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Yes it will be just like the good old times! When your favorite local feudal lord forced you and your family to stay living on his property. And picked your p

Yes it will be just like the good old times! When your favorite local feudal lord forced you and your family to stay living on his property. And picked your profession for you and your descendants. Oh and going to church was mandatory, and paying tithes was required by law. I think maybe I'll take the corporations instead. :-)

davesque 5y ago
It's funny how you assume I was suggesting that we should go backward in time. No, I'm just saying there's clearly something wrong with sanctifying our will to power in the form of corporations. Great, so we've figured out a way to move money very efficiently into the hands of a few people in a way that is self reinforcing and sucks the life out of everything. Check. Mustn't there be a way to move forward into the future and discover newer and better ways of structuring society in a way that is more interesting?
- foobarian 5y ago
  I apologize if I implied that, admittedly it came off as a bit of a strawman. It's just something that's been on my mind lately in part due to issues with the current power structure. But you are right, if we managed to move from the feudal to current system, why should it not be possible to find something even better? On the other hand I figure there needs to be a relief valve for the kinds of people that enjoy being feudal lords, and the corporations provide that right now. Perhaps something even better can be devised but it needs to be done because that type of person will always exist.
  - davesque 5y ago
    > it needs to be done because that type of person will always exist. Could be. Though I wonder if this is really true. It might do to think of a counterexample; something that people once thought would always exist but has effectively been eliminated. I'll leave that as an exercise to all the readers I guess.
Zababa 5y ago
What difference do you make between corporations and your "local feudal lord"?
aviancrane 5y ago
You have more freedom now, but that doesn't mean you are free. And the lack of freedom does not mean you should go back in time to when you were less free. The truth is that your choices are determined by your options; in the past those options were determined by your feudal lord, and now they're determined by which corporate datastreams you choose to ingest. We are freer now to create a pool of many more options, and the competitiveness of some markets forces corporations to give better options than the monopolies of the past. But you still will be left with little choice if you passively ingest the data you receive, especially as corporations invest in AI to both identify options you will like as well as funnel you into self-feeding culture bubbles in order to make you more predictable... for their profit. I think you have to make actions which collect as many options as possible, analyzing what you receive from corporations, and choosing to also consider which non-corporate options are available to you with your surplus of money and freedom that those in the past didn't have.
throwaway888877 5y ago
Yes the only choices are 12th century serfdom or corporations. :-)
JasonCannon 5y ago
Yes because everyone knows, the only alternative to Corporation driven capitalism is Feudalism. Which is totally different than Corporations guys. Nevermind the fact that the earliest corporations and the founders of a lot of economic thought accepted by Liberals (as in Liberalism the ideology shared by both parties in the US) were in fact Nobles during Feudal times who adopted Capitalism to maintain their power.

davesque 5y ago

It's funny how you assume I was suggesting that we should go backward in time. No, I'm just saying there's clearly something wrong with sanctifying our will to power in the form of corporations. Great, so we've figured out a way to move money very efficiently into the hands of a few people in a way that is self reinforcing and sucks the life out of everything. Check. Mustn't there be a way to move forward into the future and discover newer and better ways of structuring society in a way that is more interesting?

foobarian 5y ago
I apologize if I implied that, admittedly it came off as a bit of a strawman. It's just something that's been on my mind lately in part due to issues with the current power structure. But you are right, if we managed to move from the feudal to current system, why should it not be possible to find something even better? On the other hand I figure there needs to be a relief valve for the kinds of people that enjoy being feudal lords, and the corporations provide that right now. Perhaps something even better can be devised but it needs to be done because that type of person will always exist.
- davesque 5y ago
  > it needs to be done because that type of person will always exist. Could be. Though I wonder if this is really true. It might do to think of a counterexample; something that people once thought would always exist but has effectively been eliminated. I'll leave that as an exercise to all the readers I guess.

Zababa 5y ago

What difference do you make between corporations and your "local feudal lord"?

aviancrane 5y ago

You have more freedom now, but that doesn't mean you are free. And the lack of freedom does not mean you should go back in time to when you were less free. The truth is that your choices are determined by your options; in the past those options were determined by your feudal lord, and now they're determined by which corporate datastreams you choose to ingest. We are freer now to create a pool of many more options, and the competitiveness of some markets forces corporations to give better options than the monopolies of the past. But you still will be left with little choice if you passively ingest the data you receive, especially as corporations invest in AI to both identify options you will like as well as funnel you into self-feeding culture bubbles in order to make you more predictable... for their profit. I think you have to make actions which collect as many options as possible, analyzing what you receive from corporations, and choosing to also consider which non-corporate options are available to you with your surplus of money and freedom that those in the past didn't have.

throwaway888877 5y ago

Yes the only choices are 12th century serfdom or corporations. :-)

JasonCannon 5y ago

Yes because everyone knows, the only alternative to Corporation driven capitalism is Feudalism. Which is totally different than Corporations guys. Nevermind the fact that the earliest corporations and the founders of a lot of economic thought accepted by Liberals (as in Liberalism the ideology shared by both parties in the US) were in fact Nobles during Feudal times who adopted Capitalism to maintain their power.