5 ms·

That area of Maine has absolutely no infrastructure to be able to do anything with such a deposit, and there's no way that the sclerotic government and regulato

That area of Maine has absolutely no infrastructure to be able to do anything with such a deposit, and there's no way that the sclerotic government and regulatory agencies would allow you to build such infrastructure to process it, or even transport it elsewhere to where it could be processed.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago
It's basically on US2. That's not very rural as far as mines, logging and other resource extraction goes. You don't really need "infrastructure" to build a resource processing facility since everything is global these days anyway. You need a road that can handle truck traffic. The days of a paper mill having parts made by the toolmaker across town are long gone. Your specialty stuff will all show up in trucks that say Fedex or XPO on the side and the special people who help you get it running will all show up in cars with the little Enterprise sticker on them.
- fennecfoxen 5y ago
  No one is going to ship lithium ores overseas or down highways to a processing plant, regardless of what the property owner imagines. That burns a lot of diesel and costs a lot of money to move a product that’s over 90% unwanted dirt. The economics aren’t there. Purification on site is much more efficient. If they can’t purify it in Maine they’ll mine it somewhere else.
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    They're gonna ship it across the street for processing and then that stuff is what gets trucked out of state.
- thrower123 5y ago
  Route 2 out through Bethel there isn't much of a road. It's a winding two-lane stretch of blacktop that isn't as well maintained as it used to be now that all the mills in Berlin are gone.
  - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
    I've driven almost all of US2 in Maine at some point or another. A 2-lane road is sufficient for pretty much every industrial venture. If a 2-lane road isn't sufficient then the facility's driveway won't be sufficient either. There isn't that much traffic. There will be dozens of people working there and trucks coming and going. You don't need an upscale suburb to run this kind of facility. Employees won't be put off because the commute isn't 15min or because they can't go to a boutique sandwich shop during lunch break.
    - ineedasername 5y ago
      If a 2-lane road isn't sufficient then the facility's driveway won't be sufficient either. I'm guessing that their driveway won't be open to public traffic and would be built to withstand constant use by massively heavier trucks than are commonly seen on US2, so I don't think this is an apples-apples comparison.
      - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
        The local roads already carry plenty of logging traffic that grosses 80k, for highly inclusive values of 80k (lol).
        ineedasername 5y ago
        It's not just about weight, it's about density. Spodumene is about twice the weight if fresh cut wood on a ft^3 basis. A truck load of 80k Spodumene is going to be putting it's weight down over a much smaller foot print, and wear & tear on a road doesn't necessarily scale linearly so it's going to wear the roads significantly faster than wood. In my area there are highways where cargo trailers can't drive. The highways they're allowed on require more frequent maintenance. The issue isn't a show-stopper, but you can't just say "it's a two lane highway, that's enough" and "we already have heavy loads on the road, it will be fine". The are more variables to account for when determining the infrastructure necessary for large industrial operations.
      - 5y ago
- Symbiote 5y ago
  There's also a railway (looks to be [1]), pretty close to Newry. 10 miles of railway would be a small cost for a large mine. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Lawrence_and_Atlantic_Railroad https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Lawrence_and_Atlantic_Rail... https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Plumbago%20Mountain#map=12/44.5187/-70.7655 https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Plumbago%20Mounta...
thatguy0900 5y ago
I don't like your description of sclerotic, implying the government is dysfunctional if it doesn't allow heavy industry open strip mining near "a few miles northeast of the ski slopes of Sunday River and not far from Step Falls, where swimmers can wade in shallow pools formed by hundreds of feet of cascading granite ledge." 50 years from now when the area is a wasteland with polluted rivers I'm sure the residents who remember going swimming in natural ponds will be grateful for the nimbleness of their government
- hn_throwaway_99 5y ago
  Had the same reaction, essentially since the article goes on in length about how the Brooksville mine turned into an environmental disaster that cost taxpayers tens of millions to clean up. It's not like there's no history here.
- a2tech 5y ago
  Especially since as many people pointed out, Nevada has huge deposits of lithium in areas that are uninhabitable and bare desert
  - panick21_ 5y ago
    While true. Those are clay deposits. Nobody has yet managed to make commercial clay deposits an actual thing. So Nevada has these theoretical deposits that are large but nobody has managed to mine any. The same goes fro Clay deposits everywhere. Here we are talking about Spodumene rocket deposit. These are typically somewhat higher grade but they have a proven track record and company with knowledge on how to commercially make lithium hydroxide or carbonade from it. Spodumene was basically the original source for lithium, that we used to make nuclear weapon and later glass. This was for a long time almost driven out of the market by brine projects (mostly in South America) but the demand for high grade lithium hydroxide has lead to a Spodumene boom in West Australia.
- micromacrofoot 5y ago
  Yeah this might be a good example of how local governments can prioritize long-term realities over short-term gains.

throwaway0a5e 5y ago

It's basically on US2. That's not very rural as far as mines, logging and other resource extraction goes. You don't really need "infrastructure" to build a resource processing facility since everything is global these days anyway. You need a road that can handle truck traffic. The days of a paper mill having parts made by the toolmaker across town are long gone. Your specialty stuff will all show up in trucks that say Fedex or XPO on the side and the special people who help you get it running will all show up in cars with the little Enterprise sticker on them.

fennecfoxen 5y ago
No one is going to ship lithium ores overseas or down highways to a processing plant, regardless of what the property owner imagines. That burns a lot of diesel and costs a lot of money to move a product that’s over 90% unwanted dirt. The economics aren’t there. Purification on site is much more efficient. If they can’t purify it in Maine they’ll mine it somewhere else.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  They're gonna ship it across the street for processing and then that stuff is what gets trucked out of state.
thrower123 5y ago
Route 2 out through Bethel there isn't much of a road. It's a winding two-lane stretch of blacktop that isn't as well maintained as it used to be now that all the mills in Berlin are gone.
- throwaway0a5e 5y ago
  I've driven almost all of US2 in Maine at some point or another. A 2-lane road is sufficient for pretty much every industrial venture. If a 2-lane road isn't sufficient then the facility's driveway won't be sufficient either. There isn't that much traffic. There will be dozens of people working there and trucks coming and going. You don't need an upscale suburb to run this kind of facility. Employees won't be put off because the commute isn't 15min or because they can't go to a boutique sandwich shop during lunch break.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    If a 2-lane road isn't sufficient then the facility's driveway won't be sufficient either. I'm guessing that their driveway won't be open to public traffic and would be built to withstand constant use by massively heavier trucks than are commonly seen on US2, so I don't think this is an apples-apples comparison.
    - throwaway0a5e 5y ago
      The local roads already carry plenty of logging traffic that grosses 80k, for highly inclusive values of 80k (lol).
      - ineedasername 5y ago
        It's not just about weight, it's about density. Spodumene is about twice the weight if fresh cut wood on a ft^3 basis. A truck load of 80k Spodumene is going to be putting it's weight down over a much smaller foot print, and wear & tear on a road doesn't necessarily scale linearly so it's going to wear the roads significantly faster than wood. In my area there are highways where cargo trailers can't drive. The highways they're allowed on require more frequent maintenance. The issue isn't a show-stopper, but you can't just say "it's a two lane highway, that's enough" and "we already have heavy loads on the road, it will be fine". The are more variables to account for when determining the infrastructure necessary for large industrial operations.
    - 5y ago
Symbiote 5y ago
There's also a railway (looks to be [1]), pretty close to Newry. 10 miles of railway would be a small cost for a large mine. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Lawrence_and_Atlantic_Railroad https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St._Lawrence_and_Atlantic_Rail... https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Plumbago%20Mountain#map=12/44.5187/-70.7655 https://www.openstreetmap.org/search?query=Plumbago%20Mounta...

thatguy0900 5y ago

I don't like your description of sclerotic, implying the government is dysfunctional if it doesn't allow heavy industry open strip mining near "a few miles northeast of the ski slopes of Sunday River and not far from Step Falls, where swimmers can wade in shallow pools formed by hundreds of feet of cascading granite ledge." 50 years from now when the area is a wasteland with polluted rivers I'm sure the residents who remember going swimming in natural ponds will be grateful for the nimbleness of their government

hn_throwaway_99 5y ago
Had the same reaction, essentially since the article goes on in length about how the Brooksville mine turned into an environmental disaster that cost taxpayers tens of millions to clean up. It's not like there's no history here.
a2tech 5y ago
Especially since as many people pointed out, Nevada has huge deposits of lithium in areas that are uninhabitable and bare desert
- panick21_ 5y ago
  While true. Those are clay deposits. Nobody has yet managed to make commercial clay deposits an actual thing. So Nevada has these theoretical deposits that are large but nobody has managed to mine any. The same goes fro Clay deposits everywhere. Here we are talking about Spodumene rocket deposit. These are typically somewhat higher grade but they have a proven track record and company with knowledge on how to commercially make lithium hydroxide or carbonade from it. Spodumene was basically the original source for lithium, that we used to make nuclear weapon and later glass. This was for a long time almost driven out of the market by brine projects (mostly in South America) but the demand for high grade lithium hydroxide has lead to a Spodumene boom in West Australia.
micromacrofoot 5y ago
Yeah this might be a good example of how local governments can prioritize long-term realities over short-term gains.