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I get what they are saying but the b.s. part is how it is framed as an evolution of the internet. It is and will be yet another technology available to those wh

by _8j50 5y ago

I get what they are saying but the b.s. part is how it is framed as an evolution of the internet. It is and will be yet another technology available to those who want to use it. Email is not an evolution of papermail, the internet is not an evolution of the telephone. It adds value, it does not displace the internet. I would never want to use VR/AR. I like invisible tech not immersive tech. For example, I would prefer holographs to AR/VR if the tech was ready. I want tech that is just there and just works. When I browse an item at a store, I don't want AR to tell me info or let me interact with content about that item, I want the store itself to support displays/screens and gesture based interaction. I want less tech attached and connected to me. I don't like video calls or voice calls, just not comfortable with it even with telephones. I like text. My point is, AR/VR and the tech describe by "metaverse" will exist but it will itself become obsoleted by better tech by the time it can entirely replace the internet. Webgl has been around for a while and it hardly replaced regular html sites. PWAs are here and they will hardly do the same either. Both authors are arguing a false dichotomy. It is and is not bullshit (schrodinger's bullshit?)

selfhoster11 5y ago
> It is and will be yet another technology available to those who want to use it. Email is not an evolution of papermail, the internet is not an evolution of the telephone. It adds value, it does not displace the internet. I disagree. The only thing most people get via papermail is important government/bank communications and bills. Lots of people forgo the use of a telephone and communicate exclusively via internet chat/calls. There is a reason to be worried. Like those older technologies, VR/”metaverse" may render more classical paradigms of computing, communication and interaction obsolete - meaning, leave them either for legacy uses only, or make them only useful within a smaller circle of friends or family where the use of such classical methods can be pre-agreed and enforced.
- dataflow 5y ago
  > Email is not an evolution of papermail It definitely is! So many people get so many things exclusively by email that they would otherwise get by mail. > the internet is not an evolution of the telephone Weren't dial-up and then DSL quite literally evolution of the telephone connections? And aren't VoIP and other internet communication platforms displacing a large use case for the telephone?
  - selfhoster11 5y ago
    I was just quoting these sentences from the parent comment.
  - LocalH 5y ago
    I wouldn't call them an evolution of POTS so much as an overlay. Dial-up standards were a form of encoding that allowed a digital payload to be delivered over lines intended for analog signals. DSL is more or less a purified version of that.
    - dataflow 5y ago
      What would constitute an evolution? Would voice calls gaining video capability count...? Mail that can include digital attachments...?
- _8j50 5y ago
  People use email but they also use papermail. No one writes a love letter or send a regular message over paper mail but plenty of correspondence still happens by paper mail. Email itself is becoming obsoleted now bu newer message protocols but papermail will be around. Being used less does not mean displaced. Papermail lost the popularity contest but is still alive and kicking because the infrastructure is still very useful. You wouldn't vote by email but you would via papermail. And to your point, there is a reason paper mail is used for official purposes. It is the only way to deliver a message to the person residing at a fixed physical address.
  - selfhoster11 5y ago
    Yes, plenty of correspondence still happens, but it's usually a receive-only basis limited to, again, legacy applications. You wouldn't vote via email, but you can definitely vote online in multiple countries. And again, that's a legacy application for interfacing with an "important" entity (the government). > It is the only way to deliver a message to the person residing at a fixed physical address. Fixed physical addresses are overrated, and they change (tenants, recent home buyers). If you want to ensure you can deliver a message, you need to know how to contact them in other ways too.

by _8j50 5y ago

selfhoster11 5y ago

> It is and will be yet another technology available to those who want to use it. Email is not an evolution of papermail, the internet is not an evolution of the telephone. It adds value, it does not displace the internet. I disagree. The only thing most people get via papermail is important government/bank communications and bills. Lots of people forgo the use of a telephone and communicate exclusively via internet chat/calls. There is a reason to be worried. Like those older technologies, VR/”metaverse" may render more classical paradigms of computing, communication and interaction obsolete - meaning, leave them either for legacy uses only, or make them only useful within a smaller circle of friends or family where the use of such classical methods can be pre-agreed and enforced.

dataflow 5y ago
> Email is not an evolution of papermail It definitely is! So many people get so many things exclusively by email that they would otherwise get by mail. > the internet is not an evolution of the telephone Weren't dial-up and then DSL quite literally evolution of the telephone connections? And aren't VoIP and other internet communication platforms displacing a large use case for the telephone?
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  I was just quoting these sentences from the parent comment.
- LocalH 5y ago
  I wouldn't call them an evolution of POTS so much as an overlay. Dial-up standards were a form of encoding that allowed a digital payload to be delivered over lines intended for analog signals. DSL is more or less a purified version of that.
  - dataflow 5y ago
    What would constitute an evolution? Would voice calls gaining video capability count...? Mail that can include digital attachments...?
_8j50 5y ago
People use email but they also use papermail. No one writes a love letter or send a regular message over paper mail but plenty of correspondence still happens by paper mail. Email itself is becoming obsoleted now bu newer message protocols but papermail will be around. Being used less does not mean displaced. Papermail lost the popularity contest but is still alive and kicking because the infrastructure is still very useful. You wouldn't vote by email but you would via papermail. And to your point, there is a reason paper mail is used for official purposes. It is the only way to deliver a message to the person residing at a fixed physical address.
- selfhoster11 5y ago
  Yes, plenty of correspondence still happens, but it's usually a receive-only basis limited to, again, legacy applications. You wouldn't vote via email, but you can definitely vote online in multiple countries. And again, that's a legacy application for interfacing with an "important" entity (the government). > It is the only way to deliver a message to the person residing at a fixed physical address. Fixed physical addresses are overrated, and they change (tenants, recent home buyers). If you want to ensure you can deliver a message, you need to know how to contact them in other ways too.