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> Apple gets the exact same information for transactions completed with Apple Pay. Users have to opt in for Google to see this information. Once again, exactly

> Apple gets the exact same information for transactions completed with Apple Pay. Users have to opt in for Google to see this information. Once again, exactly the same. Nope. >Google has been able to track your location using Google Maps for a long time. Since 2014, it has used that information to provide advertisers with information on how often people visit their stores. But store visits aren’t purchases, so, as Google said in a blog post on its new service for marketers, it has partnered with “third parties” that give them access to 70 percent of all credit and debit card purchases. https://www.technologyreview.com/2017/05/25/242717/google-now-tracks-your-credit-card-purchases-and-connects-them-to-its-online-profile-of-you/ https://www.technologyreview.com/2017/05/25/242717/google-no... Buying a copy of everyone's credit card transaction data, no matter who they bank through, is not even close to the same. >I don't have to use Google services on Android. iOS ties me to Apple's privacy nightmare. Nope. Apple's cloud service is every bit as optional as Google's. The difference is that Google has been scanning everything in Google accounts for the past decade. Google and Facebook, as the pioneers of surveillance capitalism, are both privacy nightmares.

lern_too_spel 5y ago
> Nope. Yep. > Buying a copy of everyone's credit card transaction data, no matter who they bank through, is not even close to the same. As I already explained, the user has to opt in to share that data with Google. The purchase is a deal with the credit card companies to send data that users have opted in to share. https://support.google.com/googlepay/answer/10845853?hl=en https://support.google.com/googlepay/answer/10845853?hl=en > Nope. Apple's cloud service is every bit as optional as Google's. You completely ignored my post explaining why they are not. To repeat myself from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28933939 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28933939: "You cannot even install an app on your device without giving Apple your billing details and letting them know you installed it, which is used for ads. You cannot get your location without also telling it to Apple. You cannot tell Apple not to track your WiFi SSID's location. You cannot uninstall Apple News, which is filled with user tracking for ads. On and on." Apple, Google, and Facebook are all privacy nightmares. The difference is that iOS forces that privacy nightmare on its users, while Android does not. Your comparison of Apple to Google is as irrelevant as it is incorrect.
- GeekyBear 5y ago
  >As I already explained, the user has to opt in to share that data with Google. As I have already explained, this has nothing to do with Google Pay whatsoever. It doesn't matter who issues your card. Google made deals directly with Visa and Mastercard to buy your transaction data. >as Google said in a blog post on its new service for marketers, it has partnered with “third parties” that give them access to 70 percent of all credit and debit card purchases. Google has gone from spying on everything you do online, to spying on your offline behavior as well. As for the rest of your errors. I'm afraid that I'm not willing to take the time to correct them individually.
  - lern_too_spel 5y ago
    > Google has gone from spying on everything you do online, to spying on your offline behavior as well. That is about aggregate purchases, which have no privacy implications at all, not about individual purchases, which need to be matched either by email or by users opting in to share their credit card transactions, which is exactly the same as Apple Pay. > Also, how exactly do you use the Google Play Store without having a Google account? You don't have to use Google Play to install apps on Android. Even if you use Google Pay, you don't have to completely de-anonymize yourself with billing details. > I'm afraid that I'm not willing to take the time to correct them individually. More like you're afraid that you cannot correct them because they are already correct. I have made those claims hundreds of times on this forum, and they have never been corrected. You have simply fallen for Apple's marketing without critically thinking about what data Apple actually collects, and the embarrassment of overpaying for an ecosystem that is clearly worse has understandably caused you to become defensive. The takeaway is to not trust marketing and verify if what the marketing actually claims is true. None of these companies are looking out for you. If Apple can make more money by exploiting your privacy on top of getting you to pay more, they will do it, and they are doing it (why actually make a privacy-respecting product that ties Apple's hands when they can just have the marketing department claim that it's a privacy respecting product and have their cake and eat it too). The only reason Android has gotten away with less user exploitation is that Google is still not yet as top-down driven as Apple, so the hackers who work on Android can influence how the base system is made while just enabling the company's services teams to build what they want on top of that instead of directly into the base system, and the only reason Google still lets them get away with that is that Android initially had to be released as AOSP + vendor bits in order to bring other companies into the ecosystem, and it is now too expensive to change course.

lern_too_spel 5y ago

> Nope. Yep. > Buying a copy of everyone's credit card transaction data, no matter who they bank through, is not even close to the same. As I already explained, the user has to opt in to share that data with Google. The purchase is a deal with the credit card companies to send data that users have opted in to share. https://support.google.com/googlepay/answer/10845853?hl=en https://support.google.com/googlepay/answer/10845853?hl=en > Nope. Apple's cloud service is every bit as optional as Google's. You completely ignored my post explaining why they are not. To repeat myself from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28933939 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28933939: "You cannot even install an app on your device without giving Apple your billing details and letting them know you installed it, which is used for ads. You cannot get your location without also telling it to Apple. You cannot tell Apple not to track your WiFi SSID's location. You cannot uninstall Apple News, which is filled with user tracking for ads. On and on." Apple, Google, and Facebook are all privacy nightmares. The difference is that iOS forces that privacy nightmare on its users, while Android does not. Your comparison of Apple to Google is as irrelevant as it is incorrect.

GeekyBear 5y ago
>As I already explained, the user has to opt in to share that data with Google. As I have already explained, this has nothing to do with Google Pay whatsoever. It doesn't matter who issues your card. Google made deals directly with Visa and Mastercard to buy your transaction data. >as Google said in a blog post on its new service for marketers, it has partnered with “third parties” that give them access to 70 percent of all credit and debit card purchases. Google has gone from spying on everything you do online, to spying on your offline behavior as well. As for the rest of your errors. I'm afraid that I'm not willing to take the time to correct them individually.
- lern_too_spel 5y ago
  > Google has gone from spying on everything you do online, to spying on your offline behavior as well. That is about aggregate purchases, which have no privacy implications at all, not about individual purchases, which need to be matched either by email or by users opting in to share their credit card transactions, which is exactly the same as Apple Pay. > Also, how exactly do you use the Google Play Store without having a Google account? You don't have to use Google Play to install apps on Android. Even if you use Google Pay, you don't have to completely de-anonymize yourself with billing details. > I'm afraid that I'm not willing to take the time to correct them individually. More like you're afraid that you cannot correct them because they are already correct. I have made those claims hundreds of times on this forum, and they have never been corrected. You have simply fallen for Apple's marketing without critically thinking about what data Apple actually collects, and the embarrassment of overpaying for an ecosystem that is clearly worse has understandably caused you to become defensive. The takeaway is to not trust marketing and verify if what the marketing actually claims is true. None of these companies are looking out for you. If Apple can make more money by exploiting your privacy on top of getting you to pay more, they will do it, and they are doing it (why actually make a privacy-respecting product that ties Apple's hands when they can just have the marketing department claim that it's a privacy respecting product and have their cake and eat it too). The only reason Android has gotten away with less user exploitation is that Google is still not yet as top-down driven as Apple, so the hackers who work on Android can influence how the base system is made while just enabling the company's services teams to build what they want on top of that instead of directly into the base system, and the only reason Google still lets them get away with that is that Android initially had to be released as AOSP + vendor bits in order to bring other companies into the ecosystem, and it is now too expensive to change course.