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There is hardly any knowledge of human physiology behind most of the answers, just like the question was "what exercises do you like" and not "exercises for so

by stiff 15y ago

There is hardly any knowledge of human physiology behind most of the answers, just like the question was "what exercises do you like" and not "exercises for someone sitting by the PC all day". Sitting at a desk for 8+ hours tends to cause various posture problems through shortening and chronic contraction of some muscle groups (e.g. hip flexors) and weakening of others (e. g. glutes). Especially cycling strikes me as a bizarre recommendation, I would say 2 hours of cycling has the same effect on posture as 8 additional hours of sitting at the desk. The recommendation to do bench presses is a great way to further round ones already rounded (from all the sitting at the keyboard) shoulders. Swimming is great, but not everyone has warm weather all year long or likes swimming pools. For someone looking for gym exercises for people with desk-bound jobs I would recommend this more: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/deconstructing_computer_guy http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai... http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/deconstructing_computer_guy_the_other_23_hours http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai...

dbingham 15y ago
So why don't you go post a better answer?
beaumartinez 15y ago
Regarding flexibility and the problems of the office chair, don't forget the third-world squat![1] Also, you don't have to be sitting to cycle—I assume this is why you mention that two hours of cycling is akin to eight hours of sitting at the office chair? [1] http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/the_thirdworld_squat http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai...
- stiff 15y ago
  Even if you don't sit, you still have to be bent over to some degree, both in the hips and in the shoulders (to reach out for the handlebar), which is a position physiologically similar to sitting in front of a computer (sitting in a chair and reaching out for the keyboard). Also, the actual activity of cycling tends to stress the hip flexors, which are often already chronically contracted due to prolonged sitting and doesn't activate glutes that much (unless you use those cycling shoes which make the upward movement of the feet contribute to the bicycle movement as well). This is exactly the opposite of the pattern of activity that people with sedentary lifestyles need. This imbalance of muscular tension that I'm talking about results in very posture problems, like the anterior pelvic tilt - http://healthhabits.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/anterior-pelvic-tilt2.png http://healthhabits.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/anterior-pel...
  - steven5122 15y ago
    You're obviously well educated on the subject. I agree with what you're saying. That's why my recommendation above was to do Bootstrapping Squats (at first), bench, deadlifts and chins -- just the basics. You especially want to strengthen the Posterior Chain (hamstrings, glutes, lower back) and Bootstrapper Squats are a simple way to get started. There's a great book called Starting Strength that gives a basic starting program.
steven5122 15y ago
Some of the exercises in the links you give are okay. Front squats are an especially advanced exercise--a lot harder than they look. And bench presses won't give you rounded shoulders. I'd recommend Bootstrapper Squats (google it) or regular barbell squats, bench press, shoulder press, deadlifts and chins. Riding a bike is an excellent warmup for your knees prior to doing any kind of leg work.
- stiff 15y ago
  And bench presses won't give you rounded shoulders. Healthy shoulders are a result of a balance between the static tension of the upper back muscles and the chest muscles. If you already have rounded shoulders, it means that the chest muscles are too strong and too contracted, while the upper back muscles too weak. That's why a personal trainer or a doctor will prescribe regular _stretching_ of the chest muscles as part of a treatment for this condition. If you're healthy, then bench pressing won't give you rounded shoulders, provided that you balance the training appropriately with upper back exercises. But the point is that people with sedentary lifestyles tend to have their chest muscles already chronically contracted from the posture they keep for most of the day, so they should first work on stretching the chest muscles and strengthening the upper back. When their posture is balanced again, they can workout normally, balancing bench pressing with rowing exercises.
- dredmorbius 15y ago
  I've got to disagree with a bunch of this. Front squats are a little tricky (balance and flexibility in both hips and arms/wrists matter), but as with any movement, starting light (prop or unloaded bar) isn't going to hurt anyone (well, anyone who's not already hurt or missing body parts). I just looked up Boostrap Squats. Not sold, but Dan John is a solid guy. Cycling's OK for lower body, but I'd pick erging (indoor rowing) for a better whole-body warm-up. Huge fan of the basic Rippetoe movements: squats, deads, bench, press (a/k/a shoulder press), chins, rows, and power cleans.
freiheit 15y ago
I'm one of the people that suggested cycling there. A few points: * Post a better answer. If others agree it's better it'll get upvoted and go higher on the page. * The question itself has essentially no details. Current problems? Things they've tried? What they might like? What kind of chair they sit in. No hints at all. * You're prematurely optimizing. Many programmers and other computer professionals sit inside at a desk all day and get no exercise. Almost anything at all that gets them moving is an improvement. The top answer is pretty much "get outside and do any exercise" with suggestions for some of the more accessible choices. Most of those are more likely than getting somebody to go to a gym or doing more complicated specific exercises. Once they start doing any exercise at all you can worry about the specifics of which and how much, etc. * Part of the suggestion was commuting by bicycle, so replacing time sitting in a car or on a bus with time riding a bicycle * Cycling with good posture uses your glutes and increases (or at least requires) hip flexor and hamstring flexibility. Uses much of the core muscles in the back that many programmers have problems with. The stationary bikes pictured in one of your links don't look like they allow a proper cycling posture at all. They're set up for people that don't know how to ride a bike right so that they don't put too much weight on their hands. You might be right about 2 hours pedaling away on one of those. Definitely very anecdotal, but I work in an office with a decent percentage of bicycle commuters. The cyclists aren't the ones that keep having back problems. (it's the ones that don't exercise at all, or don't stick with exercise)
- stiff 15y ago
  You're prematurely optimizing. Someone asked for activities good for computer people. You didn't answer "any activity", but "cycling". Now when I say cycling is actually bad for many computer people, you say I'm prematurely optimizing? Because I try to answer the actual question meaningfully? Many programmers and other computer professionals sit inside at a desk all day and get no exercise. Almost anything at all that gets them moving is an improvement. It's not. If you do an activity with a certain pattern of impact on the body for 8+ hours a day, doing another activity with the same pattern for additional 2 hours a day yet with increased intensity has the potential to cause serious health problems and discourage people from activity in general. If you're about to choose a sport and do not so much care about what will it be, why not make a choice that will be the most beneficial health-wise? I think that's was the whole point of the question asked. Cycling with good posture uses your glutes and increases (or at least requires) hip flexor and hamstring flexibility. I don't know why do you mention flexibility here, the posture problems come not from flexibility issues but from the muscle tone of opposing muscle groups. It is also simply not true what you are saying, just think about the main function of the hip flexors - pulling the knee up, and the function of the glutes - rotating the pelvis; then think which of those two actions is more common in cycling and to which degree. The hip flexors get contracted all the time and thus shortened, not flexed. Uses much of the core muscles in the back that many programmers have problems with. It's exactly the same as with hip flexors, the bend-over posture tends to stress the erector spinae that is already very tight and contracted from all the sitting, and does nothing to work out the abdominals which are too weak. Post a better answer. If others agree it's better it'll get upvoted and go higher on the page. I do not feel an expert on the topic, I am not a member of the fitness stackexchange community, and this is a four month old post. If I was to answer the question, I would recommend classic swimming, because it is beneficial to the posture even if your technique isn't perfect. There are other good choices, but they require more guidance. Yoga is great, because it actually teaches you to locate and be aware of the various tensions in your body accumulated during the day and helps relax those. Wisely selected exercises in the gym or callisthenics are good as well, but a lot of people have those posture problems and muscular imbalances, and when working out on their own they might not have enough knowledge to address them by an appropriate workout on their own (apart from the fact that most people don't know how to squat or deadlift in a way that is not detrimental to health in the long run). That's why in this case hiring a good personal trainer might be a good investment if you have the money and are serious about improving your health.

by stiff 15y ago

dbingham 15y ago

So why don't you go post a better answer?

beaumartinez 15y ago

Regarding flexibility and the problems of the office chair, don't forget the third-world squat![1] Also, you don't have to be sitting to cycle—I assume this is why you mention that two hours of cycling is akin to eight hours of sitting at the office chair? [1] http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_training_performance/the_thirdworld_squat http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/sports_body_trai...

stiff 15y ago
Even if you don't sit, you still have to be bent over to some degree, both in the hips and in the shoulders (to reach out for the handlebar), which is a position physiologically similar to sitting in front of a computer (sitting in a chair and reaching out for the keyboard). Also, the actual activity of cycling tends to stress the hip flexors, which are often already chronically contracted due to prolonged sitting and doesn't activate glutes that much (unless you use those cycling shoes which make the upward movement of the feet contribute to the bicycle movement as well). This is exactly the opposite of the pattern of activity that people with sedentary lifestyles need. This imbalance of muscular tension that I'm talking about results in very posture problems, like the anterior pelvic tilt - http://healthhabits.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/anterior-pelvic-tilt2.png http://healthhabits.files.wordpress.com/2008/05/anterior-pel...
- steven5122 15y ago
  You're obviously well educated on the subject. I agree with what you're saying. That's why my recommendation above was to do Bootstrapping Squats (at first), bench, deadlifts and chins -- just the basics. You especially want to strengthen the Posterior Chain (hamstrings, glutes, lower back) and Bootstrapper Squats are a simple way to get started. There's a great book called Starting Strength that gives a basic starting program.

steven5122 15y ago

Some of the exercises in the links you give are okay. Front squats are an especially advanced exercise--a lot harder than they look. And bench presses won't give you rounded shoulders. I'd recommend Bootstrapper Squats (google it) or regular barbell squats, bench press, shoulder press, deadlifts and chins. Riding a bike is an excellent warmup for your knees prior to doing any kind of leg work.

stiff 15y ago
And bench presses won't give you rounded shoulders. Healthy shoulders are a result of a balance between the static tension of the upper back muscles and the chest muscles. If you already have rounded shoulders, it means that the chest muscles are too strong and too contracted, while the upper back muscles too weak. That's why a personal trainer or a doctor will prescribe regular _stretching_ of the chest muscles as part of a treatment for this condition. If you're healthy, then bench pressing won't give you rounded shoulders, provided that you balance the training appropriately with upper back exercises. But the point is that people with sedentary lifestyles tend to have their chest muscles already chronically contracted from the posture they keep for most of the day, so they should first work on stretching the chest muscles and strengthening the upper back. When their posture is balanced again, they can workout normally, balancing bench pressing with rowing exercises.
dredmorbius 15y ago
I've got to disagree with a bunch of this. Front squats are a little tricky (balance and flexibility in both hips and arms/wrists matter), but as with any movement, starting light (prop or unloaded bar) isn't going to hurt anyone (well, anyone who's not already hurt or missing body parts). I just looked up Boostrap Squats. Not sold, but Dan John is a solid guy. Cycling's OK for lower body, but I'd pick erging (indoor rowing) for a better whole-body warm-up. Huge fan of the basic Rippetoe movements: squats, deads, bench, press (a/k/a shoulder press), chins, rows, and power cleans.

freiheit 15y ago

I'm one of the people that suggested cycling there. A few points: * Post a better answer. If others agree it's better it'll get upvoted and go higher on the page. * The question itself has essentially no details. Current problems? Things they've tried? What they might like? What kind of chair they sit in. No hints at all. * You're prematurely optimizing. Many programmers and other computer professionals sit inside at a desk all day and get no exercise. Almost anything at all that gets them moving is an improvement. The top answer is pretty much "get outside and do any exercise" with suggestions for some of the more accessible choices. Most of those are more likely than getting somebody to go to a gym or doing more complicated specific exercises. Once they start doing any exercise at all you can worry about the specifics of which and how much, etc. * Part of the suggestion was commuting by bicycle, so replacing time sitting in a car or on a bus with time riding a bicycle * Cycling with good posture uses your glutes and increases (or at least requires) hip flexor and hamstring flexibility. Uses much of the core muscles in the back that many programmers have problems with. The stationary bikes pictured in one of your links don't look like they allow a proper cycling posture at all. They're set up for people that don't know how to ride a bike right so that they don't put too much weight on their hands. You might be right about 2 hours pedaling away on one of those. Definitely very anecdotal, but I work in an office with a decent percentage of bicycle commuters. The cyclists aren't the ones that keep having back problems. (it's the ones that don't exercise at all, or don't stick with exercise)

stiff 15y ago
You're prematurely optimizing. Someone asked for activities good for computer people. You didn't answer "any activity", but "cycling". Now when I say cycling is actually bad for many computer people, you say I'm prematurely optimizing? Because I try to answer the actual question meaningfully? Many programmers and other computer professionals sit inside at a desk all day and get no exercise. Almost anything at all that gets them moving is an improvement. It's not. If you do an activity with a certain pattern of impact on the body for 8+ hours a day, doing another activity with the same pattern for additional 2 hours a day yet with increased intensity has the potential to cause serious health problems and discourage people from activity in general. If you're about to choose a sport and do not so much care about what will it be, why not make a choice that will be the most beneficial health-wise? I think that's was the whole point of the question asked. Cycling with good posture uses your glutes and increases (or at least requires) hip flexor and hamstring flexibility. I don't know why do you mention flexibility here, the posture problems come not from flexibility issues but from the muscle tone of opposing muscle groups. It is also simply not true what you are saying, just think about the main function of the hip flexors - pulling the knee up, and the function of the glutes - rotating the pelvis; then think which of those two actions is more common in cycling and to which degree. The hip flexors get contracted all the time and thus shortened, not flexed. Uses much of the core muscles in the back that many programmers have problems with. It's exactly the same as with hip flexors, the bend-over posture tends to stress the erector spinae that is already very tight and contracted from all the sitting, and does nothing to work out the abdominals which are too weak. Post a better answer. If others agree it's better it'll get upvoted and go higher on the page. I do not feel an expert on the topic, I am not a member of the fitness stackexchange community, and this is a four month old post. If I was to answer the question, I would recommend classic swimming, because it is beneficial to the posture even if your technique isn't perfect. There are other good choices, but they require more guidance. Yoga is great, because it actually teaches you to locate and be aware of the various tensions in your body accumulated during the day and helps relax those. Wisely selected exercises in the gym or callisthenics are good as well, but a lot of people have those posture problems and muscular imbalances, and when working out on their own they might not have enough knowledge to address them by an appropriate workout on their own (apart from the fact that most people don't know how to squat or deadlift in a way that is not detrimental to health in the long run). That's why in this case hiring a good personal trainer might be a good investment if you have the money and are serious about improving your health.