagine places that have holiday code freezes must feel a bit like that, but this is a longer period.

StopTheWorld 5y ago

> If I recall correctly, the 8 hour day, 40 hour week, and five day work-week are all 19th century trends If it is, hunter gatherers often worked even less, as Marshall Sahlins noted in "The Original Affluent Society" and other books. Even modern hunter gatherers often work less, although there are less in existence now than there were a few decades ago.