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So, basically Amazon is in a win-win situation. If the status quo prevails, they're happy. If they have to start charging for shipping, maybe some customers go

So, basically Amazon is in a win-win situation. If the status quo prevails, they're happy. If they have to start charging for shipping, maybe some customers go to a local bookstore but Amazon also has a legal mandate to make more profit in their book sales by not subsidizing shipping out of the wholesale margin. And while some people will buy local a bit more, Amazon sells so many things and the local store may still have to order your book and get it to you slower than Amazon, keeping Amazon as the most convenient option... I don't see a long-term downside for Amazon here.

waynesonfire 5y ago
Oh good one. I guess at the end thats what these comapnies want. If they cant get market share through prices they'll do it in other ways as long as there is a level playing field. Similar to what fb is dealing with. They would welcome any legislation to hamper social media competition since they could then stop buying up potential threats.
xcambar 5y ago
That struck me as well. Another option would have been to support local bookstores by subsidizing transportation, which would have allowed them to lower the price to the point of being competitive with Amazon. But I guess that using public money to help local businesses is not as good as getting the customers to pay and help Amazon at the same time, in the eyes of Macron.
- tdeck 5y ago
  > Another option would have been to support local bookstores by subsidizing transportation Doesn't media mail already do this (in the US)? If you're just sending books, the USPS will deliver them well below cost. I'm not sure what effect it has on local shops.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    I'm not sure media mail is really below cost: it gets shipped on a space-available basis on the trucks, which is why it can take longer to arrive. So it's really only processed when there's excess capacity that would have gone unused. $3 for postage is probably going to cover marginal costs here.
    - tdeck 5y ago
      Fair point, I have no special knowledged of the pricing, but it is incredibly cheap.
GekkePrutser 5y ago
Amazon doesn't even order books anymore in many cases. Most of their paperbacks are printed on demand. Kinda cool and pretty good for the environment IMO. Never a book being printed that's not needed. But smaller stores can't compete with that.
makeitdouble 5y ago
There are laws preventing price dropping on new books. If Amazon has to start charging for shipping, they will be charging the same as every other bookstore in total, making them just another option among the others. Some will still prefer Amazon, but there is no downside anymore to chose another online shop (and there’s plenty big and reputable ones).
- kaashif 5y ago
  After complete price equality, I don't think it will be possible to have mandatory equal delivery times, so surely Amazon will still win out based on faster delivery.
  - makeitdouble 5y ago
    They still mostly rely on the local infrastructure. Even going through gig economy based approaches won't set them apart from the other players doing the same. Amazon is dominant, but not as much as we would tend to believe. It was forced to stop operations in France for a few weeks at the beginning of the pandemic, and demand just shifted around, service wasn't worse, delivery times weren't very different considering the situation. Comparing it to the effect of AWS shutting down, it was pretty unexpected.
    - ineedasername 5y ago
      Does Amazon really not have it's logistics built out that much in France? In the US local infrastructure is basically just last-mile delivery except for more rural areas. Also IIRC, Amazon shutdown at the begining of covid because of labor relations and a court order prohibiting shipment of anything but medical supplies-- not directly connected to it's general logistics and shipment capabilities.
      - makeitdouble 5y ago
        They have extended logistics, but there is enough parallel infra used by all the other players that I personally don't see a difference (Amazon is not much faster to me, and sometimes worse). On the Amazon shutdown, yes, it was strongly political and societal, not an operational error. I was just looking at it as a natural experiment on what happens when Amazon as a store stops.

waynesonfire 5y ago

Oh good one. I guess at the end thats what these comapnies want. If they cant get market share through prices they'll do it in other ways as long as there is a level playing field. Similar to what fb is dealing with. They would welcome any legislation to hamper social media competition since they could then stop buying up potential threats.

xcambar 5y ago

That struck me as well. Another option would have been to support local bookstores by subsidizing transportation, which would have allowed them to lower the price to the point of being competitive with Amazon. But I guess that using public money to help local businesses is not as good as getting the customers to pay and help Amazon at the same time, in the eyes of Macron.

tdeck 5y ago
> Another option would have been to support local bookstores by subsidizing transportation Doesn't media mail already do this (in the US)? If you're just sending books, the USPS will deliver them well below cost. I'm not sure what effect it has on local shops.
- ineedasername 5y ago
  I'm not sure media mail is really below cost: it gets shipped on a space-available basis on the trucks, which is why it can take longer to arrive. So it's really only processed when there's excess capacity that would have gone unused. $3 for postage is probably going to cover marginal costs here.
  - tdeck 5y ago
    Fair point, I have no special knowledged of the pricing, but it is incredibly cheap.

GekkePrutser 5y ago

Amazon doesn't even order books anymore in many cases. Most of their paperbacks are printed on demand. Kinda cool and pretty good for the environment IMO. Never a book being printed that's not needed. But smaller stores can't compete with that.

makeitdouble 5y ago

There are laws preventing price dropping on new books. If Amazon has to start charging for shipping, they will be charging the same as every other bookstore in total, making them just another option among the others. Some will still prefer Amazon, but there is no downside anymore to chose another online shop (and there’s plenty big and reputable ones).

kaashif 5y ago
After complete price equality, I don't think it will be possible to have mandatory equal delivery times, so surely Amazon will still win out based on faster delivery.
- makeitdouble 5y ago
  They still mostly rely on the local infrastructure. Even going through gig economy based approaches won't set them apart from the other players doing the same. Amazon is dominant, but not as much as we would tend to believe. It was forced to stop operations in France for a few weeks at the beginning of the pandemic, and demand just shifted around, service wasn't worse, delivery times weren't very different considering the situation. Comparing it to the effect of AWS shutting down, it was pretty unexpected.
  - ineedasername 5y ago
    Does Amazon really not have it's logistics built out that much in France? In the US local infrastructure is basically just last-mile delivery except for more rural areas. Also IIRC, Amazon shutdown at the begining of covid because of labor relations and a court order prohibiting shipment of anything but medical supplies-- not directly connected to it's general logistics and shipment capabilities.
    - makeitdouble 5y ago
      They have extended logistics, but there is enough parallel infra used by all the other players that I personally don't see a difference (Amazon is not much faster to me, and sometimes worse). On the Amazon shutdown, yes, it was strongly political and societal, not an operational error. I was just looking at it as a natural experiment on what happens when Amazon as a store stops.