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The United States at least is actively in a great depression. It's just being papered over with currency debasement so rich people don't notice. But if you act

The United States at least is actively in a great depression. It's just being papered over with currency debasement so rich people don't notice. But if you actually visit parts of this country that are outside of the wealthy, coastal bubbles, you'll see first hand the real world devastation that's happening to people. It's why there's a major opioid epidemic in the Midwest. It's why homelessness is exploding. It's why rampant, degenerate speculation in stocks and crypto is going crazy and rife with scams and conmen selling hope to the hopeless. It's why populists like Trump and Sanders have so much political energy behind them. And all of this is pre pandemic. I'm sure the past two years have added a new level of devastation. People are depressed and dying everywhere, but us winners in our gilded bubbles have the privilege of being able to look away and continue living in our illusory, drunken stupor.

hirundo 5y ago
If there's a great depression and few people are noticing, then it isn't that great. The great ones aren't subtle. I live in the rural southwest. Business isn't booming here. But it isn't that bad either, yet. Maybe we're in the "so far so good" phase, but there's a big difference between the fall and arriving at the pavement.
- newsclues 5y ago
  Great is an interesting term. Would it not be a Great Depression if it impacts millions of Americans for years or decades if the academic elite don’t see it from their ivory towers to document it?
  - rat87 5y ago
    So in other words it's not Great? The great depression effected a much larger percentage of the population in a much more negative manner You seem to be talking about local economic difficulties in some regions of the country. Which isn't a great thing but not nearly as terrible as the great depression.
    - newsclues 5y ago
      Great for who?
- mohanmcgeek 5y ago
  The impression that I get from the media is that a lot of people have quit their jobs to become full time retail traders now that the market is booming. And there is a labour shortage affecting production and logistics And when the market crashes, as it always does, many of these people will be in the red and that would greatly affect consumption.. How true is this?
jjoonathan 5y ago
That's not the result of a hidden depression, it's the result of intentionally giving control of society to capital and then capital throwing labor under the bus through wage and environmental arbitrage. It's the system working as intended, a feature not a bug. If we enter an actual depression, it will compound on top of the inequality.
dnautics 5y ago
> It's just being papered over with currency debasement It's also papered over by things like Norman Borlaug's agricultural revolution and supply chain innovation. Even with crappy broken supply chain, americans are not starving in the streets at depression-levels. But a whole lot of other stats support your hypothesis. Like mass exoduses from state to state.
- anonporridge 5y ago
  It's largely a crisis of meaning and purpose. As the machines churn out more and more of the essential things we need to live, and as we need fewer and fewer humans to keep the machines running, we're left with an overabundance of humans who don't know how to live without a job driving them. I think a lot of people miss that the Great Depression wasn't just about economic breakdown. People were literally depressed and society seemed aimless. It wasn't FDR's social programs that broke us out of that. It was kicking ass in WWII and emerging the victorious badasses ruling the world. THAT is what broke the spell of depression and injected vigor in American society.
sleepysysadmin 5y ago
>The United States at least is actively in a great depression. It's just being papered over with currency debasement so rich people don't notice. There are technical defintions. USA's GDPgrowth is at 6.7% and inflation is at 5.4%. china is at 0.2% gdp growth and 0.7% inflation. The numbers are scary bad if you exclude all of capitalist china. China is at 300% debt to gdp and on the verge of collapse. Greece was what 250% peak during their collapse? That's the importance of taiwan, hongkong, shenzen, and others. It's not the USA that's of concern. >But if you actually visit parts of this country that are outside of the wealthy, coastal bubbles, you'll see first hand the real world devastation that's happening to people. Oh for sure. You can read about the failure of krugman from his own words. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-10/inequality-globalization-and-the-missteps-of-1990s-economics https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-10/inequa... Which he still doesn't understand how much failure he has had. > It's why there's a major opioid epidemic in the Midwest. This has far more to do with marijuana legalization. They cant legally market their own product but they can FUD their competitors. >It's why homelessness is exploding. Far more related to rising minimum wage rates. There's a >95% correlation between homelessness and minimum wage in california. That's basically causation. >It's why rampant, degenerate speculation in stocks and crypto is going crazy and rife with scams and conmen selling hope to the hopeless. It's why populists like Trump and Sanders have so much political energy behind them. Oh yes, check the bloomberg link above. >People are depressed and dying everywhere, but us winners in our gilded bubbles have the privilege of being able to look away and continue living in our illusory, drunken stupor. That's actually a super interesting factor. Is there any relationship between psychology depression and economic depression. This was analyzed heavily during the great recession and it certainly seems like it is connected. Which is an argument for single-payer psychiatry. If a society could eliminate depression, economically we would likely be hugely benefited at a higher rate than the cost of the psychiatry.

hirundo 5y ago

If there's a great depression and few people are noticing, then it isn't that great. The great ones aren't subtle. I live in the rural southwest. Business isn't booming here. But it isn't that bad either, yet. Maybe we're in the "so far so good" phase, but there's a big difference between the fall and arriving at the pavement.

newsclues 5y ago
Great is an interesting term. Would it not be a Great Depression if it impacts millions of Americans for years or decades if the academic elite don’t see it from their ivory towers to document it?
- rat87 5y ago
  So in other words it's not Great? The great depression effected a much larger percentage of the population in a much more negative manner You seem to be talking about local economic difficulties in some regions of the country. Which isn't a great thing but not nearly as terrible as the great depression.
  - newsclues 5y ago
    Great for who?
mohanmcgeek 5y ago
The impression that I get from the media is that a lot of people have quit their jobs to become full time retail traders now that the market is booming. And there is a labour shortage affecting production and logistics And when the market crashes, as it always does, many of these people will be in the red and that would greatly affect consumption.. How true is this?

jjoonathan 5y ago

That's not the result of a hidden depression, it's the result of intentionally giving control of society to capital and then capital throwing labor under the bus through wage and environmental arbitrage. It's the system working as intended, a feature not a bug. If we enter an actual depression, it will compound on top of the inequality.

dnautics 5y ago

> It's just being papered over with currency debasement It's also papered over by things like Norman Borlaug's agricultural revolution and supply chain innovation. Even with crappy broken supply chain, americans are not starving in the streets at depression-levels. But a whole lot of other stats support your hypothesis. Like mass exoduses from state to state.

anonporridge 5y ago
It's largely a crisis of meaning and purpose. As the machines churn out more and more of the essential things we need to live, and as we need fewer and fewer humans to keep the machines running, we're left with an overabundance of humans who don't know how to live without a job driving them. I think a lot of people miss that the Great Depression wasn't just about economic breakdown. People were literally depressed and society seemed aimless. It wasn't FDR's social programs that broke us out of that. It was kicking ass in WWII and emerging the victorious badasses ruling the world. THAT is what broke the spell of depression and injected vigor in American society.

sleepysysadmin 5y ago

>The United States at least is actively in a great depression. It's just being papered over with currency debasement so rich people don't notice. There are technical defintions. USA's GDPgrowth is at 6.7% and inflation is at 5.4%. china is at 0.2% gdp growth and 0.7% inflation. The numbers are scary bad if you exclude all of capitalist china. China is at 300% debt to gdp and on the verge of collapse. Greece was what 250% peak during their collapse? That's the importance of taiwan, hongkong, shenzen, and others. It's not the USA that's of concern. >But if you actually visit parts of this country that are outside of the wealthy, coastal bubbles, you'll see first hand the real world devastation that's happening to people. Oh for sure. You can read about the failure of krugman from his own words. https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-10/inequality-globalization-and-the-missteps-of-1990s-economics https://www.bloomberg.com/opinion/articles/2019-10-10/inequa... Which he still doesn't understand how much failure he has had. > It's why there's a major opioid epidemic in the Midwest. This has far more to do with marijuana legalization. They cant legally market their own product but they can FUD their competitors. >It's why homelessness is exploding. Far more related to rising minimum wage rates. There's a >95% correlation between homelessness and minimum wage in california. That's basically causation. >It's why rampant, degenerate speculation in stocks and crypto is going crazy and rife with scams and conmen selling hope to the hopeless. It's why populists like Trump and Sanders have so much political energy behind them. Oh yes, check the bloomberg link above. >People are depressed and dying everywhere, but us winners in our gilded bubbles have the privilege of being able to look away and continue living in our illusory, drunken stupor. That's actually a super interesting factor. Is there any relationship between psychology depression and economic depression. This was analyzed heavily during the great recession and it certainly seems like it is connected. Which is an argument for single-payer psychiatry. If a society could eliminate depression, economically we would likely be hugely benefited at a higher rate than the cost of the psychiatry.