4 ms·

Honestly, and completely anecdotally, having been raised Catholic I would expect it to result in quite the opposite when so much of the doctrine is based on gui

by Grimm1 5y ago

Honestly, and completely anecdotally, having been raised Catholic I would expect it to result in quite the opposite when so much of the doctrine is based on guilt. That said before anyone jumps on me, also anecdotally, I haven't found any greater life satisfaction by not being religious either. You do you. The article says the study suggests there's not a really strong causal relationship in either way which surprises me a little but yeah I can see it given the experience. And If I were to find religion suddenly again now I imagine it may only increase life satisfaction based on the fact I have no real community at the moment and that I think is probably a more interesting study. How much has external community (i.e. not close friends, partners and families) breakdown occurred over the last 40 years and what is the effect on our life satisfaction? My grandfather was a part of a bunch of men's clubs etc last I checked most of those are floundering now.

phkahler 5y ago
Aside from that Catholic guilt and community aspects, people like to feel hope and purpose. Religious beliefs can offer both of those. I do like to point out that this effect will take place regardless of the truth of the belief system, so paint yourself a picture that brings "meaning" to your life however you want - as long as it's something you can actually believe ;-)
- Grimm1 5y ago
  Yes, hope and purpose are important. I like existentialism and cling hard to thought of being able to define that belief system myself and what purpose I have from it. That said as of late, after years I seem to be going through a bit of a dark night of the soul with that chosen system, to borrow more from religious terminology. I guess one of the downsides of forming my own belief system versus religion is it's bedrock is just a wee bit younger and potentially less well formed as I've been learning. Back to the drawing board :P
AnimalMuppet 5y ago
Not all religious experience are based so much on guilt. There are strains of Protestantism where the emphasis is much more on grace.
- jawns 5y ago
  I'm Catholic, and although I acknowledge that many of my coreligionists have felt it, even to the point where "Catholic guilt" has its own Wikipedia entry, my experience is the opposite. It is through my faith that I have felt relieved from my guilt. Some people say that Catholicism makes them feel guilty for things they otherwise wouldn't feel guilty about, but for me, the recognition that I've sinned is apparent apart from whatever the Church might teach, but it is through the grace of the sacraments that I am relieved of that guilt.
  - throwuxiytayq 5y ago
    There is something about Christian people's writing that always activates my "wait, was this written by GPT-3?" alarm bell. More on the topic, most Christians I know seem (and admit to being) profoundly unhappy. Perhaps they weren't dosing their sacraments correctly.
- cercatrova 5y ago
  What is grace in this context?
  - AnimalMuppet 5y ago
    I have done what is wrong in God's sight, according to His law. For that, I justly deserve His condemnation. That's guilt. Grace is, even though I deserved God's justice and wrath, Jesus Christ died in my place, taking the judgment I deserved, and offering me forgiveness instead, which I totally did not deserve. That's grace.
lcall 5y ago
Specifically WRT community, I saw this today: https://www.thechurchnews.com/living-faith/2021-10-25/national-survey-latter-day-saints-deeper-feelings-community-trust-connection-230453 https://www.thechurchnews.com/living-faith/2021-10-25/nation... ...which talks about community trust and whether different groups believe that others in their neighborhood would be willing to help out, and resonates with my neighborhood experiences while living in various different places, including among those of other/no faiths. Edit: My personal experience and observation has also been that those active and devoted in my faith have much greater success in solving the inevitable problems of life, and having united multigenerational families, than those who choose other paths (but we still love them). And that increased devotion correlates with increased education, and with success in having a stable life with ability to help others. (So many examples...)

by Grimm1 5y ago

phkahler 5y ago

Aside from that Catholic guilt and community aspects, people like to feel hope and purpose. Religious beliefs can offer both of those. I do like to point out that this effect will take place regardless of the truth of the belief system, so paint yourself a picture that brings "meaning" to your life however you want - as long as it's something you can actually believe ;-)

Grimm1 5y ago
Yes, hope and purpose are important. I like existentialism and cling hard to thought of being able to define that belief system myself and what purpose I have from it. That said as of late, after years I seem to be going through a bit of a dark night of the soul with that chosen system, to borrow more from religious terminology. I guess one of the downsides of forming my own belief system versus religion is it's bedrock is just a wee bit younger and potentially less well formed as I've been learning. Back to the drawing board :P

AnimalMuppet 5y ago

Not all religious experience are based so much on guilt. There are strains of Protestantism where the emphasis is much more on grace.

jawns 5y ago
I'm Catholic, and although I acknowledge that many of my coreligionists have felt it, even to the point where "Catholic guilt" has its own Wikipedia entry, my experience is the opposite. It is through my faith that I have felt relieved from my guilt. Some people say that Catholicism makes them feel guilty for things they otherwise wouldn't feel guilty about, but for me, the recognition that I've sinned is apparent apart from whatever the Church might teach, but it is through the grace of the sacraments that I am relieved of that guilt.
- throwuxiytayq 5y ago
  There is something about Christian people's writing that always activates my "wait, was this written by GPT-3?" alarm bell. More on the topic, most Christians I know seem (and admit to being) profoundly unhappy. Perhaps they weren't dosing their sacraments correctly.
cercatrova 5y ago
What is grace in this context?
- AnimalMuppet 5y ago
  I have done what is wrong in God's sight, according to His law. For that, I justly deserve His condemnation. That's guilt. Grace is, even though I deserved God's justice and wrath, Jesus Christ died in my place, taking the judgment I deserved, and offering me forgiveness instead, which I totally did not deserve. That's grace.

lcall 5y ago

Specifically WRT community, I saw this today: https://www.thechurchnews.com/living-faith/2021-10-25/national-survey-latter-day-saints-deeper-feelings-community-trust-connection-230453 https://www.thechurchnews.com/living-faith/2021-10-25/nation... ...which talks about community trust and whether different groups believe that others in their neighborhood would be willing to help out, and resonates with my neighborhood experiences while living in various different places, including among those of other/no faiths. Edit: My personal experience and observation has also been that those active and devoted in my faith have much greater success in solving the inevitable problems of life, and having united multigenerational families, than those who choose other paths (but we still love them). And that increased devotion correlates with increased education, and with success in having a stable life with ability to help others. (So many examples...)