4 ms·

So infuriating. I'm a former damage control assistant on a US submarine. The fire response read like a clownshow, and this article doesn't even highlight the w

So infuriating. I'm a former damage control assistant on a US submarine. The fire response read like a clownshow, and this article doesn't even highlight the worst of it. There was a Sailor who saw the smoke and walked by it, thinking nothing of it! Another officer thought the smoke might have been coming from the diesel generator. Why tf would the diesel generator be running??? It's hard for me to think of the software equivalent of these fundamental errors. Maybe something like finding a spike in network traffic and assuming it's load testing on prod, when you're actually getting pwned?

secondcoming 5y ago
It's just a guess, but the sailor who saw the smoke may have instead seen the CO2 from the extinguishers being emptied
- jwithington 5y ago
  The one I'm referring to was the first person on the ship who saw the smoke. They then went back to sleep or something like that.
  - wolverine876 5y ago
    That could be the sailor, but I would bet on the organization and leadership: In many organizations, bearing the bad news just creates enormous work and trouble for yourself, for your teammates, and rarely accomplishes anything. Rationally, it's absurd to ignore a fire. But I've seen organizations and situations where I would expect it.
    - hugh-avherald 5y ago
      I'd say training more than culture. The response to smoke onboard a ship should be automatic, not requiring any contemplation (even if it's just 'trigger alarm').
    - i_am_proteus 5y ago
      Also a former submarine DCA: a sailor failing to call away smoke speaks to an egregious cultural problem in how the crew treats damage control (unless this was an absolutely brand-spanking-new nonqual).
      - wolverine876 5y ago
        Could you believe that the culture might become that bad? Also, isn't fire on a submarine far more critical than fire on a surface ship in port?
mwattsun 5y ago
I had a buddy report and then help prevent a major electrical fire in the electrical mains coming from the submarine tender. They drug tested him after his heroic performance, found traces of THC and kicked him out of the Navy. Maybe the sailor saw the smoke and decided he didn't want to get drug tested.
qwertyuiop_ 5y ago
So as time progressed from WWII we lost best practices, maritime safety knowledge and Military discipline. We can't win another war if a worthy enemy challenged us. We can't build another Saturn V or Apollo module. In other words we retrogressed and became WOKE
- burnished 5y ago
  Yeah, these damn kids these days and their insistence that everyone be treated with dignity and respect! Downfall of humanity.
  - mikewarot 5y ago
    Demanding representation is the opposite of insistence on being treated with dignity, and respect. It pushes diversity over competence. Giving everyone a fair chance, instead of demanding an equal outcome, is the most respectful way to treat people. You can't expect respect by fiat, it must be earned.
- bobbylarrybobby 5y ago
  What does wokeness have to do with military preparedness?
  - AdrianB1 5y ago
    The tendency to focus more on diversity hiring than competency? At least this is what I see on massive scale in all the companies I am working with.
  - aaron695 5y ago
    > What does wokeness have to do with military preparedness? This are 100's of military memes everywhere on this so what's your real question? It's a 100% logical thought process, people are learning to kill other human beings, how is that compatible with Wokeness? The Woke can't even code, they can only bikeshed other peoples time away. RT comment on pretty girls who love their parents and beaches and weddings - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEnxmzqXJN8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEnxmzqXJN8 Any idiot can see the point here. Russian soldier leaks on social media are them killing civilians. The USA 'leaks' on social media are soldiers complaining they have to remove their nail polish. These meme's are common. It also follows the corollary, that unlike the Cold War where countries tried to outdo each other, now they try and put the other one down. Play down Chinese space tech rather than improving our own.
bell-cot 5y ago
After reading ~50 pages into the USN's own 400+ page Command Investigation report (dated 12 Jul 2020 and 20 Oct 2021, link further down)...the sailor and officer that you mention were no more than a couple little sesame seeds on the top bun of a triple-decker shit-show burger, with ALL the trimmings. (Based on a quick search of that report for "DCA"...let me politely suggest that you do NOT read the report. Ever.)

secondcoming 5y ago

It's just a guess, but the sailor who saw the smoke may have instead seen the CO2 from the extinguishers being emptied

jwithington 5y ago
The one I'm referring to was the first person on the ship who saw the smoke. They then went back to sleep or something like that.
- wolverine876 5y ago
  That could be the sailor, but I would bet on the organization and leadership: In many organizations, bearing the bad news just creates enormous work and trouble for yourself, for your teammates, and rarely accomplishes anything. Rationally, it's absurd to ignore a fire. But I've seen organizations and situations where I would expect it.
  - hugh-avherald 5y ago
    I'd say training more than culture. The response to smoke onboard a ship should be automatic, not requiring any contemplation (even if it's just 'trigger alarm').
  - i_am_proteus 5y ago
    Also a former submarine DCA: a sailor failing to call away smoke speaks to an egregious cultural problem in how the crew treats damage control (unless this was an absolutely brand-spanking-new nonqual).
    - wolverine876 5y ago
      Could you believe that the culture might become that bad? Also, isn't fire on a submarine far more critical than fire on a surface ship in port?

mwattsun 5y ago

I had a buddy report and then help prevent a major electrical fire in the electrical mains coming from the submarine tender. They drug tested him after his heroic performance, found traces of THC and kicked him out of the Navy. Maybe the sailor saw the smoke and decided he didn't want to get drug tested.

qwertyuiop_ 5y ago

So as time progressed from WWII we lost best practices, maritime safety knowledge and Military discipline. We can't win another war if a worthy enemy challenged us. We can't build another Saturn V or Apollo module. In other words we retrogressed and became WOKE

burnished 5y ago
Yeah, these damn kids these days and their insistence that everyone be treated with dignity and respect! Downfall of humanity.
- mikewarot 5y ago
  Demanding representation is the opposite of insistence on being treated with dignity, and respect. It pushes diversity over competence. Giving everyone a fair chance, instead of demanding an equal outcome, is the most respectful way to treat people. You can't expect respect by fiat, it must be earned.
bobbylarrybobby 5y ago
What does wokeness have to do with military preparedness?
- AdrianB1 5y ago
  The tendency to focus more on diversity hiring than competency? At least this is what I see on massive scale in all the companies I am working with.
- aaron695 5y ago
  > What does wokeness have to do with military preparedness? This are 100's of military memes everywhere on this so what's your real question? It's a 100% logical thought process, people are learning to kill other human beings, how is that compatible with Wokeness? The Woke can't even code, they can only bikeshed other peoples time away. RT comment on pretty girls who love their parents and beaches and weddings - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEnxmzqXJN8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZEnxmzqXJN8 Any idiot can see the point here. Russian soldier leaks on social media are them killing civilians. The USA 'leaks' on social media are soldiers complaining they have to remove their nail polish. These meme's are common. It also follows the corollary, that unlike the Cold War where countries tried to outdo each other, now they try and put the other one down. Play down Chinese space tech rather than improving our own.

bell-cot 5y ago

After reading ~50 pages into the USN's own 400+ page Command Investigation report (dated 12 Jul 2020 and 20 Oct 2021, link further down)...the sailor and officer that you mention were no more than a couple little sesame seeds on the top bun of a triple-decker shit-show burger, with ALL the trimmings. (Based on a quick search of that report for "DCA"...let me politely suggest that you do NOT read the report. Ever.)