7 ms·

It's been a while since I bought a "Pro" computer from Apple. I am kind of wondering about the perf-per-$$$ factor. With a starting price of $2000, these are

by OldHand2018 5y ago

It's been a while since I bought a "Pro" computer from Apple. I am kind of wondering about the perf-per-$$$ factor. With a starting price of $2000, these are expensive computers. But maybe they are worth it! The M1 computers seemed like an absolute bargain for the performance.

cududa 5y ago
Depends what you need them for. On a music video set my 2010 MBP survived a drop from a second story balcony (three stories in a normal home), onto a marble floor. Got dented as hell, but only functional damage was to the ethernet port. I'm excited to get one of these new ones. Imagine it'll last at least 5 years.
mrtranscendence 5y ago
They're definitely pricey, but CPU performance is out of this world. GPU's pretty good too, though not as impressive, I understand. Alas, it'll probably be a few years before I can get one (I use my work machine for almost everything and I just got this one).
- f6v 5y ago
  It’s not that GPU isn’t impressive. Rather that you can’t put it to use in games.
  - mrtranscendence 5y ago
    Fair enough! It doesn't really bother me either way, since I don't really make use of the GPU on my laptop. Curious to try out Tensorflow on one of the new machines, though.
    - rezahussain 5y ago
      Yes, I just want to see some tensorflow specific benchmarks on the m1 max with 32 gpu cores vs 3080.
f6v 5y ago
They’re also compact, well-built(keyboards are fixed now) and with good battery life. Last time I was shopping, I found direct competition(XPS 13 and the likes) to be about the same price.
- OldHand2018 5y ago
  Oh absolutely, they're great. My last MacBook Pro was around $2500 or $3000, if I remember correctly, and it was a very good price for what you got. Don't think that I'm being overly negative here. These look like outstanding computers that are worth a premium price. My question here is about how much of a premium and I'm not trying to give an opinion with a question - I really don't know the answer :)
neogodless 5y ago
I liked Dave2D's (youtube) take on this. They are tools. If you have specific workloads that these excel at in your job/hobby/money-making venture, then the price shouldn't be a concern. Depending on workload, they are comparable to $1000 PC laptops in CPU performance... or $3000 PCs. Or PCs that don't exist yet! As someone who uses a laptop for gaming, my $1000 laptop is infinitely superior to a $6000 Macbook Pro (for the games that I play). For almost every other use, the Macbook Pro is likely far superior! If you do Final Cut or Xcode work, these are the best tool available to you.
- smoldesu 5y ago
  Yep, I reached pretty much the same conclusion as Dave: these are machines for very specific people running very specific software. Apple got their wish: they made the computer disappear, and now the Macbook Pro is a tool. For better or worse, this is the best way to experience the Apple ecosystem. But also, if you're a developer without any interest in Apple (and maybe someone who wants to play games), the case for using Linux for general-purpose computing is stronger than ever. It will be interesting to see how Apple addresses their own issues in MacOS over the next few months, I've really got my fingers crossed for Vulkan support or 32-bit libraries making a return.
- throwawaywindev 5y ago
  Yea, I originally ordered an M1 Max model after the presentation, then cancelled it when I realized for what I would use a GPU for (gaming and 3D development) a RTX 3080 laptop would be a much better choice. I also don’t care about performance/watt as much since I use my iPad for non-work stuff. But the technology nerd in me still wants to buy one for completely irrational reasons.
  - kzrdude 5y ago
    Me too. I really want an M1* mac but I also realize that I just want to run Linux, so it's kind of pointless right now (I'm not a Linux kernel level developer, so yeah).
- garbagecoder 5y ago
hajile 5y ago
AMD 5950x $750 Nvidia RTX 3060 $750 midrange x570 Motherboard $300 Samsung 980 pro 2TB $370 64GB DDR5 $700 decent 24" display $400 Case, keyboard, mouse, cooling $400 That's $3670 -- If I build it myself. I'd expect to pay much more from a big box store for a prebuilt. A new 14" MacBook with M1 Max, 2TB SSD, and 64GB of RAM is around $4100. That's a great deal IMO
- gigatexal 5y ago
  And it's portable with a high dpi screen and 120hz refresh.
  - kitsunesoba 5y ago
    > …with a high dpi screen and 120hz refresh Having shopped it recently, the desktop monitor market is abysmal right now. To get a monitor remotely comparable to the new MBP internal displays you're looking at spending $3k on one of a tiny handful of FALD displays which run hot enough to need a fan and have worse DPI, or rearranging your desk setup to accommodate a 48" LG OLED TV which is subject to burnin with serious usage. Apple can't release those lower-priced 27" displays that've been rumored soon enough.
    - _ph_ 5y ago
      I hope the next large iMac is at least a little bit above 27", after all, the entry-level one went from 21.5 to 24". A 30" iMac with mini-led and 120Hz would be just too sweet.
      - kitsunesoba 5y ago
        That would be pretty great, but unless they restore display passthrough capabilities with the M-series 27"+ iMacs, I'm really hoping for a standalone display that can be used both with a laptop and the rumored upcoming "Mac Pro Mini"/G4 Cube MKII.
        5y ago
heresaPizza 5y ago
These MacBooks are definitely worth the money. They cost a lot but they are not overpriced. You don’t have to consider just the CPU and GPU but the whole SoC. CPU is impressive and GPU is good, but for standard workloads some PCs may give you slightly better performances (on the GPU side), at the cost of needing the power adapter to show that. However, for some specific workloads (especially the ones involving ProRaw video) the custom modules in it make it perform better not only than a Mac Pro, but than every other machine in the market. There is also the Neural Engine that could be more important in the future. You may not need those modules, but it seems like we are forgetting this are laptops with screens, inputs and more. These machines have one of the best screens, with high DPI, high refresh rate but most important the miniLED technology which brings true HDR. And that’s something very pricey. Far from defending Apple, they could sell this laptops for less and we would all be happier, but at the end of the day these machines are worthy in every aspect (specific cases aside).
- fomine3 5y ago
  Displays are often undervalued part on Mac. Sometimes it's significantly cheaper than available on market, or can't buy. Example: MBP Retina 15/13 2012, iMac 5K 2015, MBP miniLED 2021. A problem is that such great display is bundled even if don't need.
pohl 5y ago
Years ago I read someone express the maxim "the computer you want is always around $5k". This has stuck with me. It's been approximately true throughout my life.
paxys 5y ago
Completely depends on what your use case is. For me personally a desktop + mid-range laptop combo is cheaper, more powerful and an all-round better fit than a single $2K+ laptop (which realistically will become $3K+ after adding a few options).

cududa 5y ago

Depends what you need them for. On a music video set my 2010 MBP survived a drop from a second story balcony (three stories in a normal home), onto a marble floor. Got dented as hell, but only functional damage was to the ethernet port. I'm excited to get one of these new ones. Imagine it'll last at least 5 years.

mrtranscendence 5y ago

They're definitely pricey, but CPU performance is out of this world. GPU's pretty good too, though not as impressive, I understand. Alas, it'll probably be a few years before I can get one (I use my work machine for almost everything and I just got this one).

f6v 5y ago
It’s not that GPU isn’t impressive. Rather that you can’t put it to use in games.
- mrtranscendence 5y ago
  Fair enough! It doesn't really bother me either way, since I don't really make use of the GPU on my laptop. Curious to try out Tensorflow on one of the new machines, though.
  - rezahussain 5y ago
    Yes, I just want to see some tensorflow specific benchmarks on the m1 max with 32 gpu cores vs 3080.

f6v 5y ago

They’re also compact, well-built(keyboards are fixed now) and with good battery life. Last time I was shopping, I found direct competition(XPS 13 and the likes) to be about the same price.

OldHand2018 5y ago
Oh absolutely, they're great. My last MacBook Pro was around $2500 or $3000, if I remember correctly, and it was a very good price for what you got. Don't think that I'm being overly negative here. These look like outstanding computers that are worth a premium price. My question here is about how much of a premium and I'm not trying to give an opinion with a question - I really don't know the answer :)

neogodless 5y ago

I liked Dave2D's (youtube) take on this. They are tools. If you have specific workloads that these excel at in your job/hobby/money-making venture, then the price shouldn't be a concern. Depending on workload, they are comparable to $1000 PC laptops in CPU performance... or $3000 PCs. Or PCs that don't exist yet! As someone who uses a laptop for gaming, my $1000 laptop is infinitely superior to a $6000 Macbook Pro (for the games that I play). For almost every other use, the Macbook Pro is likely far superior! If you do Final Cut or Xcode work, these are the best tool available to you.

smoldesu 5y ago
Yep, I reached pretty much the same conclusion as Dave: these are machines for very specific people running very specific software. Apple got their wish: they made the computer disappear, and now the Macbook Pro is a tool. For better or worse, this is the best way to experience the Apple ecosystem. But also, if you're a developer without any interest in Apple (and maybe someone who wants to play games), the case for using Linux for general-purpose computing is stronger than ever. It will be interesting to see how Apple addresses their own issues in MacOS over the next few months, I've really got my fingers crossed for Vulkan support or 32-bit libraries making a return.
throwawaywindev 5y ago
Yea, I originally ordered an M1 Max model after the presentation, then cancelled it when I realized for what I would use a GPU for (gaming and 3D development) a RTX 3080 laptop would be a much better choice. I also don’t care about performance/watt as much since I use my iPad for non-work stuff. But the technology nerd in me still wants to buy one for completely irrational reasons.
- kzrdude 5y ago
  Me too. I really want an M1* mac but I also realize that I just want to run Linux, so it's kind of pointless right now (I'm not a Linux kernel level developer, so yeah).
garbagecoder 5y ago

hajile 5y ago

AMD 5950x $750 Nvidia RTX 3060 $750 midrange x570 Motherboard $300 Samsung 980 pro 2TB $370 64GB DDR5 $700 decent 24" display $400 Case, keyboard, mouse, cooling $400 That's $3670 -- If I build it myself. I'd expect to pay much more from a big box store for a prebuilt. A new 14" MacBook with M1 Max, 2TB SSD, and 64GB of RAM is around $4100. That's a great deal IMO

gigatexal 5y ago
And it's portable with a high dpi screen and 120hz refresh.
- kitsunesoba 5y ago
  > …with a high dpi screen and 120hz refresh Having shopped it recently, the desktop monitor market is abysmal right now. To get a monitor remotely comparable to the new MBP internal displays you're looking at spending $3k on one of a tiny handful of FALD displays which run hot enough to need a fan and have worse DPI, or rearranging your desk setup to accommodate a 48" LG OLED TV which is subject to burnin with serious usage. Apple can't release those lower-priced 27" displays that've been rumored soon enough.
  - _ph_ 5y ago
    I hope the next large iMac is at least a little bit above 27", after all, the entry-level one went from 21.5 to 24". A 30" iMac with mini-led and 120Hz would be just too sweet.
    - kitsunesoba 5y ago
      That would be pretty great, but unless they restore display passthrough capabilities with the M-series 27"+ iMacs, I'm really hoping for a standalone display that can be used both with a laptop and the rumored upcoming "Mac Pro Mini"/G4 Cube MKII.
      - 5y ago

heresaPizza 5y ago

These MacBooks are definitely worth the money. They cost a lot but they are not overpriced. You don’t have to consider just the CPU and GPU but the whole SoC. CPU is impressive and GPU is good, but for standard workloads some PCs may give you slightly better performances (on the GPU side), at the cost of needing the power adapter to show that. However, for some specific workloads (especially the ones involving ProRaw video) the custom modules in it make it perform better not only than a Mac Pro, but than every other machine in the market. There is also the Neural Engine that could be more important in the future. You may not need those modules, but it seems like we are forgetting this are laptops with screens, inputs and more. These machines have one of the best screens, with high DPI, high refresh rate but most important the miniLED technology which brings true HDR. And that’s something very pricey. Far from defending Apple, they could sell this laptops for less and we would all be happier, but at the end of the day these machines are worthy in every aspect (specific cases aside).

fomine3 5y ago
Displays are often undervalued part on Mac. Sometimes it's significantly cheaper than available on market, or can't buy. Example: MBP Retina 15/13 2012, iMac 5K 2015, MBP miniLED 2021. A problem is that such great display is bundled even if don't need.

pohl 5y ago

Years ago I read someone express the maxim "the computer you want is always around $5k". This has stuck with me. It's been approximately true throughout my life.

paxys 5y ago

Completely depends on what your use case is. For me personally a desktop + mid-range laptop combo is cheaper, more powerful and an all-round better fit than a single $2K+ laptop (which realistically will become $3K+ after adding a few options).